Great New for the D. Ford Profits Soar

It is a hard cold fact that if our local auto-makers suffer we all suffer. So it is refreshing and encouraging to read number like this. Greatly improved numbers are coming from GM and Chrysler too. This will ripple across our economies on both sides of the straits. It has been a long hard journey to this point, so let's enjoy the moment. [clink]

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Ford reported strong fourth-quarter earnings today in closing out the automaker’s most profitable year since 1998.

The automaker had a net income of $13.6 billion or $3.40 a share in its 11th consecutive quarterly profit - far exceeding the final months of 2010 when earnings fell 79% to $190 million. But operating profit for the quarter was $1.1 billion or 20 cents a share, a decrease of $189 million on sales of 1.4 billion vehicles.

“The quarter was driven by North America,” said Chief Financial Officer Lewis Booth, the only region not affected by deteriorating environmental conditions.

This year’s final months were hampered by flooding in Thailand, the continuing economic crisis in Europe and additional labor costs associated with the new United Auto Workers contract negotiated last fall.

Link to full Freep Article

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After they took their company to the brink with dumb decisions, scared the people, broke the union, took givebacks, made workers accept shittier pay and packages, and now they're running away with the money. And we're supposed to feel good that they're making profits? I'm surprised by that sentiment. It's been a LONG time since what was good for GM was good for America. You should know better...

Super news IMO. The Ford Fusion at the auto show was an incredible car - I may consider one when I pay off my Malibu. It's great news for Detroit and Michigan also. My own brother received a call about a job in the Ann Arbor area and it's possible he may be moving here from out of state. That would not have happened four years ago.

Hey Detroitnerd, how would pay be if these companies went out of business? IMO, ZERO money is worse than a little bit less than what people were making before. We were all [[and probably still are) living beyond our means. Unions are also guilty for the lack of health of the auto companies. I'm not letting the Big 3 off the hook mind you, and correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you are blaming them for all of the trouble. I'm glad that Ford made a profit. That is great. BUT, the profits that were reported to wall street were due to accounting adjustments. I believe their actual profit was actually around 1 billion for the past quarter. Nothing to sneeze at but the headline on the Freep and Detnews websites is a bit misleading.

Great news for us and our country.

Let's celebrate quickly and then start working on diversifying our economy so that when this happens again it will not be as painful.

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Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

After they took their company to the brink with dumb decisions, scared the people, broke the union, took givebacks, made workers accept shittier pay and packages, and now they're running away with the money. And we're supposed to feel good that they're making profits? I'm surprised by that sentiment. It's been a LONG time since what was good for GM was good for America. You should know better...

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Consider the alternative. If had been reporting that Ford had gone bankrupt, was liquidating its assets and firing all its workers, would you be happier?

I well know there had been some bitter pills to swallow for the workers, while Mulally has been showered with gold, but at least they have lived to fight another day. It is another cold, hard fact that in a capitalist economy 'big dogs eat first' and if they don't there is no chance for any left over scraps. Ford making huge profits = more scraps for the rest.

I would like another world of sharing, maybe you too, but until then for the good and well-being of tens of thousands of metro Detroit-Windsor citizens this is good news.

"If had been reporting that Ford had gone bankrupt, was liquidating its assets and firing all its workers, would you be happier?"

If we think it's bad around here now, the whole region would be up in flames right now if the auto industry went belly up.

Sad but true. Hopefully, this time around we finally learn from our mistake/s.

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Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

After they took their company to the brink with dumb decisions, scared the people, broke the union, took givebacks, made workers accept shittier pay and packages, and now they're running away with the money. And we're supposed to feel good that they're making profits? I'm surprised by that sentiment. It's been a LONG time since what was good for GM was good for America. You should know better...

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Hmm I guess the $6200 profit sharing checks aren't worth a damn?

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Originally Posted by Lowell

Consider the alternative. If had been reporting that Ford had gone bankrupt, was liquidating its assets and firing all its workers, would you be happier?

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No, DNerd wouldn't, I suspect. Nor did he say anything to suggest he would.

Your original post didn't say "at least Ford's not bankrupt"--it said something quite different, that the big profits from the last quarter will spread benefits around the city and the region. This is a debatable point. DNerd pointed out that the profits are at least largely dependent on the lower wages and benefits in the new bargaining agreements. So who will see the benefits of these profits?

Maybe I dont understand all of this..politic, corporate money issue. If the Big Three is making billions in profit, are they able to donate a billion each to the struggling neighborhoods around there headquarter's. I feel its not a profit to me, Im not benefiting from it. These big corporate company can do more for the community. I could be wrong...?

The company I work for supplies Vehicle development tools. While we supply tools to all the auto manufacturers, Our biggest customer is Ford. We build these tools here in SE michigan and supply them to manufacturers worldwide. We had the second best year in our companies history last year. I received a substantial bonus due to orders we received from Ford and the other manufacturers.

We're projecting this year will surpass our best year, If the orders we are quoting are closed at anywhere near at last years rate. We have several new products in develpment that should increase our business with all of the manufacturers.

Hopefully all of the automakers, domestic and foreign, continue to improve so I can continue a career I love.

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Originally Posted by dmike76

Hey Detroitnerd, how would pay be if these companies went out of business? IMO, ZERO money is worse than a little bit less than what people were making before. We were all [[and probably still are) living beyond our means. Unions are also guilty for the lack of health of the auto companies. I'm not letting the Big 3 off the hook mind you, and correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you are blaming them for all of the trouble. I'm glad that Ford made a profit. That is great. BUT, the profits that were reported to wall street were due to accounting adjustments. I believe their actual profit was actually around 1 billion for the past quarter. Nothing to sneeze at but the headline on the Freep and Detnews websites is a bit misleading.

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Hey, that's increasingly the choice for beaten-down American workers. Don't like the shitty pay and shitty packages? How about if we offshore that TOO? And we're supposed to be all grateful and get on our knees and THANK these people for the way they've run American industry into the ground? Hell no. Unions took a serious hit because of dumb management decisions. [[I suppose management didn't sign those contracts year after year, even as the UAW became more of junior partners in management than radicals, sheesh.)

No, sorry. You can bet your sweet ass that a generous share of those profits are on the backs of the people who work for less, maybe have to have a spouse working to feed the kids now, while the suits and the stockholders beat their chests. No way, man. No way.

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Originally Posted by tarkus

Hmm I guess the $6200 profit sharing checks aren't worth a damn?

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The old man's $5 a day deal was considered generous. The other part of the bargain was that he ran the company on his own terms, and if you didn't meet any of the criteria, you didn't get your $5 a day. Caught smoking? Found with union literature? Seen coming out of a bar? Give the boss a little lip? Out on your ass. Management doesn't want any meddling with how it wants to run the company and may even be willing to pay a little more to keep workers quiet. At some point, profit-sharing becomes hush money.

This is what we have for the American worker these days: You should call yourself lucky that your job hasn't been offshored yet. Call yourself lucky that your wages are leaner, that your health package is weaker. Call yourself lucky that you were able to make your bosses richer this year. And everybody beats their chest and crows victory? Sigh ...

The profit was mainly an accounting adjustment though it is the 11th straight quarterly profit for Ford. And because of an accounting adjustment the guy on the line gets $6,000. I got a $500 bonus check last week and I have worked for my company for 26 years.
I am non union and I respect the UAW and have brothers in the Union, but the scolding by the nerd is really sickening to me.

Union workers also got to live high on the hog for decades because of the dumb decisions by auto workers' management. You seem to have forgotten that. Don't mistake my point here. I'm not saying that everything is the union's fault. Without it, the middle class would not have existed and I for one am glad that the workers united back in the day. HOWEVER, over the decades, their greed and corruption turned them into the corporate monsters that they fought so desperately against for workers' rights. There was never a thought by the Big 3 OR the unions that 'hey, maybe we should examine the effect of how we spend money.' I agree that we need to make sure that our standard of living stays at an acceptable level, but there comes a point where businesses, unions, etc... all pieces of the auto industry need to admit that there is plenty of accountability to go around for the Big 3's failure.

I don't know about the unions being so greedy they destroyed the company. Seems to me the UAW, from being run by anti-communist Reuther, who purged the union of reds, to the 1970s, when they effectively scuttled the revolutionary union movement, have generally seen themselves as partners with the management, and using a cudgel to keep the workers in line and stop strikes at any cost. And there's so much noise on the issue [[extremely vocal anti-union voices in the echo-chamber that is right-wing radio in America) that it's hard to arrive at the truth. Basically, I take anything the union says with a grain of salt. But, as an American worker, my sympathies are always going to lie with labor. Labor and unions? Not the same thing.

DNerd, instead of ranting and raving, what do you suggest should be done? Do you expect to get paid the same as a CEO or some type of manager in a corporation for a job that requires less education/motivation/knowledge? Mullaly does get a ton of dough and it is reasonable to question the large sum of his pay, but to be honest out of all the CEO's that I've seen at Ford throughout my lifetime, he deserves it more than any of the others. Think about it. Ford SURVIVED the bailouts. They kept people employed without getting help from the government. I applaud them for that. You sound like a kid that sees someone with a bigger toy and goes 'WAH!!!! WAH!!!!. I want that! Yours is bigger than mine! EVEN THOUGH YOU WORKED FOR IT I DESERVE IT TOO!' So why don't you go out and earn it? Not saying you're not a hard worker; I don't know you. I think your argument is full of emotion and no facts. If you want to get rich then work towards getting it.

I didn't say that they destroyed the company. I said that they had a hand in it ALONG with the execs and whomever else is part of the industry.

Unions are only as good as they represent labor. Are there bad unions? Sure. Just like there are bad companies. Just like any other human institution. But I gotta root for the workers, because they're the ones who do most of the working and living and dying. Like it or not, it's the only way to make the workplace more democratic, which is a good thing.

As for the appeal that I work hard to get rich, all I want is a good, decent living. I don't want to be "rich." Anyway, that's the kind of argument you make when you think there's an even playing field. And, frankly, that sounds more like an emotional argument than anything I've said.

Look around you, folks. Dwindling standards of living, chronic unemployment and underemployment, foreclosures, rising poverty, fewer opportunities and ... record corporate profits. Record-setting, as in "never higher than now."

If that's fair to you, then what's the point of arguing?

Whether a CEO or a broom pusher, we are all workers in some way. root for anyone who is willing to work hard to attain their goals. I also don't agree with your statement that the workers always do 'most of the work'. It's hard work to go to college, pay your bills [[and tuition), and fight your way through the ranks to become someone who 'steps on the backs of the working man'. Doesn't that make a person that worked their way up a working man also? Where do you draw the line between working man and corporate oppressor? Besides, some people's 'standard' of living is a bit screwy. I know people that have been unemployed for a couple of years, and they say that they can't find jobs. That is BS. What they really mean is 'I can't afford to pay my bills because I can't find a job that pays more than I used to make' or 'I'm overqualified to do that job.' I'd rather make anything instead of nothing in the short term. If I had to do something less financially lucrative in the short term, I'd do it. I may have to cancel that HD cable and reduce my cell phone minutes[[is that a reduced standard of living?) but I'd survive.

"The old man's $5 a day deal was considered generous. The other part of the bargain was that he ran the company on his own terms, and if you didn't meet any of the criteria, you didn't get your $5 a day. Caught smoking? Found with union literature? Seen coming out of a bar? Give the boss a little lip? Out on your ass."

That 5 bucks a day isn't really what it was cracked up to be. No, when you get right down to it, the 5 per day was mostly all show because you had to buy your tools at the Ford owned tool shop, buy your food at the Ford owned grocery store, living in a Ford Corp owned home and buy your clothes at a Ford owned clothier.

If not, you're out on your ass. Hmmm, in concert with what you illustrated that would get one put out in the street I can definitely see why people felt it necessary to unionize; workers were basically indentured servants.

"The profit was mainly an accounting adjustment though it is the 11th straight quarterly profit for Ford. And because of an accounting adjustment the guy on the line gets $6,000. I got a $500 bonus check last week and I have worked for my company for 26 years."

Let us ALL not forget that when folks get bonuses, they spend bonuses -- usually locally and/or within the State.

That's the type of "trickle down" that works!

What Baseline mentions about Ford is exactly why the unions should exist. I just think there needs to be some type of balance between the unions and corporations that provides ethical treatment of American workers without those labor costs contributing to the failure of a company. I admit that I have no idea how that can happen.

It can only happen through the one instrument workers have at their disposal to make a workplace more democratic: unions. And it's always a fight. I wish it were all glitter and soap bubbles, but I'd be lying.

"I admit that I have no idea how that can happen."

I think we're going down that road of opportunity right now. With the recent bankruptcy, labor and corporate were reminded that they both need each other.

I think if they take this lesson and move forward with the understanding that the relationship is basically a positive symbiotic relationship we very well may see a new dawn.

Quite frankly [[and, Union put food on my table) there have been too many abuses from both labor and management. The whole mindset of "I gotta screw them before they screw me" has brought us to where we are now: terse feelings toward both sides, and an increase in business for the knife sharping and axe grinding industry.

The days of Jimmy Hoffa-style negotiations are over. We need to work with each other; not against.

It's definitely a fight and not glitter and soapbubbles. We agree on that.

Well put, Baseline. Symbiosis.

This might be off-topic but I'd like to know what accounting methods Ford used when it calculated its' profits. Did they use standard accounting procedures or mark-to-market accounting? Did they include future revenue projections in their profits or change how they calculated depreciation? How about non-automotive revenue streams?

I'm happy for Ford but I long for the day when Metro Detroit's prosperity isn't so closely tied to this single industry.

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Originally Posted by iheartthed

I'm happy for Ford but I long for the day when Metro Detroit's prosperity isn't so closely tied to this single industry.

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Good luck with seeing that while you are still alive.

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Originally Posted by Patrick

Good luck with seeing that while you are still alive.

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I know. But then again I'm sure people in Pittsburgh once thought that about steel...

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Originally Posted by iheartthed

I know. But then again I'm sure people in Pittsburgh once thought that about steel...

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And that is a good point I've thought about often. The leaders of Detroit have failed miserably getting themselves away from near complete reliance on the auto industry.

I don't see how this is great news. History repeats its self. Doom and gloom is ahead in 5-10 years like always unless the metro area makes the auto industry only account for less than 15% of the metro economy.

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Originally Posted by mikefmich

And that is a good point I've thought about often. The leaders of Detroit have failed miserably getting themselves away from near complete reliance on the auto industry.

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At 2:50 in GM's Detroit Renaissance Center HQ, the narrator says "... but only 13% of Detroit's workforce is employed by the auto makers." This was filmed in the 1970s.

Was that 13% figure correct? It kind of surprised me.

Great news for Ford and Ford employees.

Here's to hoping lots of Michigan products and services are purchased with the profit sharing checks [[from white collar and blue collar) and everyone wins a little bit.