Corona Virus Crisis Discussion Thread

[Bigdd]

Virus [[if that's what it is) has been spreading through out the world for about 4 months. At this point, less then 10,000 deaths world wide. Experts are saying there could be hundreds of thousand [[some say millions) of deaths in this country, where we have the best health care in the world. I'm starting to wonder about this, it's starting not to add up.

Exactly my thoughts.

So far we see 9,400 deaths worldwide [[as compared to 646,000 for the flu in 2018, the last year we have data for, which was admittedly a bad year).

And we have 160 in the USA from Covid-19, as compared to 61,099 for the flu in 2018. [[last year we have numbers for)

So in the USA our death rate [[so far) is ONE QUARTER of ONE PERCENT of the flu in '18.

Granted it got a late start here. Had it "already been around", it might have been 2-3 x worse,... and had economy crippling measures not been taken,.. it might have been a couple times worse than that. But even then,.. aren't we looking at something 4% as bad as the flu?

On the world scale,.. that 9,400 v.s. 646k makes it 1.5% as bad as the flu was in '18.

I think the media is off the deep end again.

[softailrider]

Virus [[if that's what it is) has been spreading through out the world for about 4 months. At this point, less then 10,000 deaths world wide. Experts are saying there could be hundreds of thousand [[some say millions) of deaths in this country, where we have the best health care in the world. I'm starting to wonder about this, it's starting not to add up.

I really pray that 6 or 8 months down the road, we look back and say something like what the hell were we doing last March.

[jcole]

I really pray that 6 or 8 months down the road, we look back and say something like what the hell were we doing last March.

[Lowell]

Exactly my thoughts.

So far we see 9,400 deaths worldwide [[as compared to 646,000 for the flu in 2018, the last year we have data for, which was admittedly a bad year).

And we have 160 in the USA from Covid-19, as compared to 61,099 for the flu in 2018. [[last year we have numbers for)

So in the USA our death rate [[so far) is ONE QUARTER of ONE PERCENT of the flu in '18.

Granted it got a late start here. Had it "already been around", it might have been 2-3 x worse,... and had economy crippling measures not been taken,.. it might have been a couple times worse than that. But even then,.. aren't we looking at something 4% as bad as the flu?

On the world scale,.. that 9,400 v.s. 646k makes it 1.5% as bad as the flu was in '18.

I think the media is off the deep end again.

You could be right, and I truly hope so, but you could be wrong.

The problem is that we can't know because testing is so minimal. We are flying blind as we have no idea how many and which people are infected. We also have not seen the effect once this breaks into the open in third world countries with poor medical facilities and, worse yet, areas of military conflict.

[EGrant]

Yes, let's compare data from an entire year of the flu to a few weeks of data of this virus, where we won't even fully test the population to know the total scope of it. You could show symptoms and still not even qualify for a test right now. Look at the exponential spread of infections, and now, deaths. Hopefully we can stave this off and look back and wonder if we should blame the media for "overreacting" but this very much looks like just the beginning.

Once our hospitals become overwhelmed with patients, then we'll have to start deciding who gets treatment and who is turned away to die. We have no cure for this. We don't have enough ventilators to even treat people. Shutting everything down is to give our healthcare system a fighting chance.

[jcole]

You could be right, and I truly hope so, but you could be wrong.

The problem is that we can't know because testing is so minimal. We are flying blind as we have no idea how many and which people are infected. We also have not seen the effect once this breaks into the open in third world countries with poor medical facilities and, worse yet, areas of military conflict.

[Bigdd]

Yes, let's compare data from an entire year of the flu to a few weeks of data of this virus, where we won't even fully test the population to know the total scope of it. You could show symptoms and still not even qualify for a test right now. Look at the exponential spread of infections, and now, deaths.

Flu has a season,.. starts in late Dec to early January, goes until late Winter. Averages about 13 weeks, not an entire year.

This started late Dec in China, and cases were seen here by mid January. So it's been rampant in China for almost an entire flu season, in Europe 3/4 of a flu season, and in the USA for about 1/2 a flu season.


So yeah,.. the USA numbers aren't the best gauge,.. but the world numbers shouldn't be too terribly far off. You'd probably want to at least double them, perhaps triple them. But even then,. that only gets you to 3-4% of expected flu deaths annually.

To be shutting down the economy of the world,.. you'd think it would need to be 5 x as deadly as the flu,... or 35,000 times as bad as what we've seen so far.

[Richard]

As of now we have to be careful interpreting sliding scales of infected,the test results we are seeing now are from tests that were taken a week ago when they first started testing.

Its going to be at least 30 days more before we can really get a good picture of actual results.

The state hit hard was because nursing home workers went to work sick then had a second job at another home and spread it that way,same thing they have been telling us for 100 years,if you are sick stay home,if you child is sick do not send them to school.

[401don]

I would like to see testing of the general population in several states/provinces and other countries to see "where we stand" from a virus penetration standpoint. Anyone who has taken basic statistics knows you only need a random sample of about 400 of a given population to be 95% accurate. Then we could say with some certainty X% of Michigan, Florida, etc. has the coronavirus at this point in time. Obviously it could be much different within parts of denser portions of states but the Federal Gov't should be coordinating random testing to get a useful picture. This should be done weekly to see where we are heading in terms of progress.

[Dan Wesson]

I am going to side with those that think somethings "don't add up".

The MSM is fanning the flames of hysteria.

Things maybe bad but they aren't that bad.

Like Einstein is said to have said...

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe"

and

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits"

Judging by some of the questions tossed out at these pressers the above becomes apparent.

[401don]

Judging by some of the questions tossed out at these pressers the above becomes apparent.

They are pretty funny. You realize any idiot can get a job working for the press. Today, a national columnist asked Trudeau what he planned for retirees to recover their stock portfolios. I could never be a politician. I'd be saying, "Don't worry. I'm topping those back up tomorrow morning. You silly ass hat."

[mtburb]

SMART to reduce service...
https://www.smartbus.org/About/News/...nsDfp5j1TlylHU

[EGrant]

Italy's death toll has now surpassed China's.

Just two weeks ago, Italians also said "this isn't a big deal" and packed bars and restaurants. I hope I'm wrong and my concern was just bolstered by the apparently dark and mysterious "MSM" though.

[Meddle]

I would like to see testing of the general population in several states/provinces and other countries to see "where we stand" from a virus penetration standpoint.

Will any such testing show if you had it and didn't get sick, or only had very minor symptoms and recovered without even realizing it?

[Seven&wyo]

It looks like the sooner a society prepare for the virus the better off they are. With Michigans number tripling it seems like that's a good thing that we're testing more. Italy has a fatality rate if 8% and they were some of the first to be infected and were very casual until it was too late. South Korea on the other hand is only showing 1% fatality rate with it's very aggressive policies.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/fortune...test-data/amp/

[401don]

Will any such testing show if you had it and didn't get sick, or only had very minor symptoms and recovered without even realizing it?

I don't believe it would show if you had recovered. Only if you had it, with or without symptoms, at that point in time. I would think gov'ts would want that information and am surprised they aren't doing it. Maybe they don't have the resources.

[401don]

It looks like the sooner a society prepare for the virus the better off they are. With Michigans number tripling it seems like that's a good thing that we're testing more. Italy has a fatality rate if 8% and they were some of the first to be infected and were very casual until it was too late. South Korea on the other hand is only showing 1% fatality rate with it's very aggressive policies.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/fortune...test-data/amp/

Italy passed China in deaths today and haven't yet peaked.

[jcole]

There is a test that checks for antibodies in the system which would indicate you had had the disease and recovered.I can't remember what it was called but I'll see if I can find it. Found it:
https://www.technologyreview.com/s/6...-19-really-is/

I don't believe it would show if you had recovered. Only if you had it, with or without symptoms, at that point in time. I would think gov'ts would want that information and am surprised they aren't doing it. Maybe they don't have the resources.

[Metro25]

Italy really screwed this up big time.

China however seems to have it under control now. New cases are in the single digits. So saying Italy has more than China isn't as shocking as it sounds.

I've heard things about anti-malaria drugs being effective in treating it. Is this something that could really change the tide?

[Canadian Visitor]

A piece from a reporter here on having her baby in the midst of the Covid pandemic.

https://www.vox.com/platform/amp/202...mpression=true

[Danny]

HOW DID CHINA DID THIS?



1. It started long ago in wet markets. It been around since ancient and pagan times. People slaughtered each clean and unclean animals without government inspection. When modern wet markets appeared, most dead or alive animals are soaked in sanitary chemicals while drowning in their feces. And sell their parts and meats to customers.


2. In China in the 1970s After the Sino-Soviet Split and Mao Zadong's failed Great Leap Forward Plan caused all of China to suffer. Farming in China at that time was state controlled and did not have enough resources to feed its people and growing population. Many people were starving and most nations did not want to support China. By 1978. The Chinese Communist Government gave up their state controlled agriculture and allowed outside private farming and outside foreign corporations. In the meantime the starving Chinese people took drastic measures to hunt,kill and eat any wild animals they could find. The Chinese Communist Government agree to let their proletarians eat,hunt, kill, buy, trade and sell any clean and unclean animals.


3. In 1988 The Communist Chinese Government pass their so called "Wildlife Protection Law." According to Article 3 states: "Wildlife resources should be owned by the state. The state protects the lawful rights and interests of units and individuals in the development or utilization of wildlife resources according to law." Which means the Chinese can use these wildlife animals who are living their nation to be use as resources whatever they want both clean and unclean animals. Also According to Article 17 states:"The state should encourage the breeding and domestication of wildlife. "Anyone who intends to domesticate and breed wildlife under special state protection should obtain a license. Administrative measures for such licenses shall be formulated by the department of wildlife administration under the State Council.'


Notice the word "state should encourage the breeding and domestication of wildlife" This mean all wildlife in China's land, sea and air is state controlled and to be used as a natural resources like gold, silver and trees and oil. Other nations do that but they do not take to extreme because most animal species on the Earth are approaching extinction and they be protected for that our future children can see them instead in look at them in pictures. Also not all animals can't be domesticated. Man tried it for thousands of years and the result is some animals can are accepted to humans other do not. You can take an animal out of the wild you can't take a wild out of the animal.


4. The Chinese were into the wildlife farming breeding and domesticating business. Chinese farmers can sell, buy and trade any clean or unclean animals from anywhere in their lands and foreign areas. And put their fast growing wet markets. As it continue to spread throughout China, the viruses who are inside the host of any animal begin to grow and mutate as well. People go these wet markets [[especially in China) buy any exotic animal dead or alive to wear or eat them and 'voila!' viruses like sars,bird flu and even the deadly coronaviruses enter into them and a global pandemic begins.China needs to get rid their ridiculous wildlife farming and domestication laws and wet markets. Other nations must do to the same. Because once another new virus or bacteria comes out of wild animal host not meant to decoration or consumption. Humanity will be doomed into extinction like the dinosaurs we are!

[Danny]

At what point does the auto show get cancelled? Design planning for it should be going on now, is that actually happening?

Chances are The N.A.I.A.S. will be cancelled. Lot's of people mostly are coming from Europe and Japan. And may see less participation.

[401don]

Italy really screwed this up big time.

China however seems to have it under control now. New cases are in the single digits. So saying Italy has more than China isn't as shocking as it sounds.

I've heard things about anti-malaria drugs being effective in treating it. Is this something that could really change the tide?

The U.S. screwed up big time compared to South Korea, which has done far more testing. Both countries got their 1st cases at the same time. It's all relative.

[401don]

Toronto is now closing ALL retail businesses except non-essentials - gas, food & pharmacies.

[Lowell]

Toronto is now closing ALL retail businesses except non-essentials - gas, food & pharmacies.

Cannabis and alcohol stores too?

Pot Sales Jump as More People Stay at Home