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Awesome!!
Won't it be nice to see video from inside the auto show next January. :)
Might be pretty distracting for drivers, though.
[[Interesting the video say completion date in mid-July. The article has a quote: By June 30).
http://www.freep.com/story/money/bus...town/28087343/
Distracting?
The stupid rapid-edit video clips are horrible on that corner display.
I realized after being stuck at that light a few mornings that they might be doing it due the poor frame rate of the technology. It seems it is not ABLE to show full-motion video.
Wouldn't that be a hoot?! Detroit buys the biggest television in the world to learn it only play anime, and even that poorly.
The large, but temporary displays at the Grand Prix totally sucked, too. No grayscale uniformity, and every live video had horrid lip-sync issues...and they were way too dim on the very cloudy free Friday, I cannot imagine them useful on a sunny day.
These videowall additions to Cobo Hall are a huge miscalculation to an otherwise amazing renovation. They did not spend enough on the right technology, and it shows. They could have had the resolution, brightness, and impact of the amazing display in Comerica Park...
And this is a curious fact...
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One thing that won't appear on the video wall will be commercial advertising. Cobo will not be allowed to run advertising messages on the video screen because it is too close to Woodward Avenue, designated by the U.S. Department of Transportation as part of the national highway system that is protected from visual pollution. The government has told Cobo officials that accepting ad revenue for a billboard-type video wall so close to Woodward would risk costing the state some of its federal highway funds.
So, I'm guessing Las Vegas...hell, every town in Nevada...took a pass on the cash so they can assault everyone driving up and down I-15!
I bet it takes them a short while to sue to end-run around this rule...hell, they are a few blocks from the intersection of Woodward and Jefferson, that is true, but it is the damned END of Woodward, there is no flow of traffic that will be distracted by any commercial. If they were really interested in no clutter, they'd kill the damn LED-lit signage completely! They are all distracting to me...like that new on on I-94 near the big tire...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gannon
You must have been distracted when reading the article? :p Here's a line you might have missed:
"The video screen will broadcast promotional messages about events taking place at Cobo, as well as public service messages touting Detroit attractions. And it's capable of broadcasting live events from within Cobo."
But it also all the screens combined were 2million dollars? That seems REALLY CHEAP, even if thats just the screens it seems cheap.
Dude, I've been around manufacturer's claims for decades in the video business.
Just because they SAY it can do a thing, doesn't mean it can do it well.
The current video clips being displayed at the corner already reveal HUGE issues. But it could be the way they are processing the demo material, or someone incorrectly set a toggle anywhere within the video signal path causing horrid frame-rate truncation. No way to know without all the specifications in front of me.
There are many ways to trick the average viewer, if there is anything I've learned in the industry...manufacturers will try to hide every shortcut and compromise they make...and no video display is perfect. Not a one of 'em. Plus, the issues get really tough when you're battling sunlight and increasing the size of the image. Some things overlooked on small screens cannot be ignored when the picture is larger than life.
I'd like to find current specs for their displays versus that unbelievable monster the Tiger's just splurged on...that is just amazing to witness.
Not questioning your credibility, I was simply stating what was in the article. As for the Tiger's scoreboard, they spent 10 million on the one screen. The Cobo screens are 2 MILLION for all 3 combined according to the article. Considering your background I find your comment to be a tad disingenuous. The price tag should tell an expert like you everything you need to know.
Exactly.
If they had to compromise on the purchase, they should not be bragging about it!
Agreed..I hope you are wrong about all this damn it. :mad:Quote:
Originally Posted by Gannon
Gannon, if you get the specs, maybe you can list some comparable screens at other venues so we might know what to expect? Kill the suspense...
I cannot even find a manufacturer name yet on these things...and had no idea the Tiger's display was 5-10 times the price. I DO know that I'm still wowed by it, and that is what they're promising with this 'biggest video display in the convention market'...so if it doesn't really show the best available, it will just make us look lame.
I know that LEDs should not have trouble flickering at insanely fast frame rates. If there is stuttering in the image flow, it could be anything from the source, through the processing, through even any form of amplifier necessary to make the datastream travel any distances. In residences, I've even had poor HDMI cables cause imperfect motion flow...although that is very, very rare.
But I've avoided streaming video until recently, since all data delivery through slow internet connections cause too much interruption in flow. Nothing like killing the show with such lame distractions.
This is one of the best applications where true 4k pixel density should be a basic requirement, which would shoot all costs up dramatically...including storage medium and signal path...but 4k with a 60fps rate would get the display out-of-the-way perceptually, allowing the viewer to not notice anything but the content. When a display system is faulty, the viewer has to actively work interpolating any missing information and filtering off the additions due the technology. Any work necessary to view a video display causes fatigue, and the viewer will avoid using it in the future.
I cannot even look at that corner display, it feels as if that temporal hiccupping is going to send me to seizure. LEDs are always worse for that...hell, I'm still feeling those red/blue background lights at the Royal Joke Music Theater...although I was reminded of 'em by the DJ lighting from my cousin's wedding last night.
It is likely that they were looking for the cool factor first, the see-through capability allowing simultaneous viewing from inside or out...although one would be reversed. They made a big deal of seeing the skyline through the display...51% permeability, I think they said.
I know large, dense HD displays are ridiculously expensive, we got a quote of over a quarter mil for a flexible-OLED unit for the lobby of my gal's firm's new office space downtown...they went with three residential Sharp units instead for just under a tenth of that, including the source hardware. But you've really got to pay to play at that end of the market...
Geez, just found this article...wonder how many high schoolers beat the deadline.
Sure is a cool way to assemble content at no real cost...
http://www.cobocenter.com/cobo-3060
Just looked up the H.264 standard...it will support those insane pixel densities and frame rates...but if something is set wrong in the processing software [[there are way too many choices for clarity) one can get the same interrupted motion flow that I see at that corner display. I REALLY want it to not be the displays...and if they do have issues, they can just go back to more static and saturated imagery.
I think after the initial installation team is done, though, all bets are off. My gal was part of the team that specified what she now calls the 'migrane tunnel' out at Metro Airport. They wrote a full treatise on how various colors and combinations and flicker types could actually induce seizures and headaches. Those rules were followed for about two years...they are clearly not being followed now.
But at least I learned about the OFF button at each entrance...and I hit it every time I am forced to walk through that torture chamber!
Cheers
Thanks for the leg-work Gannon. I will be interested to see your opinion of the main screen once its in operation...
P.S. The clarity of the COPA scoreboard is a thing of beauty. I was blown back.
I was wondering what happened to the screen at Hockeytown? Back when Copa had designated smoking areas inside the park, you could smoke a cigarette and watch the game on that screen over at Hockeytown... It was small, but with the crowd noise for context it was all one needed for 10 minutes...
They have been playing a few different video clips on that corner unit this week, and it is clear the motion issues I was seeing were due the clips, NOT the displays. There were a few scenes with flowing fabric that proved the displays could show full-motion.
They are still playing that animation of the M1 rail system among the rotation of video clips, and the judder and hiccups returned.
The color primaries are still weird, but it proves that the usefulness of the display is dependent on the provided video.
Someone is likely creating a list of limitations which should be followed...but not unlike that migraine tunnel at Metro, it will probably get ignored after a few years.
Because of the see-through nature of the display...it will never have the density of image, or the saturation of colors to compete directly with that expensive display at Comerica Park.
It sure will change that end of downtown when they fire it up.
I'm as excited to see this as I was to see the billboard go up on the Music Hall.
Nice. Glad to read it's not "bottom of the barrel" in terms of capabilities. Thanks for the update.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gannon
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gannon
Didn't think it would end up in the MI Supreme Court so quickly, though.
http://www.freep.com/story/money/bus...cobo/28977913/
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gannon
Not the Michigan Supreme Court but the U.S. Supreme Court.
thanks
cheers
They are still having trouble with that corner unit...especially the second row of panels. Odd static, which sometimes goes into the third row.
Haven't seen a blink from the main panels yet...I cannot believe they put 'em up diagonally. Forces an entire set of processing mathematics...
But they've still got a day and a half to make their deadline.
Attachment 27454
Looks like it's just about done.
Pretty cool, although for some reason it reminds me of something from Total Recall or SlingBlade.
Blade Runner?Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeg19
I saw the "Hello Detroit" with the landscape scene this morning on the video wall while driving to the office - thought it looked really cool. Great job!
Is this structure weather-proof? did they take into account harsh winters?
Nah, they're going to take it down every time it rains or snows, or when it drops below 50 degrees.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hypestyles
Quote:
Originally Posted by southen
And Thank you very much. My brain was not working this morning when I wrote that.
Think of all the jobs that'll create....Quote:
Originally Posted by Spartan
Geez, in what universe does this display "look great"?!
Firstly, it is mounted roughly ten feet too far to the right. Parked at the curb by the ol' Ponch, the screen is cut off by the light poles. Even with these images, it is clear that it isn't even centered in the monkey bars.
Whomever planned the whole diagonal framing is simply an idiot. Sorry.
I obviously thought for a while that the actual video panels would be diagonal, too...hence my concerns about introducing extraneous video processing mathematics to map it.
But what we've got might be worse...permanent diagonal interference from BOTH sides of this see-through display. They obviously wanted the see-through feature, since it is one of the high-lighted terms in the press release, but the design team really dropped the ball by introducing such clutter.
Makes the image really tough to comprehend.
I imagine that making the diagonal bars reflective chrome might help a bit, reducing the diagonal blockage to mere shadows. That would still be putting lipstick on a pig.
Plus, the glass over the image reflected so much yesterday morning that it made the screen basically disappear. Some simple non-glare coating would've helped that.
I'm sure they can get around the Federal restrictions over advertising near a highway, since the People Mover track bisects the image as seen from Woodward. There is too much between the screen and that intersection for it to be a worry.
I really don't understand all the framing behind it. Is it functional in some way? It just looks a bit... odd to me.
Yeah, I don't see anything else on the entire building that is diagonal.
I've seen that diagonal girder style of architecture in and on other buildings before. It's one of these "trendy" looking designs.
I agree. When I first saw it being erected I thought the video screen was going to take up the entire area and would be really impressive. It looks like it was done as a cheap way to modernize the old façade.Quote:
Originally Posted by old guy