Campbell Ewald Moving Offices to Ford Field

[jt1]

Disagree. North Warren where Campbell Ewald was is very safe. The bad parts of Warren, no surprise, are along the Detroit border. \.

Paraphrased: If only Detroit would cease to exist, then Metro Detroit would be rid of all it's problems and we would go pack to a world of puppy dogs and unicorns.

When you make statements like you do it is clear you are speaking only from a level of contempt for the city. Sorry that, if it weren't for Detroit, Warren would likely be ranked the top suburb in the world. My sincerest apologies.

[iheartthed]

Disagree. North Warren where Campbell Ewald was is very safe. The bad parts of Warren, no surprise, are along the Detroit border. Point being was I simply said what Fouts said was true. Along with the fact Warren has a functioning government and lower taxes. I personally wouldn't have said since there is no need for political leaders who share a border to get into some sort of spat.

The point I keep trying to circle back to is the people who claim this is going to help the region. It only helps Detroit when you simply move jobs. New jobs would help the region.

He said something true and also, obviously, irrelevant to Campbell Ewald's decision making process.

[Shollin]

Paraphrased: If only Detroit would cease to exist, then Metro Detroit would be rid of all it's problems and we would go pack to a world of puppy dogs and unicorns.

When you make statements like you do it is clear you are speaking only from a level of contempt for the city. Sorry that, if it weren't for Detroit, Warren would likely be ranked the top suburb in the world. My sincerest apologies.

When you try to put words in my figurative mouth, you are just being disingenuous. If only Detroit could adequately control it self, the suburbs that border it would not have to suffer. You completely ignored, again, the point I made that simply moving jobs is not helping anyone but Detroit.

[Detroitnerd]

This is too funny.

[Shollin]

This is too funny.

I'm glad I'm not the only one. I told my wife that the international attention Detroit has gotten for being bankrupt was a positive for businesses moving there and she started cracking up.

[jt1]

If only Detroit could adequately control it self, the suburbs that border it would not have to suffer. You completely ignored, again, the point I made that simply moving jobs is not helping anyone but Detroit.

Again, on behalf of Detroit, I apologize that it is our fault that, due to our failings, the people in Warren are not afforded the opportunity to live the glorious lives they were destined if not for our only shortcomings.

i will also anxiously await your thoughts on the 300 jobs that are moving to Warren. Surely, this upsets you if they are moving from somewhere else in the region.

Would it make it better if I sent a unicorn to Warren city hall to make up for it? It's the lease I can do since I have caused so much heartache to the residents of your fair city.

[jt1]

I'm glad I'm not the only one. I told my wife that the international attention Detroit has gotten for being bankrupt was a positive for businesses moving there and she started cracking up.

Did you also point out the fact that Warren would be an elite, perfect community if not for Detroit. I would expect that she would get a nice laugh out of that too. Well, if you live in North Warren, then it is probably true since you are far enough away from all of those pesky Detroiters.

[Detroitnerd]

How dare any businesses move into our designated regional shithole! How dare anybody reinvest in Detroit and abandon the good ship S.S. Suburbia!

[Shollin]

I guess no one is going to address the point I have been making countless times in this thread on how moving jobs, whether it be CE or Dan Gilbert's host of companies is helping the region. Instead I get some bizzare hyperbole about unicorns in Warren.

[southen]

if we talk about our region as a whole everyone falls under the blanket of detroit. have a strong core and a vibrant downtown makes the region more appealing to anyone looking to relocate. if you dont think that downtowns turnaround is good for the region and state as a whole then you refuse to look at the bigger picture.

warren poached the company in 1978 and fouts tried doing the same with gm just a few years ago. im sure you were making a stink about cities taking other cities jobs in the region then right?

[stinkytofu]

I guess no one is going to address the point I have been making countless times in this thread on how moving jobs, whether it be CE or Dan Gilbert's host of companies is helping the region. Instead I get some bizzare hyperbole about unicorns in Warren.

You have made that point several times and I think some of us had a level of agreement. We would all of course prefer new jobs in the region...while it stinks they are coming from a suburban community, many of us feel that it is better for the region to have a vibrant downtown than have companies scattered around the suburbs.

The problem is you also went on tangents about how Detroit was a horrible place for businesses to locate compared to Warren...and many of your points were soundly batted down.

[mwilbert]

I guess no one is going to address the point I have been making countless times in this thread on how moving jobs, whether it be CE or Dan Gilbert's host of companies is helping the region. Instead I get some bizzare hyperbole about unicorns in Warren.

I think this point has actually been responded to. Detroit, for better or worse, is the brand of the region. Warren isn't. Detroit, specifically the greater downtown area, not Warren, has the potential to attract people to the region. More people downtown is part of that. In my opinion, this means that moving a job from Warren to Ford Field is a net gain for the region.

[Patrick]

if we talk about our region as a whole everyone falls under the blanket of detroit. have a strong core and a vibrant downtown makes the region more appealing to anyone looking to relocate. if you dont think that downtowns turnaround is good for the region and state as a whole then you refuse to look at the bigger picture.

warren poached the company in 1978 and fouts tried doing the same with gm just a few years ago. im sure you were making a stink about cities taking other cities jobs in the region then right?

Did Warren actually "poach" CE or did their mgt. relocate the company on their own?

[Honky Tonk]

Did Warren actually "poach" CE or did their mgt. relocate the company on their own?

They probably relocated on their own to be closer to their major client, [[bread & butter). Now that they've lost them, they have to cut-back, are looking for cheaper facilities, so they're back in the "D". I wouldn't be surprised if Gilbert, Ilitch, Ford, or one of the other players offered them work on the contingency that they relocate. [[coupled with some incentives) Not a bad thing by any means, that's the reality of doing business. And Shollin's right, this isn't growth, just a shifting of locations. If the City & State play their cards right, maybe one day the area WILL attract some NEW out of State, or even International companies. [[like maybe movie companies?)

[Zacha341]

I wonder who will now occupy the CE building in Warren? It's a pretty big foot print, eight or so stories tall. One of the tallest buildings in Warren...

[Honky Tonk]

I wonder who will now occupy the CE building in Warren? It's a pretty big foot print, eight or so stories tall. One of the tallest buildings in Warren...

Is that considered "Downtown" Warren?

[401don]

They probably relocated on their own to be closer to their major client, [[bread & butter). Now that they've lost them, they have to cut-back, are looking for cheaper facilities, so they're back in the "D". I wouldn't be surprised if Gilbert, Ilitch, Ford, or one of the other players offered them work on the contingency that they relocate. [[coupled with some incentives) Not a bad thing by any means, that's the reality of doing business. And Shollin's right, this isn't growth, just a shifting of locations. If the City & State play their cards right, maybe one day the area WILL attract some NEW out of State, or even International companies. [[like maybe movie companies?)

You'll never grow downtown or the rest of the region by attracting companies from out-of-state. You need to grow new businesses like Gilbert and others are attempting at the Madison, Techtown, etc. You can however create an urban environment where these small, entreprenurial young people want to set up shop by having inexpensive rents, vibrant streets, etc. For Detroit, it was necessary to attract a few large employers back from the burbs to lay this foundation. Now hopefully, downtown can move forward on its own.

[Honky Tonk]

You'll never grow downtown or the rest of the region by attracting companies from out-of-state. You need to grow new businesses like Gilbert and others are attempting at the Madison, Techtown, etc. You can however create an urban environment where these small, entreprenurial young people want to set up shop by having inexpensive rents, vibrant streets, etc. For Detroit, it was necessary to attract a few large employers back from the burbs to lay this foundation. Now hopefully, downtown can move forward on its own.

I agree with your assessment. Lockheed-Martin isn't going to relocate to Detroit "just because" of the MNM/Chrysler commercial. You'll have to prove to them Detroit has what they need to conduct a profitable business here safely. Most businesses are concerned about operating expenses, and bottom line, not educating and restructuring Cities.

[Shollin]

I hear about this vibrant downtown and all thats happened is we have rearranged the chairs at the dinning table. Sorry if I'm a bit cynical since I've heard this revival downtown since the 70's. First with the RenCen, then Joe Louis, PeopleMover, Comerica Tower, Stadiums, Casinos, the Kwame devlopments that never were, and now Dan Gilbert riding in on his white horse. I guess now instead of grand ideas of skyscrapers and trams, we're getting back to the basics and building Detroit with bars and 7-11's. People at CE have more than likely laid down roots somewhere and aren't going to move downtown. All that has been done is add to their commute time and cut their pay with Detroit tax. What Fouts said about Detroit's safety is very valid. Outside of this bubble this forum lives in, Detroit's reputation is in taters. Companies don't want to relocate to Detroit because it would be nearly impossible to recruit people to Detroit to live and work. I'm sure St Louis has nice little places to live, but as an outsider I'm not going to move to St Louis. Perhaps this will change Detroit's image, but long and short it's just moving jobs and making it more difficult for most employees.

[Detroitnerd]

I guess I would have to say that it’s more than rearranging the deck chairs on a sinking passenger ship. It’s more like reconfiguring an engine for maximum performance.

Have you ever heard the phrase, “The whole is greater than the sum of its parts”? In other words, instead of having a widely spread-out metro with businesses dropped all over the place, you can organize the metro with a vibrant downtown served by transit, surrounded by bedroom communities of houses and some shops. And that this works very well in cities around the world for maximizing the value of different environments.

There are tremendous economic multipliers when you cluster businesses in a downtown served by rapid transit. Transit employs more people and has a larger economic ripple effect than mere roads. In downtowns served by transit, fewer people hop in their cars and drive away and more people stay for drinks or dinner or dancing. The more closely things are clustered together, the less resources are pissed away on driving everywhere and that means more change in everybody’s pockets.

If we think about it regionally, downtown becomes an employment center that produces an ever-greater number of jobs. And since not everybody will want to live in the city, the economic heat thrown off by the redevelopment of the city benefits the bedroom communities, who have wage-earning residents living in houses and going to the local groceries, nail shops, etc.

And we shouldn’t sniff at this. This is a huge opportunity for our region. In the 1970s, places like San Francisco and Manhattan were dreary, underinvested places with lots of problems and poverty. From the redevelopment of those places, billions of dollars were made. San Francisco became so highly developed that it affected housing values in Oakland and as far away as Sacramento. Manhattan has become so developed that it spread to Brooklyn and there’s even talk of Philly being considered a “sixth borough.”

When you reorganize a city for performance, like fine-tuning an engine, you get more value, more jobs, more money, a higher standard of living for all of us.

The only obstacle is fiercely clinging to the old way of doing things: the attitude that we are not Detroit, that we are 140-odd little fiefdoms all fighting for a dwindling share of an aging, poorer, more provincial population.

[dmike76]

Detroitnerd, that is one of the best posts I've ever seen on this forum. 100% correct. People may not want to move to Detroit YET. But that is on us as a region to change by 'fine-tuning the engine'. When I read comments from short-sighted people on this forun that think the suburbs have it better now than if Detroit was more prosperous, I shake my head.

[gthomas]

Detroitnerd, that is one of the best posts I've ever seen on this forum. 100% correct. People may not want to move to Detroit YET. But that is on us as a region to change by 'fine-tuning the engine'. When I read comments from short-sighted people on this forun that think the suburbs have it better now than if Detroit was more prosperous, I shake my head.

Yes I agree too, people in this region need get out more, visit other major city. We have it all wrong here, I don't know how much more to stress this. We are sooo behind in a lot of things on how to keep and create vibrant cities and regions. You gone learn very soon...The picture is much BIGGER.

[Shollin]

Detroitnerd, that is one of the best posts I've ever seen on this forum. 100% correct. People may not want to move to Detroit YET. But that is on us as a region to change by 'fine-tuning the engine'. When I read comments from short-sighted people on this forun that think the suburbs have it better now than if Detroit was more prosperous, I shake my head.

Who is denying this? What you are doing is taking prosperity from the suburbs and shifting it to Detroit and then try to tell me the suburb is better off. I have supported things like public transit and new development to increase new business in Detroit but we're just shuffling the deck. I'm sure San Francisco didn't reinvent itself by taking businesses from silicon valley and relocating them to San Francisco.

[dmike76]

Yes, you are taking prosperity from the suburbs and shifting it to Detroit. However, if you want to draw people here, Detroit has to be more successful and moving that prosperity to Detroit will be better for this region long term. Look at Chicago. I know many people that moved to the Chicago area partly because they wanted to live near a vibrant downtown. They didn't live there, though. They lived in the 'burbs. Therefore, the burbs benefitted from a successful major city.

[Detroitnerd]

Would the suburbs benefit from surrounding a strong, vibrant, solvent, connected city that has hundreds of thousands of jobs?

This is how you get there.