There's a lot of talk among Detroiters and even in national and international news reports that Detroit is making a comeback.
Is there one construction job that has happen or a news announcement that makes you believe in the comeback?
Is there a building to be built or renovation that should happen that would convince you if you're not there yet?
Just asking you know what I have done.
I would guess that the first major project that occurs without tax incentives would mark the return of Detroit. Another sign would be a developer putting up on spec fifty or so McMansions on the east side.
Definitely home building in neighborhoods outside of downtown and midtown. If that happens it will signal that families are moving back in, not just us onesie twosies.
>90% occupancy
>$1.50/sq ft rentals downtown and >$1.20 midtown
~30% appreciation pa since 2012.....at least where I was looking :[[
If that's not a comeback, it certainly signifies more demand than only a few years ago
This.Quote:
Originally Posted by detroitsgwenivere
Has there been a nice uptick downtown? Absolutely. But new homes in the neighborhoods would mean the city of Detroit as a whole was growing again.
City Place Detroit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Strong
http://www.cityplacedetroit.com/
Complete renovation of a 320-unit apartment complex. Not downtown proper. The building has a waiting list longer than your arm. Non-local developer who owns in many different large towns; now looks at Detroit not as a charity case but a solid way to make money in a real estate investment [[and did, as a matter of fact).
There will be a "comeback" of sorts when significant numbers of people move to the city because it's a nice place to live, not because their boss told them to or because they could take advantage of an empowerment zone or other government program. For me, oversized swing sets, trendy restaurants and stadiums don't translate into a comeback but a few decades of slow progress without any major hiccups in the economy and a reversal of the population loss and anything is possible I guess. I'll also know Detroit is doing ok when people quit trying to sell me on a "comeback" every 15 seconds.
My friends in NYC no longer think I'm crazy for moving back to Detroit. Several have visited and would like to visit again.
When we moved to Detroit in 2009 The Kales had 8 apartments to show us that were available and we got a 11th floor 1200sqft place for $1000 a month, when we asked about breaking or lease early three years later, they we more than happy to help us. They had a waiting list 20 deep for two bedrooms and were going to charge the new renters 1500 a month. That's when I new it was starting. When you go down now and see all the construction, and they all have waiting lists once they start taking reservations, that's how you know it's in full swing.
There is definitely a comeback, heavily subsidized, in Midtown and Downtown. When there are good jobs available to all, vacant homes are replaced, it is safe to go to a gas station or to functional schools, the City will have made real progress.
Can You Name Something That Makes You Feel Detroit Is On A Comeback?
I no longer have to use The Club when I park my car @ night.
I can leave a pair of old gloves on the car seat, and they'll be there in the morning AND the passenger side window.
A For Sale building won't be stripped, gutted, and spray painted.
Owner of said building won't be fined $500 by the City for graffiti.
The police actually show up.
The City's major source of income won't be parking tickets and towing.
I can walk to the local pizza shop without being robbed @ gunpoint.
Somewhat subsidized, and the level of subsidy needed to lure people and jobs is shrinking. Agree on most of your points, but I will point out that a great deal of Detroit's unemployed are not readily employable, and that is the problem. Between lack of a functioning education [[many high school non-grads, some grads who still lack basic reading & math skills), lack of job history, and lack of skills to get a job, the number of unemployable Detroiters is into the 6 figures [[how many exactly I don't know; I bet no one actually knows). A gigantic new enterprise could open in Detroit and seek to hire Detroiters, but many of those people would not get hired. Everyone who is in that situation needs to be prodded by everyone they know to take advantage of an adult education program, and start working somewhere [[even as a volunteer) to get skills and learn professional responsibility. The problem with adults in that situation is that you can't externally impose a fix on them. You can offer opportunity and encouragement, but it is up to them to step up and do it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobl
Good comment!Quote:
Originally Posted by TTime
There will be a comeback when Detroit is growing again. Show me a population increase in the 2020 Census. Until then, it's hype.
Good schools, good police, safe neighborhoods. That's the main thing needed for more than pioneers to move in.
What impresses me most are the communities that are organizing, purchasing properties, and restoring them. Grandmont Rosedale Development is doing great things. Organizations such as Motor City Blight Busters, Brick and Beam and Preservation Detroit [[just to name a few) are people in the city working to make the city better... The "come back" is much further along than you may realize.
The dysfunctional and crooked school system called DPS would turn off any family considering moving to Detroit. The Yuppies are great, and have turned the ghost town known as downtown, into a promising area. Midtown is hot as well – except Spain elementary. Attracting families is not on the horizon; families will never move to Detroit – en masse – as long as the public schools are decrepit, crooked, and seem to hire their administrators right out of the parole office.
When my neighborhood actually looks like a neighborhood again.
Chicago Public Schools is not far behind. The difference is that they have many private and parochial school options for the yuppies who have kids.Quote:
Originally Posted by SDCC
When it doesnt cost $4000 a year to insure a $1000 hooptie
The path to good schools in Detroit does not lie in public schools, regardless of the money thrown at it. I think Michigan should use Detroit as a pilot all-choice city. Let all government money for K-12 education in Detroit follow the kids to whatever school will take them. Incorporate the current public schools that don't close as separate not-for-profits run by a board made up of parents and teachers. Since the schools are both terrible and broke, there is no downside. If it leads to better results for kids, expand it statewide.Quote:
Originally Posted by BankruptcyGuy
Foot traffic downtown, consistently expanding block by block everytime you see that.
Density-- the new construction alongside Lafayette Plaiscance [[even if poorly executed) is a big sign; the conversion of the Hammer-Nail building to residential is also a high-water mark for preservation of density and height.
Woodward from Grand to Jefferson is going to be a legitimate urban corridor that we can legitimiately hang our hat on. While that materializes, though, we need to actively turn to neighborhood restoration, an assault on the gangs that are imperiling regular hard working people in far NE and far W neighborhoods, and making out other corridors as booming as Woodward.
The plummeting cost of car insurance in Detroit over the past 2 years was what signaled progress in my mind. Maybe it's just the tenants moving downtown/midtown/burbs have better credit scores and everyone wins. Three years ago I was paying $1,200 for six months for full coverage on an SUV in the 48226. Now it's down to $560 for six months coverage on the same SUV. Comparable rates with the burbs. With Progressive.
Why send him? He could probably score a job there and you'd be drawing extra income for your household.Quote:
Originally Posted by SDCC
They don't seem to have a very high threshold as far as ethics or integrity is concerned, he might have a shot.Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
I have heard great things about Chrysler Elementary in Lafayette Park.Quote:
Originally Posted by SDCC
It scores an 8 out of 10 according to the following website
http://www.greatschools.org/michigan...entary-School/
In addition, there are several great high schools - Cass Tech, Renaissance, Detroit School of Arts, Communication & Media Arts
To the perpetual haters - Chicago48, Bham82, TTime
Nobody is saying the whole city or even most of the city is COMING BACK. My neighborhood, Warrendale, is still in slow decline. The vast majority of neighborhoods from Dexter-Davison to Brightmoor to Conant Gardens to Boynton to Old Redford are stagnant or falling still.
All of us cheerleaders are cognizant that it is just a SMALL part of the city that is coming back. Downtown, Midtown, Corktown, East Riverfront, the Villages. Neighborhoods like University District, Rosedale Park, East English Village are relatively steady.
All of us cheerleaders know that DPS is still terrible, that property tax rates are still high, that incidence of violent crime is still high and has not shown consistent decline. We can still be happy about the few areas that are growing. Nobody's trying to sell you on Highland Park's or Jefferson-Chalmer's renaissance, so please stop making it seem like people are trying to convince you that the majority of the city is getting better and that the population of the city is growing again and that its a great place for families.
"Can you name something that makes you feel Detroit is on a comeback?"
Construction cranes.
Renaissance High is a shining light - Star - in the city of Detroit. I'm not just speaking of the local or state level, I'm talking nationally. Renaissance is an excellent school, as is Cass Tech, however comparing the two schools side by side, Renaissance scores much higher [[almost double in some rankings) than Cass Tech. Cass Tech is another great school, but by far Renaissance is firmly in 1st place - Bravo.Quote:
Originally Posted by masterblaster
The majority of the other schools in DPS did not do so well, however, I would like to see clean, brightly lite classrooms, with sanitary bathrooms that are completely functional, in a building that has adequate supplies, and is safe and structurally sound, prior to me ranking, or criticizing any students.
Attachment 30174
Don't forget to add the U.S. Census Bureau, the Bureau of Labor Statistics, and the Bureau of Economic Analysis to your list of "perpetual haters". Any organization dealing in data and factual, nonpartisan narratives should also be added.Quote:
Originally Posted by masterblaster
Sorry I don't have an answer to the question.
That's not meant to be snarky or anything, but rather a realization that the answer has 'to knock your sock off' in magnitude.
Couple of things I think can rise to [[near) the bar I set:
1). Pistons move back to Detroit. As Bernie would say, "That would be [[h)uuuuuuuuuge". The Pistons would not move back unless Detroit is really 'back.'
2). Detroit and S.E. Michigan gets 1st class BRT which would, by transportation, would seamlessly integrate major parts of Detroit [[e.g., Michigan Ave., Gratiot, Woodward, etc.) with the suburbs. Think of the barriers [[think of Michigan Ave/Wyoming) built during the time of [[late) Mayor Orville Hubbard [[Dearborn) which would fall.
LOL. Detroit is "coming back" if a basketball team moves a few miles, and if a bus system is improved.
Yeah, that would do it. It wouldn't be actual data indicating the city has a growing population and economy.
Maybe if a Cheesecake Factory opens; that will seal the deal. Much more important then whether or not hundreds of thousands of people decide to make Detroit their home in the coming years.
Okay, the Second Coming occurs at the new arena.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bham1982
He descends through the roof, extends his arms, etc.
But you totally disregarded, per usual, the rest of his post that said the city isn't growing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bham1982
And you do disregard the real fact that Detroit's CBD-downtown, midtown, and New Center-is seeing development and work on a scale never before seen in our lifetime. Everything that came undone, density, an active downtown core, shops, the "unsafe" mindset, is being reassembled.
Are we New York? Chicago? Toronto? Hell no, but we are definitely not Detroit 1990-2008 and to me and most people that is progress and a "comeback", albeit small.
Building a streetcar, moving businesses downtown, adding residential units would never have thought possible in 1995.
People who can no longer afford to buy IN Indian Village, buying and rehabbing houses in nearby neighborhoods. New owners and significant renovations for riverfront apartment buildings on the east side. New stores and restaurants going in in the West Village, on Jefferson, and near the Riverwalk.
I had never heard of "Brick and Beam" but found their website quite interesting.Quote:
Originally Posted by MotorCityPaintCo.
http://www.brickandbeamdetroit.com/
Getting back to the discussion.
I'm not sure it is something that changes slowly over time, e.g., increased number of building permits issued in Detroit, or crime rate declining or high school graduation rates increasing.
It seems, to me, something that would make national TV news, e.g., a joint announcement that 1,000 multi-family housing units will break ground in a few months in Brush Park. Or somewhere else like the state fair grounds site.
Literally a new city within a city is being reborn.
It can't be 150 today. Two hundred six months from now. Two hundred again next year. Etc.
Something of that magnitude would indicate that at least in one part of the city that it is a 'new day' - out with the old, and in with a "New Detroit".
I can guarantee, I think, that if the mayor announced 1,000 new housing units in Brush Park would break ground in three months it would be on the evening news [[national).
"A Brand New Neighborhood is Coming to an Old Neighborhood in Detroit: A "New City" Within the City of Detroit."
It would mention the thousands of 'new' residents, the new arena, the new QLine, the revitalized downtown, maybe even Belle Island, etc. etc. "A 'New Day' in Midtown Detroit. Will this lead to more neighborhoods having their "new" day?"
Hater? Ha, I'm just your definitely necessary reality check. First off, I don't agree with your list of steady areas at all but to generalize, this town has some great qualities and in time it will hopefully be a nice place to live. My problem occurs when idiots constantly blow the city over things that should be expected or if they inflate the truth I'm going to call BS...plain and simple. This town has a long, long way to go and I don't think back patting of any kind is warranted. I also have to point out that while many think this race to improve is simply a competition against our very recent past, we are also in competition with every other city in the U.S. and unfortunately for us they are improving at a faster pace...just one man's opinion and if you truly think you are doing great things it shouldn't bother you in the least.Quote:
Originally Posted by masterblaster
How do you figure this?Quote:
Originally Posted by dtowncitylover
During the 1970's-80's, downtown got a 7 tower complex, including a luxury shopping mall, the tallest hotel in the world, and six office towers. Detroit completely rebuilt the two main shopping corridors, and added a new mall and department store in New Center. Oh, and an elevated rail system alongside a street-running trolley.
During the 1980's-90's, downtown got multiple trophy office buildings [[including one by Hines, the gold standard in higher end commercial space) a shopping mall in Greektown, three highrise residentials, multiple new hotels, and two huge riverfront developments along Jefferson.
During the 1990's-00's downtown got two new HQ buildings, three massive casinos, two new stadia, renovated its largest abandoned tower to a luxury hotel, major expansion at Wayne State.
You can have stuff get built and still struggle. A city as big as Detroit will have development, even if the overall narrative is decline. "But stuff is being built" isn't really a reasonable response to whether or not the city is still declining. Stuff is always being built, whether cities are growing or shrinking.
I expect a few Millenials to contest this post because nothing of note has ever happened unless they had something to do with it but I'm glad you posted this. You can't imagine how new Detroiters I encounter constantly tell me how nothing happened in Detroit til they showed up. At that point I ask them if they hung out in the city until recently and the answer is usually,"no why would I there was no reason." .... I laugh and walk away.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bham1982
Things that I do not think you need to have to say Detroit is on an upswing:
1) Overall population growth
2) Families with children moving in
3) Decent schools
These would be great, but in my view, the city has been improving steadily over the past 5 years without any of those things, and it could probably go another 15 without any of them, although I suspect that if things continue to improve for that long that population will probably bottom out by then.
Things I think are indicators of an upswing now:
1) Large-scale reuse of previously empty buildings/lots in greater Downtown.
2) Rising quantity of higher-end retail and dining.
3) More jobs downtown.
4) Declining subsidy levels for construction/renovation.
5) Expansion of areas where new market-rate housing is being created.
Things I think will be the next indications of a continued upswing:
1) Major construction with conventional financing [[but there will probably be tax abatements for a long time).
2) Rising average incomes in the city.
3) Rising city tax collections.
4) Substantially increased housing production in greater Downtown.
Time for an anecdote!
A friend of my brother's, originally from Detroit, now splits his time between NYC and Toronto. He hadn't been back to Detroit for 5-10 years, but was in town a few weeks ago. My brother took him on a bit of a tour, and his friend was quite surprised at the improvements. Not because Detroit now rivals New York or Toronto, but because it is so much ahead of where it was last time he was in town.
Note that none of this is intended to say that what is happening now is good enough. It isn't, and there is vast evidence that Detroit isn't doing well by a large proportion of its residents. There are significant problems that may not be overcome. But it is better than it was, and hopefully it will continue to improve.
And here is my post destroying your rebuttal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bham1982
The luxury shopping mall failed within 10 years of opening because the downturn was already happening. And we all know the Rennaissance Center did nothing to improve the older urban core of downtown, it was a failure. But now we have Moosejaw, John Varvatos, Kit + Ace, Nike all opening up during an upswing in development and growth in downtown Detroit. Plus new shopping districts like Midtown with Shinola being the anchor.
Trapper's Alley was hardly a shopping mall comparable to Northland, Oakland, or Somerset. It was a gimmick.
The People Mover failed and the Washington Boulevard you keep mentioning probably to piss me off was not in any sense of the imagination an attempt to true mass transit, it was a heritage trolley line for tourists, so stop f---ing mentioning it.
No I don't think you keep building stuff if you are struggling. Remember John Madden lost all his money building 150 W. Jefferson. One Detroit Center was supposed to be two towers. A billionaire doesn't build a new wing on his mansion while becoming a pauper. And despite having these new buildings, downtown was still a dead zone, even during the day. You cannot say the same about today.
I would say the renovation of the Book Cadillac was the catalyst of what has happened today.
We all know stadiums and casinos don't do much for a city looking to revamp things, and they really didn't. But that's not what I'm talking about. I'm taking about the fact that is seems that Metro Detroit finally gets that if it wants to survive, a healthy urban core with a vibrant business, social, culture, and transportation life is key. And that is what is beginning to happen.
that was some tame destruction and you don't know what the future holds.Quote:
Originally Posted by dtowncitylover
First off, props to the defenders. Also, I appreciate the post of those that can be bold without being too mired in technicality; so, take a tip from Master & Honky [[doesn't sound right-maybe because it sounds like "Master & Commander") for keeping it personal and observant.
What strikes me is how some portioned out neighborhoods persevere quite well. The Cheyenne Littlefield MacKenzie area or around U of D or Marygrove are fine examples [[I think that there is even an area of Warwick, perhaps?-as you go south towards Warrendale. That has it's own preservation club.). It's a shame though, that they have to be so sectioned off and the change in quality so stark from the obvious outlying areas. Now if places like Indian Village, Rosedale Park/Grandmont, and Mexicantown can claim and hold on to it's own preservation....
Look at Brightmoor. That used to be the armpit of the Westside Detroit area in 80's and 90's [[I should know, not only did I know some girls from there.... I had a schoolmate I bought grass off of from that area, and he might as well have been elected Ombudsman. The stories I could tell y'all of that dude...), and now it's sprung back in its own rustic, earthy, roll-up-your-sleeves DIY kind of way that really surprises me. If Highland Park can make a few improvements....there you go.
Granted, as someone pointed out, art, bike lanes, and overpriced hipster eateries are not really boosting things for us, but even the smallest little practical things [[okay like maybe the bike lanes) can make a beautiful difference by those willing to endure the friction, hassle, and uncertainty of it all. Take those guys behind "Sit On It Detroit" for example.
All I know is when I drive past someone in Dearborn and wave at them, I get nothing but a puzzled, misery-loving scowl. When I do the same in Detroit, folks immediately smile and wave without a hesitation. That is the attitude that starts from within to look at things a better way in the face of acknowledging all the adversity, bring out better things from within you, and keep the blight from setting in, the gentrification from undermining us, or the "creeping meatball-ism" from the East from seeping in and turning everyone into selfishly absorbed, numb, conformo, gizmo-gawkers.
...all that, and it would be nice to see a Kroger or 7-11 open up somewhere in the city limits [[thank you Meijer's for not being too afraid on that).
My auto insurance dropped 55% two years ago. I'm now paying $1600 a year for full coverage, with $500 deductibles, on a new car in the 48207.Quote:
Originally Posted by gnome
What amazes me about Detroit's "comeback" is that Duggan has not been charged with corruption by the feds. Yet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BankruptcyGuy
Yep this is my building. SO much better than when I first moved here in 2013. A Canadian group came through and sunk 10 mil into the building, gutted out every unit and renovated the whole building including adding a bunch of amenities.
All they offer are 1 bedrooms? What's parking like, is it enclosed or an open lot?Quote:
Originally Posted by Detroit Stylin
Do you mean when these things become a reality or is it where you live!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
And when we really get a hold on the violence and high crime in the neighborhoods, which have increasingly involved children!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bham1982
Nice to hear from you G. Good point. There was deadly crash on the Lodge recently were the drivers and occupants fled the scene fearing possibly the citations for no insurance, license etc. There are many people driving dirty [[no insurance) in the D.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gnome
Yes, midtown, downtown etc., nice. Got that, but this does not help life in the 'hood' where the remaining population strives. We still have strong, viable areas, but many neighborhoods, east and west continue to decline and are becoming enclaves of 'police don't go there' crime. Seven mile for example is rough, relative to violence and car jackings [[especially at the gas stations) from the far east to west!
Quote:
Originally Posted by masterblaster
Hah. Weee, and bully on that. Duggan knows he best be cool. He'd never get the pass KK received all time that he did!
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3WC
When they become a reality, Zacha341. I, supposedly, live in one of the nicer Detroit areas.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zacha341
How about when the city doesn't have multiple days where there are 3 or 4 homicides in a single day? No normal, tax paying, law abiding citizen will want to live anywhere near that kind of bullshit.
I guess this wasn't really shocking to see especially if you visit other cities regularly. http://www.detroitnews.com/story/new...s-us/83580252/
The question was "is Detroit on a comeback?". Those select areas [[downtown, midtown, Corktown, East Riverfront) are ON AN UPWARD TRAJECTORY. Just because there are less businesses within 3 miles of downtown compared to other cities does not negate the fact that those aforementioned areas are seeing population growth, renewed vibrancy, and investment.Quote:
Originally Posted by TTime
Again, why are you such a hater?
There are 2 major differences between the development in downtown that has happened in the last 10 years and the development in the time period of the 1970's to early 2000's.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bham1982
1. Yes, there was a decent amount of new development from the '70s to '00s [[Ren Cen, Trolley Plaza), BUT DURING THAT SAME PERIOD A LARGE NUMBER OF buildings WENT DARK - Hotel Tuller, Hotel Statler, Lafayette Building, Hudson's Building, Broderick Building, Whitney Building, Metropolitan Building, Wurlitzter Building, the now demolished 21-story building that was next to the Cadillac Tower, the Monroe Block, the Theaters - Michigan, United Artists, National, Madison, Adams, etc, etc. etc. During the past 10 years, however, only the Book Tower has WENT DARK, and that building has now been purchased by Gilbert for a likely residential conversion.
2. Downtown's resurgence in the past 10 years is more focused on bringing new residents downtown, while in the previous years it was just about getting office workers and pro sports fans downtown.
Ha to answer your question again, I am not a hater. I am simply providing a reality check. Why does the truth bother you so much? Ignore it if you choose, it's that simple but the original question is a loaded one and that article was in the paper this morning and I thought it was relevant because it provided direct evidence to show that the city may not be in a comeback at all. Here go ahead and get even more mad about this article too if you like....http://www.freep.com/story/news/loca...rate/83395596/ ....also in the paper this morning.Quote:
Originally Posted by masterblaster
Again, the question at hand is about trends, not absolute comparisons to other cities. Knowing where Detroit stands in this ranking in one given year provides zero "direct evidence" that the city is moving in any direction at all. You can't have a trend without at least two data points and so far you've provided one.Quote:
Originally Posted by TTime
masterblaster was pretty clear in his claims - certain areas around downtown are on an upward trajectory. No one here is arguing that Detroit is not poorer or less filled with retail than other cities in the US. But do you think that the same map, if made in 2010, would have had more red dots than it does today?
The question was can you name something that makes you feel Detroit is on a comeback. I think the evidence is there that it is not and articles like the ones I included support that claim. If the Tigers finished every season in last place would you buy into a marketing campaign that told you to buy tickets for next season because hey they may have finished in last place baby but the short stop improved his batting average so get on board with your comeback Tigers!Quote:
Originally Posted by Junjie
I think this article suggests a theme of hope and optimism that Detroit has turned the corner...
http://www.detroitnews.com/story/bus...owes/83629818/
Posted in another thread but I think it's more appropriate here.
https://detroit.curbed.com/2017/8/31...n-mansion-sold
Quote:
1885 Brush Park Victorian mansion, now rental property, sells for $2.65M
The previous owners had bought the house for $275,000 in 2011, then renovated it. More interior renovation photos can be seen here.
Late last year, another grand mansion in Brush Park garnered over $2 million. The Inn at 97 Winder, which had been for sale for years, sold for $2.4 million and has since reopened under new ownership.
In addition to the Crosswinds condos demanding $250/sqft and 50% of City Modern already sold for >$300/sqft, I think Brush Park is slowly retuning to it's former glory of being a very exclusive inner city neighborhood.
downtown seems to be doing fine. They are going to connect midtown and downtown. Something i expected to happen
i haven't been able to find accurate crime stats in some time
Before too long. Assuming the economy doesn't tank. Some well placed areas should see a lot of new development.
People younger than 50 have never known a time when Detroit wasn't "coming back."
In the entire "Amazon" thread, people give their reasons why Detroit may or may not win, but there is not a single "Ha!Ha! Not A Chance" among them. Imagine that 10 years ago.
I think not only DETROIT isn't coming back, the USA is still in trouble
America has roughly 326.5 Million citizens - 40 Million are on Food Stamps
https://assets.weforum.org/editor/QZ...X_1hQQOmps.PNG
What do food stamps have to do with whether or not the U.S. is "in trouble"? Wouldn't the U.S. be more "in trouble" if there were fewer or no such benefits?Quote:
Originally Posted by O3H
Mexico has no food stamps; guess they're doing fine. The Scandinavian countries go far above the U.S. in terms of food benefits; guess they're struggling.
To have so many people dependent on some form of government assistance to make ends meet [[versus being able to support themselves) certainly isn't something to brag about.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bham1982
People on Food Stamps are NOT going to pro sporting events, buying $500- $1,000 dollar bikes, watches, etc. and they certainly are not dropping $100 at that new local restaurant for drinks and nibbles.
Wake up and read about the Reality of Detroit - not the hype, glitz, spin.
Detroit won't come back until the middle class rebounds with expendable income to spend on the "other" stuff not necessary for day-to-day living
Does anyone really think, the Suburbs are now going to take care of, Detroit in some economic manner via frivolous spending and recreation ?
The kids at Wayne State University are working, to pay tuition, food, clothes, etc. and don't have massive amounts of expendable income.
Who is buying all the STUFF, and how repetitive are those sales ?
IF there is no game/event bringing folks downtown = the dollars = $0.00
With an eye towards our history, one of the things that has irked me about Detroit is that it has had a bad case of ADHD.
It has not been able to stay focused.
Cool Hub-and-Spoke street scape. Oops.
Downtown is looking cool; let's build a new one and call it New Center!
Neat neighborhood named after some famous horses; let's put up some shacks next door.
Riverfront? Who needs that thing. Let's put up buildings with no windows so no one can see that wet area.
Finally, at long last there seems to be someone with focus and the ability to know that the Hindu prayer, "Go from strength to strength " means to build where there is success and then build right next to it.
Does that mean 7 and Kelly are going to keep sucking?
Yeppers.
Great advice.Quote:
Originally Posted by gnome
Isn't that how the Wayne State area got better? Just keep getting better block by block.
EXCEPT the fact the university kids are not buying a ton of stuff, or dropping coin at the restaurants, etc., etc. Yeah its nice, but it is not driving the economy of the D