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A couple of us are having a discussion over the correct local pronunciation of Erskine Street, so I thought I'd throw it out to the experts here in DetroitYes.
Which is the most common local pronunciation and which syllable is stressed?
a) er-skyne
b) er-skihn
c) er-skeen
d) other?
b) er-skihn
or
d) ers-kihn
b) er-skihn
b....er-skihn
B!
At least that's the way the folks at the Roma Cafe [[at rye-o-pell and er-skin) have always pronounced it.
Thanks everyone!
Another fun one is Goethe...although within one block it is actually misspelled Gothe...at St. Jean.
Noticed it just the other day. [[I know how it should be pronounced...)
Goethe figure.....Quote:
Originally Posted by Gannon
[
how about Piquette
I lived on pikette,
its French, Pi kwee
GO-thee, soft "th"Quote:
Originally Posted by Gannon
There's the infamous "Lahser" it is not Lash-er, but Lahs-er. And then there's Charlevoix too.
Goethe - Johann Wolfgang von Goethe pronunciation - ɡətə [[28 August 1749 – 22 March 1832) was a German writer and statesman.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EastsideAl
Having grown up near Riopelle, we never pronounced the "O".. It was Rye-pell.
"pikette" is exactly how it is said in French, not "Pi kwee".Quote:
Originally Posted by slick
As for Erskine, where does the stress go? ER-skihn, or er-SKIHN? Knowing where the stress goes is important. Somebody told me that Macomb was pronounced muh-comb, and I took that to mean MUH-comb. It was later when I learned that it's muh-COMB.
Must be new. The 2009 and 2011 Google street view images show a "Goethe" sign there, but the 2013 image shows the sign and the light pole it was attached to missing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gannon
As a Francophone, no, just stop.Quote:
Originally Posted by slick
Lash-er. Nobody said Lahs-er, at least south of 8 Mile.Quote:
Originally Posted by dguy4evr
How in the world did they get Gratiot = Grass-shit.
Ehhh, I've never really heard people pronounce it like that. It's more "GRAH-shit".Quote:
Originally Posted by Detroitdave
I've heard two possible French pronounciations, "GRAH-tee-o" or "GRAH-syee-o"
LOL I know but either way it's too funny , how are they getting a s from tiot?, Where in the world is the S coming from ? LOLQuote:
Originally Posted by dtowncitylover
How do you pronounce motion?Quote:
Originally Posted by Detroitdave
True , true , I pronounce Mo-shi-tion lol JKQuote:
Originally Posted by ferndalien
Hilarious. Now I finally have a justification for my native french speaking friends!Quote:
Originally Posted by ferndalien
Be thankful that Go-thee and Frood streets don't cross.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Detroitdave
Yes well it's a lot like English really. In French, «Attention» is pronounced Attawnseeawn more or less, whereas in English, it is pronounced: Attenshun. Where is the T sound gone to? What is the «shh» sound all about? Lol
Yeah, I know native Detroiters pronounce it Lash-er, but I suppose they can't read the order of the letters.
The one that I have no clue about is Cadieux.
....Cad-jew.Quote:
Originally Posted by gumby
Stress! Stress! Stress! CAD-jew or cad-JEW?Quote:
Originally Posted by EastsideAl
How about Puritan? Is the T pronounced? Or is it hardly there at all like in "button"?
PURE-it-tan?
PURE-i-n?
How about Moross?
MORR-is?
MORE-ross?
muh-ROSS?
Moross?
For old east siders it's pronounced "Seven Mile"
Vernier.
Vern-ee-er?
Vern-yer?
Kind of like Canadian
Can-ay-deean?
Cana-dyen?
You wulod be sireupsrd how ltitle the oedrr of the lrtetes mrtetas to a radeer as lnog as the frist and lsat ltetres of the wrod are in the ccroert pacle.Quote:
Originally Posted by Don K
As someone who took a few years of German in high school and college, I cringed when I heard anyone say "Go-thee" when I lived in the area.Quote:
Originally Posted by GPCharles
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamtragedy
Yup, I would say Vairn-yay as the closest sounding in French.
And Caddy-er would sound closest to French if you expel the "r" sound at the end.
A lot of these phonemes are hard to reproduce for a native English speaker.
Chene street is pronounced "Shen" in French and, it would have a circumflex accent on the first e like this: Chêne.
What about Dubois? "Doo-boys" or "Doob-wah"?Quote:
Originally Posted by canuck
Weatherman nails [Welsh] town's super long name
Street View
Wikipedia's Llanfairpwllgwyngyll ArticleQuote:
The long form of the name was invented for promotional purposes in the 1860s; with 58 characters it is the longest place name in Europe and the second longest official one-word place name in the world.
"Doo_Bwah"Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
Dee-troit
Duh-troit
Da_Troit
Day-Twaa
Don K...I am a native Detroiter [[Eastside) who always pronounced Lahser Lah-ser and I corrected anyone who said Lash-er...:)Quote:
Originally Posted by Don K
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
It would sound like a cross between dew and dee, you try to average the two sounds and eliminate the oo sound as much as possible. These sounds exist in German and French but don't in English, Spanish and Italian as far as I know.
It might help to relax your jaw if you smoke a doobie and down a Mountain Dew with it.
WDET interviewed one of the Lahser family members last July. He said it was pronounced "Lahhh-sur". @ some point, a streetsign maker misspelled one of the streetsigns. [[he probably took canuck's advice) Here's a link to the story below.Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerDetroiter
https://soundcloud.com/wdet/curiosid...ay-lasher-road
Ok........... I took your advice......... What were........ we......... talking about?Quote:
Originally Posted by canuck
Can't we all agree to disagree dudes, anyone got any munchies?????Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
Yeah, I took my own advice and can't remember my own street name.Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
I believe you pronounce it 'U-R-here"......Quote:
Originally Posted by canuck
Stress! Stress! Stress!Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerDetroiter
Is it DOO-bwah or doo-BWAH? "Doo_Bwah" doesn't tell where the stress goes!
Still wondering about Moross...
My former life as a Sears delivery driver, when I traveled every street longer than 3 blocks in the metro, gave me my linguistic education in Detroit pronunciations. None were more comical than those for Goethe and Freud. [Go-thee and Frood]Quote:
Originally Posted by Hornwrecker
In German the oe [which is the anglicized ö] is most closely replicated as er and th is a hard T. So Gir'-tuh is as close as an English speaker can hope for and hence the comedy of Go-thee.
But when it comes to the ö to Schoenherr Detroiters say Shay'-nurr.
If one knows a little French Liver-noise for Livernois is worth a chuckle too
We do better on Beaubien Bow-bee-yen and almost get close on Charlevoix Shar-luh-voy and actually get the 'oi' ='wah' right in Antoinette An-twah-net..
doo-BWAHQuote:
Originally Posted by Király
muh-ROSS
My favorite pot-head game show:
For a million dollars; what was the last thing we were talking about?
The family pronounces it LAH ser
I can vouch for that--we always said Lash-er...Quote:
Originally Posted by Wesley Mouch
Uh, uh, ummmm, Hey man, was that some kind of buzzer......?Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamtragedy
I'm relieved there remains disagreement about some of these pronunciations. Especially since they are obvious mispronunciations of the originals. Historically, the way people said these names must have been varied and changing to get to where they have. Back when Detroit was collecting a lot more immigrants [[whether from Pennsylvania or Transylvania) hearing that variety must have been much more common. Speak to some immigrants and you'll still find variety today. Local / family / cultural accents are a simple indication of differences in perspective. This gets back to some points raised in the 'Detroit out-migration, in-migration, and the "other"' thread before it derailed.
It's amazing all the ways people say DeKalb within a few blocks of it in Brooklyn. It's a mistake to think there is a specific "New York accent". When people mention it I think "which one?". What they mean of course is the one they consider "typical". But what's typical is a matter of opinion. Even within a common ethnic group there there are differences by neighborhood and recency to the location. It's still a city very in flux, with people like and unlike me constantly moving in and messing things up. I really like that.
My family says a version of LAHser sometimes with a hint of LAHzher [[parents didn't agree), and it was a word frequent in our vocabulary. But those are just two ways. :)
WWJ is always giving traffic reports. They must have some standard pronunciation guide for street names.
I seem to remember JJABA once telling us the hs sounded like the s in pleasure or leisure. Almost all Westsiders I knew said Lasher.Quote:
Originally Posted by bust
I knew a family who lived on Goethe. They pronounced it GO-thay. [[TH as in theme).
How about Stahelin? I lived on Stahelin for over 70 years. When I moved there in 1940, it was pronounced STAY-lin. After whites moved out and blacks moved in, the pronunciation changed to
stah-HAY-lin or stah-HE-lin. The name derives from a German farmer who owned the land. Actually, the current pronunciation is more like the correct German one.
I say SHAR-luh-voy.Quote:
Originally Posted by dguy4evr
Gratiot
Grá - shìt
One of the Farms' more secluded streets seems to be pronounced locally as "Pro-VON-shul". I wouldn't trust any ratatouille or crespeou made there.
When mom married her second husband in the 60s, she moved into his house on Artesian, one block over from Stahelin. I never recall hearing it called anything but stah-HAY-lin, and that was years before whites moved out in any numbers.Quote:
Originally Posted by macster1
I must say that I'm happy someone has finally corrected the Forman Mills commercial with Dequindre comically mispronounced as "dee-KIN-der."
Try Pro-Von-Sal and again, try to mute the "n" in Von.Quote:
Originally Posted by A2Mike
I take this thread to be about how local residents [[maybe of different periods in time) pronounce the names, not how they SHOULD be pronounced.
It was always Sta-hay-lin for me.
Dubois was dewboyz since we were not in France, or we would have lived in 'Detwah'.
Yet Charlevoix was pronounced correctly as well as many other French based street names.
And I'm surprised we got to page three before somebody mentioned 'dik-winder'.
I can't count the number of times I heard la-fye-it or similar variations on Laf-FAY-ette.
I've heard Winder Street in Brush Park pronounced both with a long "i" that rhymes with grinder or finder and with a short "i" that sounds like cinder or hinder.
I'm not 100% sure of the correct pronunciation, but people living in Brush Park today tend to pronounce it more frequently with a long "i."
Based on Silas Farmer's History of Detroit, the street was named for Colonel John Winder [[1804-1897), who owned property at the present intersection of Winder Street and Woodward Avenue.
Is Laf-FAY-ette really how Detroiters say it? Not La-fee-YET the way they say it in Lafayette, Indiana ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Meddle
How about Pontchartrain? I can think of about ten ways to say that one, no idea which one is right.
Hmmm.... see, I've always used and heard used the short i - so, "wind [[as in blowing) -er", rather then "wind [[as in a watch) -er"Quote:
Originally Posted by Bucket
Yup, La-FAY-etteQuote:
Originally Posted by Király
Pontch-a-train.
Wow. I never would have guessed that the stress goes in the middle.Quote:
Originally Posted by EastsideAl
WHERE does the STRESS go?Quote:
Pontch-a-train.
PONTCH-a-train?
pontch-a-TRAIN?
PONTCH-a-train
Out my way, Provençal gets about 4 different pronunciations.Quote:
Originally Posted by archfan
Yosemite off Joyroad:
YOSH-MIGHT
or
Yo-sem-i-TEE
gothee in Detroit. gerta elsewhere
Yeah, I've cross country skied in Yoshmight National Park before.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zacha341
http://travel.nationalgeographic.com...81_600x450.jpg
I recently verified: my dad, who was born in Detroit and attended school there every year until college says LAHzher, finishing it exactly like he does pleasure, measure, and leisure. East sider. My mom, not natively from Detroit, who used it often, says more of a LAHzer than a LAHser or a LAHzher.Quote:
Originally Posted by missn
Did you know Hamtramck is French? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_F...7ois_Hamtramck. Anyone able to pronounce it, in French?
Interesting question, bust.Quote:
Originally Posted by bust
I think your average French speaker would be at a loss with this one. For one thing, it sounds and looks Germanic. A big part of Eastern France has Germanic roots and names. He was born here but I can't find anyone here in Quebec with that last name.
When I first took my wife [[a nice California girl) home to meet the family, we were head out 94 and came up to Cadieux. She can speak French and couldn't wrap her tongue around that one. Every time we're back an hit Cadieux she ask how the hell we get CAD-jew out of that.
The Lahser family was on JP McCarthy's radio show back in the '60's and said they pronounce their name LASH-er.
How about Riopelle and Morang?
REE-o-pelQuote:
Originally Posted by Király
mor-ANG
One thing I've noticed is that some pronunciations seem to have changed over the years. The addition of the trailing s is one of those subtle changes.
For instance: I always remember Livernois being pronounced as "Liver-noy". But increasingly over the years I've heard it pronounced as "Liver-noise", with the final s pronounced. Similarly, in Indian Village, where I spent the better part of my childhood, the middle street Iroquois was generally pronounced as "ear-o-koy" [[although some old timers left out the middle vowel and just said "ear-koy"). Now though I hear neighborhood residents almost universally call it "ear-o-kois". Again, with the last s pronounced. I wonder what accounts for this shift?
There seems to be some difference of opinion over this one. I, and I think most of my family, would say "RYE-o-pel". But I've also heard the middle vowel swallowed or omitted as "RYE-pel".Quote:
Originally Posted by dtowncitylover
You know what Eastside Al, I think I was a bit too quick to answer and I concur with that pronunciation too. Though, I think I've heard both.Quote:
Originally Posted by EastsideAl
How about Pingree? PINE-gree or PING-gree or PING-ree or...? Hard G or not?
The Pingree family members I know pronounce it PING-gree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Király
I always considered myself as reasonably well educated. However, it wasn't until I was nearly forty that I realized the "s" is not pronounced in Illinois. To this day I have to mentally instruct my brain to drop that dang constant.Quote:
Originally Posted by EastsideAl
Kansas and Arkansas????????????????
[QUOTE=Ray1936;502426]I always considered myself as reasonably well educated. However, it wasn't until I was nearly forty that I realized the "s" is not pronounced in Illinois. To this day I have to mentally instruct my brain to drop that dang constant.[/QUO
Constant or Consonant?
[QUOTE=FormerDetroiter;502441]Duh. Note to self. Engage brain before operating fingers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ray1936
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ray1936
You mean to say that when you don't mute the "s" in Illinois, it makes a silly noise?