The more things change, the more things stay the same...
http://www.detroitnews.com/story/ent...roit/82740558/
The more things change, the more things stay the same...
http://www.detroitnews.com/story/ent...roit/82740558/
I thought people in Detroit hated the hoedown. In past years many people on this website were whining and wringing their hands complaining about the hoedown.
Personally I couldn't care less one way or the other. I have never been to it and I don't feel that my life is poorer for it.
I haven't gone since it it was moved from Hart Plaza, and definitely won't be paying between $29 and $78 and then $9 each for drinks in Clarkston. Kind of sad how quickly this went from one of the largest events in the city to just another concert at Pine Knob [[DTE).
Clarkston might be a better venue for that event. A friend who worked at Receiving Hospital dreaded working on the weekends when it was at Hart Plaza. There was more violence from drunks there than at any other downtown event.
Well that would kind of make sense since it was the largest event downtown outside of the auto show. Also being free, serving alcohol and being ungated it didn't have the same level of security as other events that charged admission.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobl
I went just about every year in the late 90's and early 2000's. Never once did I see any serious violence. Sure there were some drunken fights, but considering the city at that time was averaging more than a murder per day the violence at the Hoedown was pretty minor for a gathering of over 100k people.
i think festival promoters could think beyond the day of the event. certain event goers pay top dollar to see particular acts in particular locations. ie. summerfest in milwaukee. downtown certainly has all the summertime components and festival space to entertain someone over a weekend. this is a lost opportunity, though the downtown and even suburban concert/event demographic may not support 'bro' country downtown. when im on a boat and its hot...this kind of music fits the bill for white 15-55 folks.
Detroit Hoedown.... White people @ their finest.
Wait I thought that was Opening Day?Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
This event appeals to a local audience. That would be the Waterford-Clarkston area, not downtown or even midtown. Promoters figured by getting paying customers they could control things better, make more money, or make money!Quote:
Originally Posted by 313WX
:rolleyes:
"Did you see the Hoedown?" "I didn't know she fell...."
No big deal. Might even be a net positive for downtown.
People on DYes get WAY to worked up about these things. Downtown events aren't that big of an economic boost, and the event moving somewhere else locally is basically a wash. Now residents don't have to deal with drunken hooligans, insane parking and trashed streets.
Healthy downtowns have strong everyday activity, and don't rely on special events for their daily vitality. Special events tend to chase away the regulars and lower quality of life for everyone else.
Whoever gets free tickets from their job, PM me.
Never went after they moved it to Comerica but I went several times in years before that. We would stay for a few hours then leave. I don't remember seeing any violence of any type during the times I were there. Just a huge crowd having a great time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnny5
Yeah, you didn't stay long enough.
It only took two years' of observation to determine that this event was the worst thing downtown, by far.
Good Ol' Boys driving their pickemup trucks, lookin' for some sweet honey in Daisy Dukes to help them keep count of their beer cup collection before finding someone random to fight and prove their manhood.
Couple that with urban youth trollin' those who dared park outside the official lots, lookin' for that one 'Billy Bob' to say the wrong thing at the wrong time.
It was always on the verge of total anarchy. I saw some horrible fights in years past, but did not follow this crowd up to Comerica or over to the west side of the Riverwalk. [[expected to hear the same last year...was surprised to not)
I'm guessing the event promoters got a real bill for the security enhancements from the police department this year.
No big loss to the city. Not a one of those Good Ol' Boys wanted to be here, anyways. Good riddance.
While I agree the Hoedown is no loss, to say special events don't enhance a city and lower the quality of life for everyone is ridiculous. People live downtown because they enjoy the vibrancy of events along with the other benefits. I'm planning to visit Chicago for a few days in July. When I looked online at what events were happening I was totally blown away by how many events of every kind that were happening all summer. To say these don't enhance Chicago as a tourist city or place to live is crazy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bham1982
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobl
What..... more violent than the jazz festival?!?
Because you're speaking as a visitor.Quote:
Originally Posted by 401don
Locals generally hate "special events". I live by the Dream Cruise and it sucks. Everyone on my street leaves during that week. They're spending all their money Up North, while drunken outsiders are pissing on our lawns and having sex in our back yards [[happened to a neighbor). The "economic boost" is for Charlevoix, not Birmingham. The restaurants in downtown Birmingham are actually empty that week, unless they're selling hot dogs and beer.
A family member used to live in Chicago, right on the lake, and she hated all those summer special events. It was one of the main reasons she left her lakefront neighborhood [[Lincoln Park/Lakeview area) as it was a terrible place to live if you were a regular family, and not some 23 year old looking to get laid or some suburbanite looking to watch fireworks or an air show or something.
Concerts in Lincoln Park get lame pretty fast with a 2 year old constantly getting woken up from the building shaking.
I'll help you out here because I lived there for many years and have lots of friends and family that still do and you are way off. People who live in Chicago love the summer events schedule and there are too many events to break down all the specifics. There are a couple big events that locals avoid at all costs because they are simply too crowded and filled with tourists. In general the smaller block parties are all a great time and The Taste of Chicago would be considered an overcrowded mess.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bham1982
Definitely not true in Lincoln Park/Lakeview. They hated that weekend stuff like the air show, fireworks, concerts, road races, bike races, etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by TTime
They would regularly shut down LSD for "special events" meaning the surface streets were traffic hell, and my sister couldn't get downtown for work [[had off hours at a hospital). Alleyways would be blocked off, so people couldn't get their cars out, and street parking would be temporarily banned. Lincoln Park was frequntly unusable because the broke city rented it out for weekend events.
The nighttime drunken horde passing out on her building stoop, feet from where her baby fitfully slept, was an added "bonus", as were the regular muggings from troubled gay youth from the South Side, who congregated nearby.
She did like the neighborhood block parties, which were small-scale and locals-only. The big lakefront events suck, though, at least if you live nearby.
Well I for one will miss viewing the tailgating on the parking garage roofs. the most ideal people watching...sooo much fun watching people pee on the roof as if 1000's of workers in the towers above them couldn't see them...ahh the smell of urine and puke and hopping over the river of pee near my car...the good old days
Speak for yourself, not all white folks like country music.Quote:
Originally Posted by hybridy
Well, you still have today to enjoy those antics.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wintersmommy
Good. Keep them away from the city.
Good riddance to that Hoedown. Hoedowns in usually in the open country anyway.
I'm sure the 107,000 Electronic Music Festival fans don't generate much revenue.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bham1982
Roads getting blocked off, allies getting blocked off - these were not an issue with the Downtown Hoedown. In addition, at the locations of the downtown Hoedown - Hart Plaza, Comerica Park, and the West Riverfront Park - there are not that many nearby residents [[especially West Riverfront Park, which is surrounded by the river, parking lots, vacant lots, and industrial/small office buildings).Quote:
Originally Posted by Bham1982
This is a loss for downtown.
The Woodward Dream Cruise is irrelevant to the Hoedown, because they are completely different logistically. The Hoedown takes place in a defined downtown location and took place over a weekend, while the Dream Cruise takes place over a 16 mile long stretch of Woodward Av adjacent to residential neighborhoods over a whole week.
You say the economic impact to Downtown is minimal, but I remember hanging out on a Saturday at the Craft Barrel House when the Hoedown was taking place last year, and a ton of people from the Hoedown came to that bar, and I am sure many other drinking establishments downtown. You could distinguish them because a lot of those people were wearing cowboy hats and cowboy boots.
I feel like we have two extremes of the same spectrum arguing when most folks' feelings fall somewhere in the middle.
I will admit, I loved the St. Patrick's Day parade until I lived in Corktown for a few years. Now I leave or hide in the house. As a kid, the first Dream Cruises were awesome and people would come from out of town to stay at our R.O. home. After a while, it became a nightmare to be anywhere near it and the only way to attend was to walk to Ferndale from my people's house off John R and 8 mile and find a curb. Now it's hard to even do that its so crowded on Woodward.
I really don't like country music, the old stuff is good, but I would attend the Hoedown to spend time around country fans, to see what the culture is up to and talk to different kinds of people from what I'm used to. I am not going to effin Clarkston to do this, I barely leave the city of Detroit. I don't even know where Clarkston is...
I also haven't been to the State Fair since that was stolen from us, wherever that went. I used to attend a few days over the two week span and plan yard parties and such around the event. Now not one person I know that used to go to the fair still does.
It seems like many of things that made Detroit worth living in for me are going away. I could give a fuck about music swings and bike lanes and weird hipster food.
I also believe this is a loss for Downtown.
And having all those events nearby has really hurt the value of those lakefront and Lincoln Park area apartments too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bham1982
This is why they can never have the Taste of Chicago, the Woodward Cruise, Traverse City Cherry Fest, and Charlevoix's Venetian Fest on the same weekend. Nobody would be there to staff the events.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bham1982
The International Freedom Festival would disagree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnny5
Gannon: I went several times, then mosyed [[sp?) over to the Greektown Art Fair and the Music Menu. Cheers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iheartthed
You're right, I totally forgot about the fireworks! I haven't been since all those spectators were shot.
This is a gag post, right? Violence @ the Detroit Jazz Fest?Quote:
Originally Posted by EastsideAl
Probably not, because the 100,000 people who otherwise would go downtown avoid it, and EDM fans aren't buying furniture and mortgages and eating 8-course tasting menus.Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
Drug dealers probably do very well that weekend, though.
NYC has the right idea by putting most of its summer festivals on Randalls Island, where Ecstasy-popping teens aren't bothering the residents or trashing their neighborhoods. Here in Michigan we think a concert is "economic development".
Very true. Chicago is dirt-cheap compared to the other prime U.S. cities, and property values over time have appreciated slower than in any other U.S. metro.Quote:
Originally Posted by EastsideAl
I doubt this has much to do with summer concerts, though. It's more because Illinois is a trainwreck.
There are very few families with kids, though, living in the lakefront blocks. The more family-oriented areas in Lincoln Park/Lakeview, are inland, well away from the park and the problematic area around Belmont/Clark L station [[which gets belligerent visiting youth from South/West side every warm-weather weekend).
The fanciest parts, where the mansions are going up, are far from the train and the lake, and that's no accident.
Well, Tiger games still go on, so those fans aren't avoiding it. Eastern Mark-Up is still packed, so those shoppers aren't avoiding it. DIA, DFT, Detroit Opera House, Music Hall are open and running so those art and movie goers aren't avoiding it. Bars are full, so those drinkers aren't avoiding it. I bet you there is less drug ingestion going on @ the Fest than you think. I also bet you hotels, motels, restaurants, various travel services, stores and bars see an upswing in business that weekend. Which furniture stores and mortgage companies do you think are losing 100,000 customers that weekend?Quote:
Originally Posted by Bham1982
... so where else can you go to see these daisy-dukes-wearing women for free? lol :p
Back when I managed restaurants downtown we could have made more $$$charging a dollar per flush during Hoedown weekend. The sport of pissing from parking garages and screwing on car hoods along with puking on the street was only enhanced by someone taking a dump in the Congress St. portico of the Buhl Bldg. The new security controls needed in todays environment are more suited to somewhere like the new site. Not a loss.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wintersmommy
Has to be! The Jazz Fest and the African World Festival were two Hart Plaza events I used to attend knowing there were not going to be drunks falling about...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
I like the Daisy-Duke part, it's the "Wad choo lookin' @, bawy?" part I can do without.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hypestyles
Oh, if only Merle were alive to hear the way you ornery varmints talk.
Are you sure you're not thinking of Yosemite Sam?Quote:
Originally Posted by G-DDT
Yup, I suppose the same happened to Old Merle Haggard, RIP. He had a collection of Daisies and musta got fed up with the big hair blocking p-traps, and the grating voices.Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
Good riddance. I actively avoided downtown when that shitshow was going on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by drjeff
From your tone I detect you didn't care much for the hoedown.
I've never been to one but was considering it this year. Now that its moved I'm out. I think they had a great backdrop doing it in Detroit granted the demographics. I feel its like most things today in that its about money and how much someone can make instead of delivering a quality product.
Well, if he's Yosemite Sam, than I'm a sleep-deprived, over-worked horse's pah-toot. Think I better hightail out of this thread while the getting is good, but not before I share this song from off of my favorite Johnny Cash album.Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZsoHV6mg7r8
I believe this is a very accurate observation. Movement is not a inexpensive ticket nor should it be without deep pocketed sponsors.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gannon
I'm not a country music fan but it's more that the clientele of this festival were like the worst offenders of Tigers opening day times 1000.Quote:
Originally Posted by canuck