Detroit Council proposing drastic cuts to various city services

[mam2009]

@ Ray1936
;
They didnt have a quorum for the meeting to discuss the budget crisis plan because one was sick, three were meeting with the financial review team and one had to leave for a conference on official City business. And if they had been there, you would probably still call them "morons" because you wouldn't like the solutions that they proposed for right-sizing the budget! I, for one, am quite weary of folks bashing my elected representatives without being privy to why decisions are made. When you rely exclusively on the media for information about decisions that are being made or considered by our local representative body, you will normally be given a story that is written to highlight conflict and ignore the mundane facts and nuances that lead to those policy decisions.

Why don't you just go straight to the source? My City Council members all have phones and staff; several have websites, etc. that they regularly update. They have monthly meetings in various areas around the City. The Council meetings are shown live online during the day and rebroadcast at night on Comcast and AT&T Uverse. If you want financial information, I know that the Auditor General puts all of his reports online and I think the City Council's Fiscal Analyst does the same. READ, HEAR AND SEE FOR YOURSELF. STOP RELYING ON "JOURNALISTS" WHO ARE TAUGHT IN JOURNALISM SCHOOL THAT A STORY IS NOT A STORY WITHOUT CONFLICT.

[Buy American]

@ Ray1936
;
They didnt have a quorum for the meeting to discuss the budget crisis plan because one was sick, three were meeting with the financial review team and one had to leave for a conference on official City business. And if they had been there, you would probably still call them idiots because you wouldn't like the solutions that they proposed for right-sizing the budget! I, for one, am quite weary of folks bashing my elected representatives without being privy to why decisions are made. When you rely exclusively on the media for information about decisions that are being made or considered by our local representative body, you will normally be given a story that is written to highlight conflict and ignore the mundane facts and nuances that lead to those policy decisions.

Why don't you just go straight to the source? My City Council members all have phones and staff; several have websites, etc. that they regularly update. They have monthly meetings in various areas around the City. The Council meetings are shown live online during the day and rebroadcast at night on Comcast and AT&T Uverse. If you want financial information, I know that the Auditor General puts all of his reports online and I think the City Council's Fiscal Analyst does the same. READ, HEAR AND SEE FOR YOURSELF. STOP RELYING ON "JOURNALISTS" WHO ARE TAUGHT IN JOURNALISM SCHOOL THAT A STORY IS NOT A STORY WITHOUT CONFLICT.

I know you addressed the post to Ray1936 but I feel the need to respond.

Right sizing the budget?? How can you right size the budget and hand out raises when you're asking everyone else to take pay cut and make concessions with their health care? Idiots and hypocrites are what they are and Ray is right.

So sorry you are feeling weary of folks bashing YOUR elected representatives, you put them in office, you are to blame for what's happening in Detroit today. Voting a criminal in as Mayor, voting a council member in because of name recognition, you have been derelict in your duties.
You make it sound so business like when in fact it's next to impossible to get in touch with any of the council members either by email, phone or in person. They are incommunicato because they feel their positions warrant a superior attitude. When Gary Brown spouts off about laying off police officers it is so obvious he has a vendetta against the police force in general...he's a turncoat. He got a raise for a member of his staff, Pugh got a raise [[6K) for his pretty boy Chief of Staff, Brenda Jones got a raise for a member of her staff. What the hell is going on with their minds. How can they justify giving raises out to people when the City is in such dire straits?
I have been retired from the City of Detroit for almost 20 years and I can honestly tell you that there has not been one time that I have called down to the CAY for information regarding my pension or my benefits that I've ever received a call back. Either the lines are all busy, the voice mails are all full, or no one answers the phone...period.

You speak of conflict....well, with all due respect, there is plenty of conflict and it's not all because of journalist. It's very obvious what's going on down there when the council members are handing out raises to their favorites and in the same breath, asking police/fire personal to take another wage concession and to pay more for their health care. There has not been a raise since 2008, they are being asked to take a total of 25% concession since then. That's why there is conflict.

[mam2009]

Are you telling me that no City workers have gotten promotions since 2008, Buy American?! Because that's why Pugh's new Chief of Staff got a raise. I'm not going to try to defend every decision that each individual Council member makes, but the people that I've elected to represent me deserve to be supported by the folks who put them there. If you don't live here, didn't vote for them, don't bother to call them, etc. then go bash your own elected body and leave mine alone.

[mam2009]

And why DID you "feel the need to respond", Buy American? If you don't live here, why all the angst?

[jt1]

And why DID you "feel the need to respond", Buy American? If you don't live here, why all the angst?

The angst is because his precious pension may be impacted. He could not care less about the people living in the city of Detroit, just his pension and the pay of Firefighters and Police Officers.

If it came to helping a current resident or one penny of his pension his choice would be very, very obvious.

[Buy American]

Are you telling me that no City workers have gotten promotions since 2008, Buy American?! Because that's why Pugh's new Chief of Staff got a raise. I'm not going to try to defend every decision that each individual Council member makes, but the people that I've elected to represent me deserve to be supported by the folks who put them there. If you don't live here, didn't vote for them, don't bother to call them, etc. then go bash your own elected body and leave mine alone.

I am telling you that since 2008 there have been no raises to the firefighters/police officers that I know of. In 2008 they took a 10% pay cut, now the City is asking for even more. I am telling you that since this is so, why would Charles Puke, give this guy $6,000 on top of what he makes already, which is substantial. I understand your support, but your head is buried in the sand if you think that YOUR elected officials are out there looking out for you and your best interest, because that's not true. Just look at Puke, he can't handle his own finances and he's handing out money like Detroit is his personal ATM. Kenyatta is or was in foreclosure, and maybe a couple more of YOUR elected officials are having problems financially. Granted, we all have problems with our finances these days, but when you have some elected officials who you trust to do the right thing for YOUR city [[which I never could understand why, all of a sudden, Detroit became a private entity that no one who lives outside the boundries could even speak of). I don't want to say that I did my time in Detroit because that's not how I felt at the time [[except the last few years when my neighborhood became so dangerous to live in)...I loved Detroit...but it has changed, and you know it.
I felt the need to respond just like you felt the need to respond to Ray, you felt he was wrong and I felt you were wrong. The City of Detroit still signs my checks for my pension, so I have every right to feel angry about what goes on there. I feel the same way when people buy foreign automobiles while GM has a big logo on the RenCen and Chrysler has two huge plants on Jefferson....who supports Detroit?

[mam2009]

...I felt the need to respond just like you felt the need to respond to Ray, you felt he was wrong and I felt you were wrong. The City of Detroit still signs my checks for my pension, so I have every right to feel angry about what goes on there. I feel the same way when people buy foreign automobiles while GM has a big logo on the RenCen and Chrysler has two huge plants on Jefferson....who supports Detroit?

You felt I was wrong about asking that folks base their criticism of my elected representative body on more than what the media feeds them???

Do YOU support Detroit? DO you?

[professorscott]

The late and lamented Frank Zappa had an album title that this thread makes me think of. The cover of the album was a rebus puzzle. Some of you will know what I'm talking about and will understand

[jolla]

...but the people that I've elected to represent me deserve to be supported by the folks who put them there. If you don't live here, didn't vote for them, don't bother to call them, etc. then go bash your own elected body and leave mine alone.

1. I don't live in the city of Detroit, but as Detroit goes, so goes the state. When Detroit fails, it pulls the surrounding communities with it; that's why I care. Plus of course, I love Detroit and don't like to see it fail.

2. You seem to be more upset at someone "bashing" your elected body than you do at the poor job your elected body has done. Do you not see the mess that Detroit is and do you not think that the elected body [[over the years, not just the current crop) is at least partially responsible? Your idea that elected officials deserve your support is odd; they are there to serve and support you, not the other way around.

[mam2009]

1. I don't live in the city of Detroit, but as Detroit goes, so goes the state. When Detroit fails, it pulls the surrounding communities with it; that's why I care. Plus of course, I love Detroit and don't like to see it fail.

2. You seem to be more upset at someone "bashing" your elected body than you do at the poor job your elected body has done. Do you not see the mess that Detroit is and do you not think that the elected body [[over the years, not just the current crop) is at least partially responsible? Your idea that elected officials deserve your support is odd; they are there to serve and support you, not the other way around.

I didn't say you shouldn't care or even have a say if you don't live here. My entire point was that those who seek to criticize the Council [[the body, not the individuals) should not rely on the media as their sole source of information about what happens during City Council meetings. There are many other ways to get "straight from the horse's mouth" info. And if you can't bother to pick up the phone, watch via internet, etc, then do not spout misinformation about my elected representative body.

I am not trying to defend any individual members. I am, however, supporting the folks who are elected to represent me. I didn't vote for all of those individuals. I don't like all of those individuals. I don't agree with all of those individuals. But at the same time, I pay attention and I don't have a problem e-mailing them, talking to them at community meetings, and watching the sessions for myself. If you don't live here, the very least you can do is give the body the benefit of the doubt when you hear something on tv that sounds too outrageous to be logical. That's when you should seek clarification. Those of us who live here have an incentive to seek clarification so that we know whether we should vote for individual members in the future. Those of you who don't live here should at least cool down your venomous and half-informed assumptions since you haven't taken the time to seek the facts.

I'm not naive. The Council has made decisions I don't agree with, but I will not denegrate the body that represents me. And I would appreciate it if you didn't either.

To Buy American: When you start being as critical of the Fire Dpt union as you are of the City Council, then I would believe that you are not overly biased against the Council.

And I ask again, Buy American, have there been no promotions of City employees since 2008? And don't promotions normally come with a raise? Pugh's staffer was promoted from a position of less responsibility to the position of Chief of Staff. Yes, it is bad judgement, in my opinion, for him to give the guy a higher pay with his elevated title at THIS time. But the bottom line is that Council as a whole HAS proposed to cut their own office budgets AGAIN by 16% for THIS fiscal year after cutting their office budgets at the beginning of THIS fiscal year by 5%. That's a 21% cut for THIS fiscal year. This is the first time that Council has ever cut their budget in the 17 years that the Fiscal Analyst has been with the Council. How do I know that? BECAUSE I ASKED THE FISCAL ANALYST MYSELF. And I heard Ken Cockrel propose just last week that they take an additional 5% cut for NEXT fiscal year. That sounds like leadership to me.

[mam2009]

But you won't get THAT story in the news because it makes this Council look good. This is probably the most responsible Council we've had in years. Stop with the mindless insults and dig a little deeper.

[Kevgoblue]

But you won't get THAT story in the news because it makes this Council look good. This is probably the most responsible Council we've had in years. Stop with the mindless insults and dig a little deeper.

mmam2009. +1

[mam2009]

And why some folks are soooooo focused on the City Council's budget while ignoring the millions of dollars that could be saved [[and made) by running DPD, DFD and the EMS more efficiently is beyond me.
.

[Zacha341]

All of those things need to be addressed. TOGETHER. It's not an either/ or, thing.

And why some folks are soooooo focused on the City Council's budget while ignoring the millions of dollars that could be saved [[and made) by running DPD, DFD and the EMS more efficiently is beyond me.
.

[Buy American]

And why some folks are soooooo focused on the City Council's budget while ignoring the millions of dollars that could be saved [[and made) by running DPD, DFD and the EMS more efficiently is beyond me.
.

Who runs DPD, DFD and EMS??? More appointee flunkies that are running the departments into the ground. I am not just focused on the council's budget, but I am concerned about the way they are doing things. Just who would make the decisions on how to save or make the millions you're speaking of?
Would they save millions by cutting more salaries? Maybe pay a police officer $22,000 a year and make him/her pay for their own benefits while going out to protect and serve. Quite a few firefighers and police officers purchase their own disability insurance now because the chance of injury or death is with them every day they are on the streets of Detroit. How about cutting the firefighters salary down and cutting off their insurance, while they are running into fires while you are running out?

[stasu1213]

I hope that Charles Pugh is not planning to give his aide a raise so that he[[Pugh) could get a kick back. I hope that the young man doesn't make $76,000 a year and give Mr Pugh some of that money back under the table.

[GoGrixdale]

...I have been retired from the City of Detroit for almost 20 years and I can honestly tell you that there has not been one time that I have called down to the CAY for information regarding my pension or my benefits that I've ever received a call back.

Just wondering if pension payments are/were affected by the recession? Was there a percentage they've been cut?

[Buy American]

Just wondering if pension payments are/were affected by the recession? Was there a percentage they've been cut?

My pension as been affected by the ever raising cost of health care and I get no raises either. I also have to worry about whose hands are in the till like it's their own ATM.