Lafayette Building next on DEGC hit list?

[reddog289]

So much for priorities, As the Packard plant burns again, Something else is gonna go bye-bye.

[Bearinabox]

Thank God for elections. Most of these jackasses in city government will be gone at the end of the year. Hopefully most of the idiots in the DEGC will be gone as well.

You realize these people aren't elected, right?

[Tig3rzhark]

You realize these people aren't elected, right?

I'm aware of that. However when the elections are over in November, if we have a new mayor, hopefully that mayor that appoints these people in the DEGC shall see the light.

[crawford]

That's funny - the "giant decaying vacant tombstone" didn't detour people from putting down non-refundable deposits on those residences.

Considering most of the condos are empty, I wouldn't use this failure as an argument in favor of preservation of adjacent blight.

I suppose you're going to try blaming the entire collapse of the housing market on the Lafayette Building.
.

The housing market is doing fine in many places, even in metro Detroit. Give me a nice home in Birmingham or Bloomfield, and it will sell, and at a reasonable profit as long as you didn't buy yesterday.

[Bearinabox]

The housing market is doing fine in many places, even in metro Detroit. Give me a nice home in Birmingham or Bloomfield, and it will sell, and at a reasonable profit as long as you didn't buy yesterday.

I don't get why you always use Birmingham and Bloomfield to make arguments about Detroit. You might as well use Kuala Lumpur.

[DetroitDad]

Considering most of the condos are empty, I wouldn't use this failure as an argument in favor of preservation of adjacent blight.

The housing market is doing fine in many places, even in metro Detroit. Give me a nice home in Birmingham or Bloomfield, and it will sell, and at a reasonable profit as long as you didn't buy yesterday.

Didn't Bloomfield Hills have a few sets of foreclosure auctions with formerly million dollar homes selling in the $300,000 range recently, and still weren't able to sell some of the homes? These Dark Age Detroit communities [[rich suburbs driven by fear and greed) sell because they can keep out low income individuals by inflated prices based on the "good" school systems and because a few well-known residents reside there. Besides, you are talking about the upper class, who were hit by the financial tsunami, but not nearly as hard as the middle class was and is.

The group of people who would buy a Downtown Detroit Condo has all but been forced out of the market for a decade or so, until the economy completely recovers or condo prices are lowered to what can be paid for in cash. Either way, it still doesn't erase that those people put money down on condos at the Ellington and Book-Cadillac, some of them are now renting instead, while others have taken a few of their places for the cheaper and more realistic prices. So, yeah there were people willing to live in Downtown Detroit despite the dozen or so remaining vacant buildings. I am convinced that these people want an urban environment, and missing teeth are attributed as a major detractors to the urban environment.

Most of the Michigan real estate industry doesn't know squat about what people want in an urban property, and they have not a clue what makes a desirable urban environment.

I'm curious what your stance is going to be when people realize that it will be at least another decade until all but one or two of the dozen remaining towers will remain vacant; 1001, Book Tower, Broderick Tower, David Whitney Building, Metropolitan Building, Free Press Building, Park Avenue Building, United Artist Building, Cass Tech, Charlevoix Building, among others. Will you advocate demolishing them? What about the other vacant skyscrapers we are sure to have in the coming decade? Will you be advocating the demolition of the Penobscot Block, Ponch, Chase Tower, Fisher Building, etc. in favor of surface parking lots or grass if they were to close?

[Huggybear]

That's funny - the "giant decaying vacant tombstone" didn't detour people from putting down non-refundable deposits on those residences.

There were announced plans for the Lafayette Building when the BC was out selling units.

[Strathcona]

You would think that for $1,000,000 they could make the roof waterproof and secure the building. If we could mothboll skyscrapers, you know sometime in the future they would consider us geniuses.

You would also think for about 1 to 1.5 million dollars you could replace all of the windows in the building--making it appear active. New windows, roof and the building is set up for a nice future development while saving 10 million in demo expense.

[Novine]

"There were announced plans for the Lafayette Building when the BC was out selling units."

People who are interested in investing in downtown residential or commercial properties need to learn that the DEGC can't be trusted to stick to their word unless it involves demolition activity.

[Novine]

Huggybear, I have some questions for your bosses at DEGC. Can you get an answer to question #1 and explain the malfeasance demonstrated by #2?

1. Demolition Jackson and his cohorts have to identify today the buildings they have no intent on preserving.

2. Every other building owned or controlled by the DDA must be secured and protected so that it's viable for future use when the economic conditions or other factors make that feasible. That includes improving the street level view so that passer-bys don't have to be subjected to plywood panels or other visual atrocities.

[buildingsofdetroit]

You would also think for about 1 to 1.5 million dollars you could replace all of the windows in the building--making it appear active. New windows, roof and the building is set up for a nice future development while saving 10 million in demo expense.

That was my thought process, too, but the demo contract is for only $1.4 million.

[masterblaster]

I am out of the country for 6 months.
Is the demolition a done deal? Has interior or exterior demolition begun??

Is there any way the demolition could be halted because the preservation community wants to bring in an Architect/Engineer to assessment the the building's condition, and the feasibility of its restoration? Why wouldn't the DEGC/DDA allow that? Can't the preservation community make an uproar in the media about them volunteering to hire an A/E to evaluate the building, and being denied? What little preservationists can do [[hire an A/E) - they aren't even given the opportunity to do. Can't the DEGC's actions be painted as unreasonable in the local media?

I just don't understand what is the big hurry to knock this building down [[and all of those others recently - Tiger Stadium, Adams Theater, Chin Tiki)?
In this current market, this building won't be renovated, obviously. Doesn't the DEGC understand that?

[Hypestyles]

... there are scores of derelict buildings in the residential neighborhoods that need to be demolished first.. why does no one in city government listen.. degc needs to be dismantled..

[Stosh]

By all the noise generated here, you would think that this would be a campaign issue for Detroiters. Unfortunately, this is largely ignored by the candidates, usually. And usually ignored by the majority of Detroiters, as well.

Unless preservationists can engage the majority of citizens of Detroit to action, not just a few, and enact real change in the direction of the DEGC and other similar entities, it's all just pissing into the wind.

[Novine]

"Can't the DEGC's actions be painted as unreasonable in the local media? "

That would require a local media made up of journalists, not stenographers. A good deal of the "news" is nothing more than press releases repackaged as articles and some of the "reporters" are too lazy to even make the effort to rewrite the PRs. We also have our share of "reporters" who think their job is to run interference for the Ilitches and Marouns of Detroit and tell us all how wonderful they are or play the pity violin for these poor, oppressed guys who get nothing but grief for all of the good work that they do.

[kraig]

"No need to dwell on what's pretty much a done deal. The only thing left to do is whine about it and that certainly is being done."

I said that 145 posts ago. Surprise, surprise. You guys are still crying over the same shit. Man up and find something that can still be preserved and preserve it. If you aren't prepared to do anything, shut the hell up about it. Those that can, do. Those that can't, keep crying and complaining on this thread.

[Novine]

Kraig keeps on managing to make it under the bar of low expectations. At this rate, his next post will be a challenge to a fist-fight like CYA and Bill Bonds did back in the golden days.

[crawford]

By all the noise generated here, you would think that this would be a campaign issue for Detroiters.

No, you wouldn't. DYes is not remotely representative of Detroiters as a whole.

Most Detroiters would think you're due for the looney bin if you consider preservation of abandoned, decaying buildings [[immediately adjacent to where there their tax dollars are sunk) an important civic issue.

[heedus]

Kraig keeps on managing to make it under the bar of low expectations. At this rate, his next post will be a challenge to a fist-fight like CYA and Bill Bonds did back in the golden days.

Oh whatever, you're the guy that keeps on twisting comments from anyone who happens to bring a counter-argument or questions the pure preservationist point of view. Even though I agreed that a comprehensive plan was needed and that sealing up the Lafayette and other buildings downtown would be the optimal answer, you [[and many of the other strict preservationists) twisted my comments to sound like I was pro-demolition or advocating for the Lafayette to be torn down.

You guys sure know how to make a staunch Detroit advocate feel pretty unwelcome to the discussion...

[Stosh]

No, you wouldn't. DYes is not remotely representative of Detroiters as a whole.

Most Detroiters would think you're due for the looney bin if you consider preservation of abandoned, decaying buildings [[immediately adjacent to where there their tax dollars are sunk) an important civic issue.

Well, actually that was the point I was trying to make, in a roundabout way. Thanks for clarifying.

I understand this issue is far off the radar screen of the vast majority of Detroiters.

Given with the realities faced every day with DPS, the neighborhoods, lack of jobs, on and on, it's kind of amusing in a way to see the discussion between people that haven't the power or will to preserve a paper clip, much less a building like the Lafayette.

DEGC be damned for what they are doing, but it's the sins of the past 50 years that are finally catching up to the region. And yes, the preservationists are just as guilty. Patting yourself on the back for small successes funded by rich mofo's doesn't cut it. All the tours in the world won't fund restoration of functionally obsolete buildings. Crying about the loss of these buildings is 10 years too late.

[Fnemecek]

By all the noise generated here, you would think that this would be a campaign issue for Detroiters. Unfortunately, this is largely ignored by the candidates, usually. And usually ignored by the majority of Detroiters, as well.

Unless preservationists can engage the majority of citizens of Detroit to action, not just a few, and enact real change in the direction of the DEGC and other similar entities, it's all just pissing into the wind.

Like everything else in politics, how much of a campaign issue this is depends largely on how it's framed. In and of itself, I don't believe anything downtown is a major issue for the bulk of Detroit residents simply because issues in their own neighborhood are so much more pressing.

However, if one were to simply point out that the City of Detroit is spending $1.4 million to demolish a historic building downtown while simultaneously telling its residents that there's no money to demolish the burned-out house on their block then I think you have a lightning rod issue.

[Fnemecek]

"No need to dwell on what's pretty much a done deal. The only thing left to do is whine about it and that certainly is being done."

I said that 145 posts ago. Surprise, surprise. You guys are still crying over the same shit. Man up and find something that can still be preserved and preserve it. If you aren't prepared to do anything, shut the hell up about it. Those that can, do. Those that can't, keep crying and complaining on this thread.

Actually, what you said was that the preservation community should make a list of what we want to preserve and go from there. The problem with that - and the problem that I've pointed out before - is that your argument is based on the assumption that there is a historic building in or around downtown Detroit that the City of Detroit either doesn't control or otherwise won't obstruct redevelopment efforts.

The fact of the matter is that the DEGC simply isn't happy unless they're knocking something down. During a break at the City Council meeting last week, a pair of DEGC staffers were overheard discussing plans to demolish the Book Tower - a building that the City doesn't own and doesn't control; one that isn't interfering with anything. They simply want to knock it down because knocking stuff stuff down is what they do.

As a result, rather than making a list that wouldn't be worth the paper it's written on - as you suggested - we're instead mobilizing to make somekind of difference in this year's elections. If we can change the politicians who enable the DEGC to obstruct economic grown, we can change the DEGC itself.

[Fnemecek]

Heedus:
If you feel that anything that you've posted on this thread has been misconstrued or misquoted then I apologize.

[Fnemecek]

Masterblaster:
Welcome to the forum. I noticed that this was your first of [[presumably) posts.

Unfortunately, while demolition hasn't begun, the Lafayette Building appears to be destined to become a weed and trash infested lot. [[Oh, I'm sorry. I believe the DEGC prefers to call it a "pocket park" that they simply don't have the resources to maintain.)

The Lafayette Building does not currently have any of the legal protections that would normally enable the preservation community to stop a demolition. The Detroit City Council rejected an application for a local historic designation. The State Board has an application on it's agenda for September. [[The process to get the legal protection in place began last December when we learned that this was likely. However, since the Board only meets twice a year and has a very crowded agenda, this was earliest we could arrange.)

If the City of Detroit wants to waste a few million dollars, that's simply something that the City Council and the Mayor will have to explain to the voters in November.

[kraig]

Actually, what you said was that the preservation community should make a list of what we want to preserve and go from there. The problem with that - and the problem that I've pointed out before - is that your argument is based on the assumption that there is a historic building in or around downtown Detroit that the City of Detroit either doesn't control or otherwise won't obstruct redevelopment efforts.

The fact of the matter is that the DEGC simply isn't happy unless they're knocking something down. During a break at the City Council meeting last week, a pair of DEGC staffers were overheard discussing plans to demolish the Book Tower - a building that the City doesn't own and doesn't control; one that isn't interfering with anything. They simply want to knock it down because knocking stuff stuff down is what they do.

As a result, rather than making a list that wouldn't be worth the paper it's written on - as you suggested - we're instead mobilizing to make somekind of difference in this year's elections. If we can change the politicians who enable the DEGC to obstruct economic grown, we can change the DEGC itself.

In other words, you're going to point the finger at the DEGC, give up without even trying and keep on whining? Same old, same old.