Today through July 29th Asbestos removal and other contractors will be on sight removing windows and other contaminants around the first floor.
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Today through July 29th Asbestos removal and other contractors will be on sight removing windows and other contaminants around the first floor.
I am thoroughly surprised. Where did you hear/read this, mcsdetroit?
Detroiturbex.com's FB page made the announcement then posted photographs. I knew they planned on starting today for about a week as the info is posted on Michigan's DLEG website, work will continue until July 29th
As soon as he loses his bid to stop the bridge...watch him implode MCS...
Speaking of the devil...
http://www.freep.com/article/2011060...text|FRONTPAGE
All i know for sure is the deposit has been paid for the work, I think they're in this regardless of the bridge at this point
Driving by the Michigan Central Station aka "The Train Station" this evening, I noticed that there were a couple of large ladder trucks out front. I saw a car parked out front that looked like a security guard of some sort, so I stopped and asked him, "What are they doing to the train station?" He said, "They are tearing it down!" and then he drove away. I know that this guy obvioiusly had NO idea what he talking about, but here is the sight anyway.
Attachment 9885
Wallside is on the job.
OK, while I deplore this tactic... here's an interesting question.... if the bridge is built... then Eminent Domain WILL OCCUR in that neighborhood.... do you thinkg that the folks currently living there are going to be happy even with twice the CURRENT MARKET VALUE for their homes???
I highly doubt that... the way Detroit real estate has been depressed... those people will want many times the current market value for their homes.... possibly 10 fold.
The current housing market could turn the new public bridge into another Poletown type fiasco for homeowners screaming that they're forced from their homes with nowhere affordable to move to.... at least that's a possibility...
I don't think so Gistok, a cleaned up historic architectural and cultural gem like MCS is leaps and bounds better than a trash-strewn vacant lot.
If the owner will not care for the property, its better off gone. Too many folks sneak into it causing issues for police. I would dread to see what would happen in case of a fire. I've been told that the place is mostly concrete, but it would be a real shame if any fireman lost his life because the owner won't secure and care for his property.
maybe, maybe not. I remember reading that there was a neighborhood org. in Delray working with DRIC to mediate concerns between residents and the state.
Here's the full EIS for the DRIC, if anyone wants to read it.
http://www.partnershipborderstudy.com/reports_us.asp
*edit, to stay on topic.
I could see Maroun continuing restoring MCS as a secondary money-maker, should the DRIC get built. He would still have control over the rail tunnels under the river, and a restored train station. Couple that with Ray LaHood suggesting we link rail to Canada again , and it could get interesting.
See the other thread, but you're right that guy had no idea...asbestos removal thru July 29th
Asbestos would have to be removed for demolition anyway....cost of the windows is minimal to Matty.
Maroun must want to build his bridge :)
Too bad Tiger Stadium wasn't fixed up like this...
Every time he tries to get his bridge built, he says he is going to do something with MCS then we get excited and nothing happens. Glad he is at least FINALLY doing something about the windows.
http://www.detnews.com/article/20110...-Central-Depot
How's about that for a slice of fried gold?
Whadda ya bet work ceases the moment he either wins or loses his bridge battle.
Det_ard... well let's hope that "his" bridge process gets dragged out for quite a while... so that he finishes with his MCS work... although we all know better....
It's funny how he's got not only his son involved... but also his wife in public statements. Perhaps he realizes his reputation is in the toilet...
They're removing the same windows that have just been installed in this 1913 Manning Bro's photo from Columbia University in NYC [[sorry for the glare)
Attachment 9896
I guess the question is are they actually replacing the windows, or simply replacing the broken glass?
I drove by there tonight and it looked like they are just replacing glass. It would be nice if the window frames get pulled and they install all new windows.
But seriously, I think this is a win win situation for Maroun...
#1 He gets the support of all the preservationists, that would like to see the depot restored.
#2 He gets the Corktown community on his side for fixing up the eyesoar
#3 There is a potential to lease out the space for offices or lofts.
Just pure speculation on my part. I think the whole purpose of these renovations is work out a deal with the city to move the Police headquarters to the Michigan Central Depot.
Right now all the work gets put into the building with renovations, they replace the windows, and the building gets to the point where a tenant is ready to move in. Maroun then works out a deal with the city to lease the building to them for the new police headquarters.
In exchange, the city does not have to spend $50 million dollars to fix up the old MGM grand and Maroun gets his approval to finish the bridge.
I am hoping they actually replace the windows as well. Given thier state and the asbestos, I would think it would be easier/cheaper to replace them... and I think the leaded glass[[?) and caulking will just be removed and new replacement windows installed [[Majic windows are fiberglass - might be better for long-term use).
I also agree that this is an [[albeit thinly vieled) attempt to save face to tip some of his neighbors into not being as against him as they are now, and would be nice if it were actually completed but I can't imagine it will be the silver bullet for his bridge vs the New Crossing.
Thats where the lovefest ends. This building and site are in terrible shape physically. Replacing the windows on its own will slightly improve the view from afar... but without cleaning the stonework and architectural details, cleaning up the site around the building, and securing the building from vandals, the windows are almost as superficial as adding the awnings to the Statler [[now an empty lot). SO, this is hardly 'fixing up the eyesore,' and the prospect of leasing the space for offices or lofts is millions of dollars away given that everything other than the physical structure [[and now the windows perhaps) is gone. Plumbing, ductwork, heating/cooling, elevators, elecrtical, finishes on the load bearing/outside walls. Basically a full on restoration before person one could occupy the building.
I wouldn' mind seeing the PD move there instead of the old IRS/MGM, but I'd be surprised if the renovation was cheaper given that the MGM/IRS building was a nicely outfitted, occupied building just a few years ago [[and has been secured since).
It is nice to see minimal preservation taking place at the MCS. Though I fear that Mr. Maroun is going to hold this building hostage for the new bridge. I know its been suggested on this thread and I believe another before but I think he is going to say "Take your pick, a new bridge or a new Depot?"
I cant stand the old casino really. I wish MGM had moved into MCS. Detroit would have loved AUTHENTIC luxury surrounding them while they game. I like the idea of just replacing panes if they can. I would like as much of that building preserved as possible. Give the guy a little credit I guess. It's not as if his family hasn't been floating quotes around in regards to fixing up this building. I'm sure their friends and everyone realize how absentee they have been with this property. Probably starting to feel guilty. Plus he and his wife are not destined for earth much longer than another 10 or 20 years so maybe now is the time.
In any case, be vigilant with your cameras!
I think corktown would be happier if he built the ramps so the trucks coming off the bridge wouldn't be routed up rosa parks. They are pretty loud and they've already had to rebuild the road once because the trucks destroyed it.
why couldn't MCS be the terminal for the new high speed rail possibly being built between Det & Chi?
Its all a game and obviously people are falling for it.
Its about what he wants and what he's gotta do to get it.
This is NOT a restoration.
I see some of you are not falling for it... but, while this is not a restoration, I think Maroun knows there's value in this building.
First, there's value in preserving it due to the overwhelming number of people who want to see it restored.
Secondly, Maroun sees economic activity occurring all around his decrepit property and may think that there's some opportunity to profit off of Corktown's resurgence.
Third, there has been money appropriated by the feds to build a semi-high-speed rail line between Detroit and Chicago. A natural terminus is right there at MCS. I'll bet all my marbles that Maroun is going to try and obtain a monopoly over the rail line terminal. He already controls all truck traffic between Detroit and Windsor, why not control all passenger traffic between Detroit and Chicago?
Fourth, he may get some tax credits to restore building.
Fifth, he is no spring chicken, and this may be his last attempt to be remembered as something other than a "Mr. Burns." Let's face it, his public reputations is less than worthless. If Ilitch died today, most people would remember him fondly, and many would want to memorialize his image somewhere in Foxtown. If Maroun died today, there certainly wouldn't be people erecting a monument to pay tribute to his memory in SW Detroit.
Maroun has every reason to fix up MCS. In fact, even with his money, it would take time to think up reasons why the building should be left to decay. It is iconic. MCS is perhaps Detroit's most notable building outside of the RenCen. There's a lot of direct and tangential benefits to restoring MCS. Honestly, I'm surprised it has taken Maroun this long.
Well stated BrushStart. Regardless of Maroun's intentions, It’s a step in the right direction. Worst case scenario -- he replaces the windows and the roof and then walks away. In this case, at least the building would be less of an eyesore. Maybe he is positioning himself for a high-speed rail line into MCS.
I now have this recurring dream/fantasy of sitting in the MCS terminal with my family waiting on an outbound train for Chicago [[with tickets to a Tigers - White Sox game in hand - lol). Damn, my alarm just went off!
I totally agree with Brushstart. Doing something with the building is far better than doing nothing. The areas near the station - Corktown, SW Detroit and North Corktown all are showing some positive signs of recovery, regardless of how minor.
the current Amtrak station in New Center is not a great facility although that is pretty much what Amtrak now uses in many large cities - small new free-standing stations. If high speed rail ever happens between Detroit/Chicago or even Ann Arbor/DTW/Detroit then MCS could make an excellent facility for the new services and maybe Amtrak additionally. Disembarking at MCS from Amtrak would be better than at New Center I would think.
There are many landowners in Detroit that do less with their properties than Maroun does with that building. the cleanup that was done last summer with support from Maroun made a difference in the appearance of the grounds. Even if he is doing this only to generate positive PR then good. I don't agree with his plan to sign up a major tenant before beginning renovations. If nothing else, secure and weather proof the building and clean it out, would that not make the sell a bit easier?.
If he added a power wash and accent lighting to this "renovation" or whatever term he wants to dub it, that would be a gigantic step I think. Although I'm glad to see this work taking place, and I'm certainly a proponent of renovating the MCS, this seems like putting lipstick on a pig. I understand this is a step in the right direction, but I'd like to see just a little bit more. It's still gonna be a fenced off, dark, hulking structure.
MCS could be a nice Belliagio Hotel and Union Train Station with shops and restaurants...? Dreaming smh.
Powerwash the facade of the station? I've never seen or heard of them doing that.Quote:
and they powerwash every once in a while, so I don't think they'll not do it this time
I saw them powerwashing the facade when they were planting flowers last Summer. Or was it two Summers ago?
Remember "TROY" that was on the columns? FreeP and Detroit News sometimes run photographs of the facade when that was there. But its had a clean front for the last 2 years. Sure the sides aren't great, there's some graffiti on the East and West facades and on the top floors of the North and South sides, but the front is the cleanest it's been in years.
The facade is limestone and limestone likes to absorb toxic elements in the air, just look at the Book Tower.
You're right....I do remember TROY. I guess I just figured when graffiti disappeared it was covered up with more graffiti.
I wonder if anyone else besides I have read the National Park Service Preservation Brief #38, "Removing Graffiti from Historic Masonry"? It would be most important in this endeavor if they hope to do it right.
http://www.nps.gov/history/hps/tps/briefs/brief38.htm
I remember that TROY idoit !!! Thank God his mark is gone!
A century ago Detroit had another businessman that everyone hated his guts.... that was James Scott. He was an unscrupulous businessman, a womanizer, gambler and a scoundrel [[I don't think Matty has all those bases covered)... anyway when Scott died in 1910, he left his fortune to the city of Detroit to build some kind of monument... the only stipulation being that there be a statue of him included as part of the deal.
Well the citizens and politicians of the city were outraged... why [[they thought) should they do anything with Scott's "blood money", least of all memorialize him with a statue.
So the money sat gaining interest until finally some folks who weren't blinded by their hatred for Scott, decided in the 1920s to build the Scott Fountain and Lagoon on the newly added [[via river dredge material) west end of Belle Isle. So today we have Scott Fountain as the crowning centerpiece of the citys greatest park.
Now fast forward a century... Matty Maroun... is probably the most hated businessman in Detroit. And whatever his motives... he's old... and likely not going to live long enough to see any bridge built... his or a public bridge.
So perhaps [[and this is just a guess)... he wants to leave a memorial to say "I'm not such a scoundrel as you all think I am"... and that memorial could be the saving of the MCS... the largest landmark in the city outside of Downtown-Midtown-New Center.
Granted, he doesn't have anyone interested in the MCS at the moment, and may not for many years... but if he secures the building from further decay, and cleans the exterior, new windows, and a new roof... and at some point in the future a new use is found for this over-the-top monument... then in many ways... he may have secured his legacy for the future.... regardless of how our emotions get in the way of our judgement about all his actions in the present.
In 1963 when New York City's magnificent and cavernous Pennsylvania Station was razed... the New York Times wrote in an Op-Ed piece... "perhaps we will be remembered more for what we have destroyed than what we have saved..."
If Matty does indeed start the long uphill battle to save one of America's most magnificent buildings... then future generations will likely treat his legacy like we today treat James Scott's legacy.... "yeah he was a scoundrel... but look what a wonderful monument he preserved for us..."
I would love to see the Amtrack station moved back to Michigan Central Depot.
The building would look awesome at night with some big flood lights.
I'll tell you what I'm excited for on top of this: MCS's appearance in the new Transformer's film, something about an angel statue inside holding what looks like a giant spear...
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3058/...09208bc1_z.jpg
This is how MCS is looking lately, good start
Credit to Band!to on Flickr
I don't think Matty Moroun owns the airspace above MCS so I think this footage of it is perfectly legal. ;)
Someone took a video from above with an RC plane.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CsW5cFHVYM
Attachment 9937
Was there today and found all the windows on the main North face plus most all the windows on the east side had been cleared. Still some shards remaining on a few window frames, and glass still litters the floor of the space between the big arches, maybe they'll clean that out when they go inside.
Big thing I noticed is the windows in the "Womens" and "Reading" rooms on the far east and west sides still maintain their louvering abilities. I've never seen any photographs of them open other than the construction photographs I have.
I hope those vaulted ceilings get a bit of repair and extra reinforcement. They are constructed of terra-cotta block infill set into a thin steel frame, which is carried by large steel trusses. They are then faced on the other underside in decorative stone. They have fared pretty well surprisingly despite that there's probably plenty of water pouring and freezing on top of them.
The Guastavino arches are actually despite the wear and tear in great shape...last year I had an expert from MIT, John Ochsendorf [[look him up he's quite impressive), come by to check out the vaults and he was mighty impressed. This guy literally wrote the book on the style of vaults/arches inside MCS and he gave them a good inspection and basically said - to paraphrase - you could drive several trucks over these vaults and they'd be fine...
Even gave the building a pretty good structural rating saying the beams on the first 4 floors looked great considering the harsh winters they've gone through over the years.
He basically concluded that the damage to the arches is more cosmetic than structural and fixing up would be really easy.
Any work if they are going to repaint the frames the original blue/green color? Once the glass is out I'd love to see them wash the fascade. Didn't they start that process at one time?
I have no idea if they'll even keep the original frames. Although personally I hated that blue/green copper patina look. You can still see it on some frames, I have no clue if that was the original color or added later to match the copper roofs aging appearance, but looking at old black and white photographs everything looks dark on the window frames.
See earlier in the thread about the facade. Limestone can be very fickle and likes to absorb things in the air, washing the facade is something that would have to happen several times a year.
If they wanted to do it right and preserve the historical look, they could restore the frames, but not replace the glass within. In the long run if the building were occupied, they wouldn't be energy efficient. Instead they could use butt-jointed glass behind the original frame and stiffen it by running custom engineered standoffs between the parallel frames. The appearance would be virtually identical to the original, but with a modern glazing system.
The likely, VE'ed fix would be ugly painted aluminum frames with chunky 4-6" mullions.
Most of the steel should be fine. It was encased in concrete for fire reasons, then covered with plaster. Despite some chips on the edges, recent photos show the fire-protective substrate in decent shape despite all the crumbling plaster. If there's any part I'm concerned about on the station, it's the facade. You really need a good inspection done on this. Not even a casual observation by an engineer will do. There's plenty of water getting into the inside, which then runs to the edges of the slab beneath block infill, and then down through the cavity, exposing all those ties to alot of moisture. Not even well maintained stone facade buildings can evade moisture infiltration into these cavity areas. It's a basic reality of older masonry buildings.
This was taken on Friday 6/17/2011
Attachment 9968
Still freaking me out to see those well maintained forecourts of the MCS against the backdrop of the MCS itself. Is there also some roofwork being done there in that picture or is that still a result of decay? And what is written on tht sign?
Would you miss the Detroit MCs as it is? In a few moths maybe to you it will be unrecorgizable since most of you never knew the building other than being a ruin and a marvalous film location. Don't get me wrong, a vibrant building in that part of town can be a magnet of progress. It will take long but someone took the task of rebuilding the Book Cadillac hotel. And now more buildings are in the process of restoration. I hope the MCS will be a similar magnet.
But let's face it. MCS was never better captured as in this part of the movie Naqoyqatsi as a backdrop for the music of Philip Glass and Yo Yo Ma.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KaYFws2bO44
I hope this work being done is not just a preparation for this stunt.... which was discussed here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzaIcFVMwmY
I'm sure you don't need it but this is a nice introduction to the uninitiated with the MCS. H also has a Cass tech video up which I post in the Cass thread. But I think his premonition about the fate of the depo might not come true hopefully.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Bycfsg3iFQ
mcs needs to be saved! look at the book cadillac look how that has change the area around it. if the saved MCS how would that area change.
I did not know, until I looked at that photo of them building the depot, that there were movable sections within the large windows on the facade of the Waiting Room. I mean, it makes perfect and logical sense, I just didn't think about it....
In my opinion, WHEN the depot is renovated [[and I feel its a bit more of a reality now), some portion of it should be maintained in its current [[stabilized) state. The building opened in 1913 and closed in 1988, and in the meantime, fully one quarter of its near-100 year lifespan has been spent in a state of disuse and decay. The elements and many many depot "visitors" have visited and made their mark over the years. Not that I don't want to see the building restored....indeed I hope they very best practices and the Secretary of the Interior's Standards will be followed when it comes to restoring at least the grand public spaces of the building, but I think it's fair and right to pay respect to what we have had to endure for the past 20+ years, and so we REMEMBER where we've been.
An entire generation of Detroiters and metro-Detroiters, myself included, never knew the depot in even a shadow of its operational glory. We've just known it in some state of decay and abandonment. Maintaining at least one space - be it elevator lobby, alcove, room in the arcade or foyer in a stabilized version of its decayed graffitied state would serve to remind us all not only of that lengthy chapter in the building's history, but that part of the story of Detroit as well. It could be symbolic for visitors and residents to be able to come and see what it was actually like on the inside....in one place....since no doubt so many have seen photos of it with broken windows both near and far.
That being said, when they restore the waiting room and concourse, I hope they will leave the weathered surfaces of the limestone, terra cotta, and any original marble that is left. The richness of the weathering is a tangible thing people can touch and see which also helps to tell the story of the past 23 years. But I do hope they'll carefully remove the graffiti :)
I'd have to disagree with the statement about the MCS never being captured better than in the Naqoyqatsi piece. It might have been better off had it been shot in, oh, I don't know, maybe COLOR! For my money, I've seen lots of ruin porn that captures more of the essence of the failure of the MCS than the Naqoyqatsi video. Personally, I'd take Em's music video any day.
As for Jay Scott, who the hell is he and who gives a rat's tuckus what he has to say? "Gee, I'll just grab my kid brothers video camera and shoot seven minutes of my own personal diatribe on what's wrong with [[fill in the blank) and I'll be famous." Right!
Rocko, I have to respectfully disagree... like with the Book Cadillac, I would like to see every last bit of the abandoned past erased... there's enough of it in video already....
Mallory.... LOL.... I have to agree... that guy says that the MCS is beyond gone... I'd love to see him eat his words...
Wow, even the removal of the glass, etc. from the large windows looks good. This will be exciting, it will require a few visits over the summer to check out the changes.
I bet that a fixed up MCS could really have some spectacular lighting at night.
If a new amphitheatre was built in Detroit to regretfully replace Chene Park, I couldn't think of a more spectacular backdrop than an amphitheatre in Roosevelt Park with the MCS lit up behind it...
I was just viewing a concert at an ancient Roman Amphitheatre in Croatia and it kind of gives you an idea of what it would be like...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VzB8x...feature=relmfu
Neon and all... the RenCen just couldn't come close as a spectacular backdrop....
Phil Cooley as part of his plan for Roosevelt Park wants to include an amphitheater
I ate enough crow from all of the negative comments I made over the years about the Book Cadillac. I walked past that building every day for years and kept thinking what a tragedy it was that it was left standing. Look what happened there, and let's hope [[my fingers are paralyzed from being crossed so much) that Moron comes through with this project in similar fashion.
Work continues
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=en2Fg_2b8Wk
Thanks for the video update.
The concourse 1993...3 years prior to Maroun's purchase of Michigan Central station
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4078/...5d7b5935_b.jpg
Photo credit: Flickr.com user cmmeneghini
I'm stil wondering. Are there already new windows in or is all this a Punch and Judy show and is the remainder of the building going to be boarded up?
Found another old picture on flickr. Again the concourse, now in 2008.
Another picture in that series is this one.How incredibly fitting. Look at the text of that book.
MCS set.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2726/...60ce2dc6_b.jpg
MCS, 1971, [[c) Lindsaybridge
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4043/...e3b74852_b.jpg
1971, sideview. [[c) Lindsaybridge, Even Roosevelt book depsitory looks nice.
This must be a photoshop job....
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4002/...dbec0155_b.jpg
[[c) Friend_in_Detroit
And lots of candy to be found in the LOC.
According to http://www.dleg.state.mi.us/asbestos...no.asp?id=8930 they have until the 29th of July to get all the windows out of the first floor
That first Lindsay Bridge photo is so iconic not only of Penn Central's dying passenger rail business, but of the declining era of the MC Station. In the late 70s, an impressive restoration of the depot would pump over a million dollars into repairs and upgrades in amenities, but it would not last. It's a great photo of the old NYC cigar-band E units with PC worms logo half-heartedly hanging on. Thanks for sharing those photos!
At least one did survive.
http://www.trainsarefun.com/danbury/images/4096.jpg
Whitehouse, I've said it before, you find some incredible photos! Thanks!
Stromberg2
Hahaha!! I'm the undisputed master of the search filters! Bow down to me!
Meanwhile.
This link has been posted here before once or twice but I can't get enough of it wondering around the station. And what's going on in the Moroun familiy? Have they been bitten by an early Christmas bug? [[I think Scrooge visited Matty :) )
Open source design has this idea. It's an idea we've seen before.
http://put.edidomus.it/domus/binarie...bocop_UPD.jpeg
Haha Robocop will NOT be going there, it's going in tech town
NYC E8A #4085 also survives, at the National New York Central Railroad Museum in Elkhart, Indiana. This was the last leading locomotive of the famed 20th Century Limited in 1967. The opposite side of the locomotive has some of the side panels replaced with plexiglass so viewers on the freighthouse platform can see into the engine compartment. I volunteered there a few years ago and it's worth a visit if you're interested in such things and are passing through the area.
http://www.railpictures.net/images/d...1261883315.jpg
Has anyone gone to the station to see how they are coming along? I was thinking about going down there to get some pictures and wanted to know if it's worth the time to or not.
Have they moved to other windows in the building? Any roof repair vehicles or what not?
www.woodwardspine.com
I drove by twice in the last ten days or so. There was a bucket crain or two there and some noticeable removal of glass, etc. in the large concourse window frames. I had a couple of friends in the car with me and remarked that even the bare window frames were nice to see after so many years of continual breakage and deterioration of the structure.
What is even more impressive is the planting of grasses, etc. in the island - a bit of Roosevelt Park in front of the building. I personally think it's too much decorative grass - that planting all grasses sort of looks mundane. But it's definitely better than a litter-strewn badly mowed strip of neglected city park. And it does give the impression that efforts are being made to improve the appearance of the area.
Here's an old discussion about the start of the planting process.
And the Transformers crew was there as well last year and back then there was also some work done.
Quote:
At the run-down Michigan Central Station, which he calls a world-class structure, much effort was devoted to getting it "not to its original glory, but the best we could" for the shoot. Marble floors were polished and some graffiti was removed for a scene set in Chicago. "We went in there and made it look like the place was in use, but since the Decepticons have attacked the city, this was one of the buildings that was hit," Hook said.
Did a drive by on my way to Warped tour and saw this action. Looks like the wind blew in most of the plastic, but this went around most of the Mezzanine A windows on the north east and west faces
http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6144/...cc0a031d_b.jpg
Thanks for this update photo. I was just thinking yesterday that they must be done with the arched windows on the facade and be moving on to the sides, but which windows are they doing there? Now I know!
it does look like they're doing some of the side windows but also the inside as well...also it looks like they've removed a very large sheet of plywood that was affixed over what used to be a door or a large window directly behind and underneath the carriage entrance. Makes for a very spooky view of the basement!