Does anyone have knowledge of these renovated properties?
I am looking for a second home to spend the summers. Have safety issues been addressed? And are the buildings older white boy friendly? Used to be a great neighborhood in the 70's.
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Does anyone have knowledge of these renovated properties?
I am looking for a second home to spend the summers. Have safety issues been addressed? And are the buildings older white boy friendly? Used to be a great neighborhood in the 70's.
NO! Palmer Park has been change in the last 100 years went from a French, Scottish, Greek, Polish German, Finnish mixed community to a fast growing Orthodox and Hasidic Jewish community to a quick black community. Then crackheads, prostitutes, homosexuals and squatters came and made a ruckus of that area. Today private companies are rehabing some of the apartments and made it non-subsidized to control property values. Those who work and have excellent credit points will be able to live those rehabed apts.
The "homosexuals" made a ruckus of that area? Sorry Danny, if the gays had not found it necessary to flee the area, the current rehabbing would not be necessary. All of that would have been done decades ago and Palmer Park would have remained a thriving gem of a neighborhood.Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny
When you get folks like those moving into your neighborhood other straight and clean middle class folks move out driving down property values creating mayhem. I grew up near Palmer Park, My cousins used to live there. We saw all the mess coming into the area And my family quickly move away over 20 years ago. Til that day I haven't returned. I wouldn't put to two shoes in that area until the ruckus and yahoos are out.Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast
If you think gay residents drive DOWN property values you are sorely mistaken. Sometimes ignorant bigots might move out, but that is an improvement. Hmmm.... your family moved out....Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny
Anyone have any insight on the original poster's questions? I never lived in that area, but it was a great place for a long time and could be again. I am very happy to hear about rehabilitation efforts. The neighborhood certainly has a building stock unlike any other in the City of Detroit. But everyone I knew who once lived in that area have been gone from there for so long that I no longer have any knowledge of current conditions in the neighborhood [[and some of them were, yes Danny, scary homosexuals, who have since gone on to be terrifying middle-class homeowners in the ghettos of Indian Village, Royal Oak, suburban Boston, Adams Morgan in DC, and other gay-ruined places in the U.S.).
As I recall from the earlier threads, Shelborne Development itself is rehabbing something like nine buildings. Quite an ambitious undertaking. I certainly hope this area can rebound and become a welcoming, diverse community. I'd also be curious about the original poster's question.
Danny was a bit misinformed most of the rehabs are subsidized. The only way the developer could get financing. For me there are 3 buildings I would consider. 1001 Covington has 16 units and the apartments only share one common wall. The building is in very good condition. And of course its an Albert Kahn design.
Walbri Court Apartments 1001 Covington built in 1925 Palmer Park Aprtment Building Historic District Detroit, MI.
The Paul Tilds designed Covington Arms 333 Covington built in 1952 Palmer Park Apartment Historic District. Another building with the apartments sharing a couple common walls.
Last the Paul Tilds designed Manor House 660 Whitmore built in 1949 Palmer Park Apartment Historic Distrcit Detroit, MI. The building has underground parking for the residents.
All three buildings have never been abandoned and are in very good shape.
Fro what it is worth:
Crime Mapping Detroit
http://www.crimemapping.com/map.aspx...7-17f60e517d9d
You're fuckin kidding right?Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny
Homophobia is so widespread and irrational in Detroit that some people would rather live in squalor than next to gay people. I live on the lower east side in a predominately low-income high rise and I heard people in the lobby talking about how they would never go back to the apartments in Palmer Woods because of the "gays."
When I lived in Saginaw, a group of gay guys bought up historic homes and cleaned up the area.
That building layout looks fantastic. The units must be huge? Like the row of windows spanning across that wide must make for some kind of view and lighting. I'd like to tour some of these wonderful structures...
Quote:
Originally Posted by p69rrh51
"Straight flight"?Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny
Needs a developer with deep pockets and some vision. Its a neat area with architectural character & should be a priority for redevelopment. Could use a big fence encircling it and private security. All the empty buildings need to be sealed up and made to look acceptable from the outside until they are restored. People with no business should be denied access. Make it nice and safe, make safety a selling point and I bet people of means, students and professionals would return. Little parks and gardens, good lighting. A pavilion for cookouts, block parties and picnics. A little cafe/coffee shop, maybe a market with fresh vegetables and a deli. Could be a high population density area
http://modeldmedia.com/devnews/lavog...oit051512.aspx It was a year ago that Model D highlighted the La Vogue. The article mentions a mix of affordable and market-rate. I'd be curious about the ratio.
Is this thread a joke? Out of curiosity I purposely drove through this very area last night on way to parents home in Birmingham. Between 2-3 a.m. I saw prostitution, hand to hand, many sketchy “characters” walking the area, and numerous abandoned apartment buildings right next to these “prime” pieces of real estate. Don’t forget the Déjà Vu on the corner that had roughly 8 Wayne/Detroit [[?) police cruisers blocking a street off for whatever reason. Did I mention most of the street lights were off? This area is at least 10 years away from being a viable living option for anyone that values their life – and that’s only if Midtown prospers at a rapid rate, which is far from guaranteed*.
*Palmer Park is almost 4 miles away from Midtown, i.e. that's a lot of expansion needed before you convince college educated young people to live in these apts
No, this thread is not a joke. I have not been through the area in years, but hope to take a gander at it this year if I'm in the area. There may still be major problems in the area, but at a minimum 9 or so major buildings currently undergoing or soon to undergo high quality renovations might at least mean that the area has bottomed out and is on the rebound. That does not mean that the area is already safe and stable.
Quote:
Originally Posted by m b v
Funny you mentioned joke... it begs the question... what were you doing in this area at 7 Mile & Woodward at 2AM?? :eek:
And also... isn't it a bit difficult to spot development in the middle of the night with the streetlights out??
And how did you get presumptuous enough to assume that the only development that Detroit can get is if it eminates from Downtown/Midtown??
You do know that Palmer Woods/Sherwood Forest are adjacent to this area... and both of those prosperous areas are still well tended to and lived in? Certainly redeveloping this area doesn't require Midtown??
And the idea that any developments of Midtown would have to go thru New Center, New Center Commons/Piety Hill, Boston Edison... AND Highland Park before it ever would spread northwards to these apartments... where did you get that idea from? Certainly not from this forum?? :confused:
Having spent time every couple months taking images of the buildings I have seen a dramatic change in the area. Also talking last fall with many residents of the area I was mildly surprised to find quite a few long time residents in most of the functioning buildings. Many of the undamaged buildings have few available apartments. All of residents I spoke with would not move from their homes. I wanted to post the realtor.com listing for The Covington Arms but it was already gone, and the listing was only a few weeks old. Yes the crime is there but then just a few blocks from my home in Grosse Pointe are similar "sketchy characters" m.b.v. is so paranoid about. When its all said and done PP is not perfect but its far better than it was even a year ago. Also a 30 second drive by will never give one an idea of what is really happening there. You need to get out and actually look at what is going on.Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast
I'm pretty sure mbv is the person who didn't want to go to the Somerset Collection because of the crime and sketchy characters. By that standard, I agree Palmer Park is not an acceptable location.
By the standards of a Detroit neighborhood, my impression is that it isn't particularly bad, but although I considered buying a condo at 1001 Covington, I didn't do it and I don't live there, so although I check it out periodically I don't have any real knowledge of what it feels like to live there. Riding through on a bike doesn't feel all that dangerous in the daytime. I don't much like riding in the dark in the city, or anyplace else really, so I haven't tried it.
I've been through that neighborhood on my bike quite a few times, but this was back in the mid-2000s, not recently. I felt pretty safe. On one occasion, the ice cream truck came by and I was surprised to see that they sold soft ice cream cones [[like the kind you get at the Dairy Queen) and not just the usual popsickles and snow cones and such. I bought myself a cone and stopped to eat it. There were a lot of people around, but nobody bothered me. However, this was in the daytime and this was before many of those apartment buildings became abandoned.
Danny seems to protest a bit too much, focusing on one area. You can leave, but you can't hide from your true self! [[waves arm, snapping fingers behind the shoulder.)
On to the question at hand... Like most places, you'll want to watch your back. But there are a lot of great things happening in the area. Friends of Palmer Park really have been making a difference!
Last year a young lady got into with her friends on the way back to Oak Park. She got out of the car @ 6 mile & Woodward and never made it to 7 mile & Woodward. This was during the wee hours of the morning. A transgender Prostitute found her body in a vacant apartment building in the area.
Sounds like that uninformed lady and m v b should have had more smarts than going into certain parts of Detroit at night. The more well informed folks on DYes already know how bad things can get with an understaffed Police Force...Quote:
Originally Posted by Casual
http://www.detroitnews.com/article/9...AL01/120606001
There have been several posts regarding the "understaffed" DPD, citing figures to back-up the claim they really aren't. I'm becoming a bit skeptical of that claim. Either way, my sympathies and condolences to the family of the deceased. Oh, and her friends really SUCK!Quote:
Originally Posted by Gistok
My family move out of the Palmer Park, Sherwood Forrest, Martin Park, Pilgrim Village area not because of homosexuals and squatters, It was a plague of DEAD [[C)KRAK HEADS from Highland Park and other yahoos. They are the ones who drove property values down and left other apts. into crud. Now since private investors trying to buy every last apts. in Palmer Park. They will make sure that each tenent should have good credit points before the move in. They would kept property values up.Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast
DOTWS - forgive me but do I remember correctly that you lived - or spent some time- in PP during the early to mid 1980s? I seem to remember that you said our Mayor at the time more or less pulled the cops out of the area thereby forcing an exodus of gay men into Royal Oak and eventually Ferndale.Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast
is my memory correct or have the mists of time rendered my memory fogalious?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaybiz
I am not being misinformed about anything that goes on the Palmer Park or the ghettoes on Detroit, becuase I grew up in the ghettoes ever since I was a baby. I was taught by parents, friends and relatives what streets should I go and what street should I stay out. So far I haven't been back to Palmer Park since 1990. It has gotten bery worse since the crackheads from Highand Park took over, middle class folks move out and the yahoos move in. I wouldn't try to go in that area in middle of the night. Less you carry a gun and knife. When the sun comes out. Everyone will continue to work and play in Palmer Park like their own businesses. Most of the apartments are fine and others are squatter's den. Most of the apartments are being rehabbed to lure middle income folks, not welfare folks! Those are the people who chase out the middle class young professions out of Palmer Park since the early 1980s. Whe I was a kid grewing up near Palmer Park it was deemed quite safe. Fewer homosexuals are moving in and since Temple Israel moved to Bloomfield Hills, MI. All the Orthodox Jews quickly moved away. It was the last synagogue in Northwest Detroit. I glad that Palmer Park Apts are being rehabbed. but until the yahoos are moved out. Those Apts. will get a fewer young professionals.
That was not me, but someone else. I used to live in West VillageQuote:
Originally Posted by gnome
OK Gnome... I have to call timeout... I just Googled "fogalious"... and it only gave me 1 hit.... :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by gnome
https://www.google.com/webhp?sourcei...w=1024&bih=679
I think you need to ratify the situation and stop sounding like Leo Gorcey?? ;)
looking at that interactive map nowhere looks especially safe. Maybe Palmer Woods. Nearly 40 shootings on McNichols since they started keeping track. Thats only taking into account when someone was injured or killed.
I visited an apartment in Palmer Park [[I've been looking frantically for short-term leases that are in moderate condition) and it seemed quite nice. Admittedly, it was during the day. Still, the apartment [[Covington Terrace) was very nice inside, the park looked pretty clean, all the other apartments on Covington looked well-tended, and there were plenty of people milling about [[walking dogs, strolling with kids). I'm a white woman and I don't think I'd struggle too much there.
The only thing I'm worried about, heh, is that I'm quite tall, so just hoping they never suspect me of being one of the "walkers". I actually DID see a transwoman walking by, and she might have been a prostitute [[though she was dressed fairly normally), but if that's the only real crime in that area, I guess I'd find that to be better than most of the areas I toured. It's quite incredible how tiny the geographical gaps between the worst and nicest neighborhoods.
Looks like I invented a new word, I ain't no Dead End kid. Youzknowz dats tru.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gistok
Sorry about the misremembering.Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast
No problem. As I recall, it was someone who no longer lives in the area.Quote:
Originally Posted by gnome
Great to hear that PPark is making a come back. I'd be concerned about car theft, but that might be respective to certain cars and a couple of the buildings have underground parking. I would not do much walk 'south' of Six Mile... off of Woodward, Second or Third. That are is clearly outside of much 'development' with a couple of streets sporting a burnt out or boarded up house - every other house nearly. Not walkable there....
Quote:
Originally Posted by mwilbert
I was in PP today a couple of the rehabs are moving along nicely.
Thanks for those pics! As someone who is not in the area, I am especially appreciative of anyone posting pics. Its nice to see historically accurate windows being used. That makes a HUGE difference in how the rehabbed buildings look. The building in the last pic looks so clean - do you know if they power washed it?
Thanks for the pics p69rrh51... it's amazing how much better they look in the daytime... ;)
Nice article on the improvement of Palmer Park and the apartment district.
http://www.modeldmedia.com/features/...park12814.aspx
Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast
I and my cousins used to live in that area 20 years ago. When gays, lesbians crackheads from Highland Park move Palmer Park Apartment complexes. Young professionals move out and property values drop and most apt. complexes left abandon fit for squatting and drug dealing. Thanks to private companies rehabbing the area. They will let those who have a decent income and good credit into their complexes, even if those complexes are subsidized. Mike Duggan [[ when he was Wayne County Prosecutor at that time) sought the plight of Palmer Park, He clean up the drug dealers and squatters and brought in private companies for restoration of those apt complexes. Yes ignorant people who don't like homosexuals will move out. But for those who trash Palmer Park will cause people to move out and property values to drop. It's all part of human nature.
The article does not say which buildings are finished and occupied, or which are the ones being completed now with people about to move in. Does anyone happen to know? Or know anyone who has moved in?
I realize that the La Vogue was the first one that they rehabbed.
Next time I'm in Detroit a drive through this area will be one of my priorities.
Looks to be the Palmer Lodge, Madrid Court and the Seville as the 3 coming online in the next month...
http://www.shelbornedevelopment.com/...-Projects.html
A rehabbed Palmer Lodge will have a nice impact on WoodwardQuote:
Originally Posted by middetres
Before you make the big decision to move down there, check out how much you're going to pay for automobile insurance. I'll bet you'll be in for a surprise - and not in a good way.
I don't think the high car insurance rates in the city are a surprise to anyone here.Quote:
Originally Posted by softailrider
Of course they aren't if you already live in the city. If you're moving in from someplace else it usually becomes a big issue.Quote:
Originally Posted by Khorasaurus
^^^ Incredibly so! We are paying a high rate in Michigan. Triple that for Detroit! And the price jumps up more depending on what kind of car you own in Detroit.
Certainly, but even people who live in the suburbs know about the price of car insurance in the city. It's becoming an issue in state-level politics.Quote:
Originally Posted by softailrider
This isn't aimed at you specifically, but I get frustrated when a topic gets going here [[especially a positive one), and someone feels the need to chime in with "don't forget that the schools still suck/there's crime/car insurance is high/the city is bankrupt/etc." We all know that stuff or we wouldn't participate here.
Again, that isn't aimed at you or anyone else personally. Just something that gets on my nerves in general.
The "La Vogue" reno is fantastic. Great quality work. I'm hoping that they are able to keep this level of quality up. There are a lot of reasons why this neighbourhood should come back.
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