2011 Detroit Lions

[gnome]

Aw shit, that is bad news about Follett. Likable guy in his zany Zachiness, I'll miss his vim, but you can't mess with the knoggin ' cuz that can lead to a short lifetime of drooling in your soup.

The "expert" thing ... you guys might not be Valentti style stat machines, but I have consistently learned from this thread.

[firstandten]

It's hard to judge an OL effectiveness or lack of by stats. Sacks are difficult because some QB's hold the ball too long, or dink and dunk so much there is no way you can get to them. Rushing is a better but not complete indicator. People blame the lack of rushing yards on the running back, I tend to mostly blame the OL. I am of the opinion that if the running back can't get past the LOS then its the OL. If their is no hole to run thru then its tough to get yards. I judge running backs on stats like YAC. I definitely don't judge a OL on one play like with Peppers, but if it becomes a habit, then there is something to be said.

All in all judging an OL tends to be subjective, it requires looking at them which is tough since everyone wants to look at the ball action.

[GOAT]

Rookies seem to hold on the ball longer than veterans so if we had Stanton in there I would expect more sacks and that wasn't the case. As much as I don't like the OL, they did a good job last year.

Follett will be missed. I liked him on special teams and I liked his intensity. Something that is missing in football today [[or not allowed. After all it really has become the No Fun League).

I really don't know what the Lions record will be this year because the NFC North is aboiut to become a powerhouse division for the next 2-3 years. The only thing I will say is that Detroit will split every game within their division except for perhaps GB who may sweep us this year. Other than that who knows??

[ejames01]

I don't know about that. Chicago & Minnesota are on the decline to me.

The Bears offensive line will likely be WORSE and their FA pickups consisted of bad & injury prone players. Roy Williams? Chris Spencer [[Injury prone), Ghoulston? Okoye, Barber [[injury prone). Plus they lost Olin Kreutz and Daniel Manning.

The Vikings replaced Sidney Rice with Michael Jenkings and also lost Ray Edwards, Kevin Williams will be suspended for 5 games and Pat Williams is done. We can also look forward to Donovan McNabb getting terrorized by Suh again. They did sign Charlie Johnson at LT, but he is horrible last year playing for the Colts.

Rookies seem to hold on the ball longer than veterans so if we had Stanton in there I would expect more sacks and that wasn't the case. As much as I don't like the OL, they did a good job last year.

Follett will be missed. I liked him on special teams and I liked his intensity. Something that is missing in football today [[or not allowed. After all it really has become the No Fun League).

I really don't know what the Lions record will be this year because the NFC North is aboiut to become a powerhouse division for the next 2-3 years. The only thing I will say is that Detroit will split every game within their division except for perhaps GB who may sweep us this year. Other than that who knows??

[Downriviera]

I'm really bummed about Follett. I was so happy to hear he was in camp, and now this. I agree that we get too stat happy at times, with the final score and standings being the only stats that really matter. I like to look at the intangibles, and I think the best thing is the new attitude. I've never been a Raiola fan, but he seems really pumped up, and I think the O line has gotten better. Genesyxx seems convinced that Stafford can't stay healthy and that must be his reasoning for wanting him as a backup. I of course strongly disagree and think Stafford is clearly our #1 and best chance. But if he doesn't make it through the first three games without getting hurt then maybe Genesyxx is smarter than all of us.

[kenp]

We need one more corner now, somebody that can contribute.
And is there a O-lineman worthy of a look. Probably to late at this point.
The new MLB is really going to help, a steady solid player.
This year is going to be key in establishing a running game. You cant win without stopping the run and runnning the ball on offense. I know the stopping the run part is all set. Now its time to see what we can do on offense.
Here is my crazy Lions perdiction and I know it will be shot down but here goes
Leshoure runs for 1000 this year.

[ejames01]

I we are set at CB. Houston & Eric Wright are legit starters and Aaron Berry, Vasher and Alphonso Smith are pretty good in reserve. The running game should be great IF Backus & Cherilus get healthy. Leshoure is a bruiser and Best has his quickness and speed back. My only concern is keeping that offensive line healthy.

We need one more corner now, somebody that can contribute.
And is there a O-lineman worthy of a look. Probably to late at this point.
The new MLB is really going to help, a steady solid player.
This year is going to be key in establishing a running game. You cant win without stopping the run and runnning the ball on offense. I know the stopping the run part is all set. Now its time to see what we can do on offense.
Here is my crazy Lions perdiction and I know it will be shot down but here goes
Leshoure runs for 1000 this year.

[gnome]

Fairley has a broken foot and had surgery this afternoon. Twitter sez he'll be out for almost all of training camp.

Even if the timeline is accurate, this is still bad news. Not horrid, just bad.

Based the Shwartz's travkrecord of having closed mouth sickness, I am going to guess it will be a 4 or 5 games into the season before we see Fairley.

Hope I am wrong

[ejames01]

I'm very disappointed, but at least they are not depending on him to start. We still have Suh, Williams, Hill, Fluellen.

Fairley has a broken foot and had surgery this afternoon. Twitter sez he'll be out for almost all of training camp.

Even if the timeline is accurate, this is still bad news. Not horrid, just bad.

Based the Shwartz's travkrecord of having closed mouth sickness, I am going to guess it will be a 4 or 5 games into the season before we see Fairley.

Hope I am wrong

[ejames01]

Has anyone gone to any of the open practice sessions? I went Saturday, and was very impressed with some of what I was able to see up close.

[smogboy]

What concerns me and is also a relief is that both Backus & Cherilus is injured during training camp. They really haven’t been bumped, shoved or challenged by an opponent bent on beating them yet. Once the season starts and they really get a good working over nagging injuries can tend to get worse- not better. The flipside to this is that it IS during training camp where they can take it a little easier and administered to. They’re still about a month and a half away from playing their real first game so we can only hope that the Lions have some magical electrical stimulators, salves, voodoo or some other form of quick healing.

That being said I think this is the shot across Mayhew & Lewand’s bow that the offensive line is going to need some depth and some re-stocking within the next few years. While I think we can do pretty well with this bunch, they’re not getting any younger. It was nice to see Corey Hilliard step in last year and do a number on a Pro Bowler like Clay Matthews, but we’re going to need more performances like that from the likes of Donald Thomas, Dylan Gandy, Jason Fox, and Johnny Culbreath in the next few years. I also think Schwartz & Scott Linehan also have to come up with schemes for the current offensive line to work better as a running unit. They need to be able to kill the clock, possess the ball, and do some of the ugly ground game that’s the hallmark of a better well-rounded team. Granted it’s difficult to stop by most teams, we can’t solely rely on Calvin Johnson going to the corner on a fade route every time we’re in the red zone. I’m not advocating gimmick plays but I think it’d do this team well to have some ground game to their vaunted aerial attack. While I was left shrugging my shoulders at the Titus Young selection at this year’s draft [[I did it for the Pettigrew pick a few years back too and so far it’s worked out well for us) I was also equally pleased with the Mikel LeShoure pick. Along with LeShoure, having a healthy Jahvid Best, the beasts at tight end, and Stafford’s quick release will also help with making it easier for the offensive line.

Like with any other team, much less championship caliber teams the team’s long term health will be paramount to any success. Our team did alright with that rag tag bunch in the secondary and still managed four straight wins at the end of the season. If we can somehow stay healthy and keep the starters performing at a high level, I think we can contend in the tough NFC Central. It’s not going to be easy and if we’re going to make any sort of playoff run I think we’ll have to make it as a wild card team; I’m not convinced we have the experience or the talent to supplant Green Bay just yet. But given our schedule I think we still should be able to [[dare I say it now?) have a winning record for the first time in ages.

And before I get accused of sipping the Kool Aid from the bong, this has got to be the most optimistic we Lions can be at the beginning of the year. There hasn’t been a huge turn over from last year and I thought we made some pretty good progress as a team last year. I thought we were actually better than our record showed last year; we had a few games that we could’ve and should’ve stole. One thing that I’m glad to see is the consistency we’ve had at coaching and I think that will help. Even an impact player like Stephen Tulloch that we’ve brought in is familiar with Schwartz. In years past we’ve constantly screamed for overhaul and this is honestly the first time in a long while where I see this team’s consistency being an asset. It speaks volumes as to its growth and stability. We’ve actually got a core group of players that we want to keep for once and [[get this!) other teams covet.

So let’s get our training camp casualties healed up, play some meaningful football and get fired up for this team again. Before long it might be time to start asking one another for their pre-season predictions. I’ll stick my neck out there now and make a bold prediction of 9-7. Any others??

[smogboy]

Fairley has a broken foot and had surgery this afternoon. Twitter sez he'll be out for almost all of training camp.

Even if the timeline is accurate, this is still bad news. Not horrid, just bad.

Based the Shwartz's travkrecord of having closed mouth sickness, I am going to guess it will be a 4 or 5 games into the season before we see Fairley.

Hope I am wrong

I kind of like the fact that Jim Schwartz keeps it close to the vest. I don't think he owes it to us fans as to players and their injuries. I don't see this aired in hockey and I really don't see the need for us to know complete details of Fairley's injury. This has been the policy in New England for as long as I can remember. I'll admit I'm curious because I want to see Fairley and Suh on the field wrecking havoc but I'll be patient. I also admire the fact that Schwartz seems pretty up front with his players and doesn't seem to be coaching them through the media. We've seen far too much of management [[in particular Millen) spouting off veiled comments about their own players in the press without addressing them personally. It shows a lack of respect and tact; I like the notion of Schwartz staying mum, protecting his players' privacy, and keeping things in perspective.

[Thruster315]

The new MLB is really going to help, a steady solid player.

Here's food for thought about Tulloch that was brought up the other day by Mike Valenti on 97.1 FM. It literally scares me to the core and we had best be prepared for it next year. Tulloch signed a one year deal. He's also represented by Drew Rosenhaus who is notorious for holding out players and busting management to giving up thick contracts. He was second in the NFL last year in tackles [[159) while playing for a piss poor Tennessee Titans team.

Now imagine him playing behind our vaunted defensive line. He's going to have a banner year with tackles, sacks and all sorts of other great stats. Partially because of his talent but also because he's playing behind what some perceive to being the nest D-line in the NFL.

What's he going to command at the end of the year especially if he does have that great year? Is he [[and Rosenhaus) going to demand the sun, moon, stars and Old Man Ford's left kidney in the subsequent contract? We've also got Calvin's contract coming up soon too. If you're the Lions brass choices will have to be made. We might enjoy Tulloch for one season now but if he gets crazy in his demands- we could be back to shifting Levy back in the middle and looking around for help in the 2012 Draft or free agency again.

I'm all for locking up Calvin Johnson long term if we can. We get that chemistry between Stafford & Johnson going and keep them together as long as we can. On paper, they've got the goods for some serious excitement for years to come.

[ejames01]

What is wrong with Titus Young and why would "Muscle Tightness" keep him from practicing.

[gnome]

S.B., I don't mind the Tight Lips from Schwartz & Co, I am just trying to read the tea leaves. From past history, we've seen that all injuries are under reported, and overly optimistic with return-to-action dates. Hence, with Fairley, I 'm thinking we are not going to see him for a long time.

Thurster, last year the Titans couldn't tackle to save their lives, leaving Tulloch almost the only guy who could tackle. This yr he'll be teamed with at least 6 studs, each one getting their fair share of stops. Tulloch should have a good yr but I don't see him Hoovering up everything like Sam Huff or Butkis did.

[kenp]

So let’s get our training camp casualties healed up, play some meaningful football and get fired up for this team again. Before long it might be time to start asking one another for their pre-season predictions. I’ll stick my neck out there now and make a bold prediction of 9-7. Any others??

I am saying 8-8 but it depends on Stafford.
I will need a hit off your bong before I can go any higher, in wins that is

[smogboy]

I am saying 8-8 but it depends on Stafford.
I will need a hit off your bong before I can go any higher, in wins that is

I was originally go with an 8-8 prediction as well but looking at the strength of the schedule I took a flying leap of faith and gave our team one additional victory. I thought the schedule last year was a lot tougher and we still nearly came away with a few more wins than the record showed. But like you said, one significant injury or a handful of them could shred this team back down to 6-10 in a heart beat.

The one major improvement that I saw last year that didn't appear in any of the stats was the team's willingness to compete. I don't really recall them taking a breather or letting up in intensity with the possibility of the fourth quarter in the New England game where they magically imploded [[or was that Tom Brady magically shredding us?). They seem to be playing for one another and they seem like a cohesive bunch compared to other years where it's us- the defense and you- the offense. They seem to be accountable to one another and this is where a signing of Vanden Bosch brings so many other elements to the table. There's a renewed sense of commitment and dedication that I don't recall seeing in a long while.

My sincere hope is that they haven't heard the Peter Kings of this world and think they're going to the Super Bowl after game one. They still have to work hard, play hard and prove to all of us long suffering fans that there is improvement. Yes, we get hyped over every new draft with the influx of some top collegiate talent but I want to see the second to fourth year guys really rise to the top of their class now. We've nearly rid ourselves of most of the Millen stench so let's see what the careful guided hand of Mayhew and Lewand have done since. I see it as steady improvement but with that improvement, we still need to set realistic goals. We've also got a lot of players with one year contracts or at the end of their original contracts wanting a break out year. They've still got to play as though they deserve another contract, much less a pay increase or an extension.

Optimism reigns supreme for every NFL team at this time of year. I called a 5-11 record last year and was pleasantly surprised when they exceeded my expectations. I'm even hoping they're going to surprise me again or I get it dead on this time around. So take a sip of Kool Aid, chug from the keg, or huff from the bong one more time if you need to now. We might all regret making these bold predictions months from now but that's also the nature of being a fan.

[Downriviera]

Stafford healthy 10-6. Stafford on the shelf, 8-8

[gnome]

Oh man, I am so ready to sip the sip of delusion. The cup of promise. The smokey bowl of hope and change. I want so much to believe, I ache.

And then I remember how many times the Lions have played Lucy to the Charley Brown of my heart. Plum. Landry. Danielson. Barry and Billy Sims. The Lomas guarantee to beat the Eagles.

Like ashes in my mouth.

Still I want to believe.

11 - 5

[Thruster315]

Oh man, I am so ready to sip the sip of delusion. The cup of promise. The smokey bowl of hope and change. I want so much to believe, I ache.

And then I remember how many times the Lions have played Lucy to the Charley Brown of my heart. Plum. Landry. Danielson. Barry and Billy Sims. The Lomas guarantee to beat the Eagles.

Like ashes in my mouth.

Still I want to believe.

11 - 5

HOLY CRAP! You must've taken a triple hit off of smogboy's bong in order to make this bold of a prediction! Damn! I'm optimistic but not that gung-ho. An 11-5 record would be unheard of and amazing. I see loads of upgrades and improvement but I can toke from that pipe just yet.

Like kenp, put me down for a sober and safe 8-8.

Now don't think I'm bagging on your pick, gnome. If I recall you were the one who aced last year's prediction with the 6-10 early on. Who the hell am I to bet against someone with your Miss Cleo psychic skills? I hope you're dead-on right because if you are, this town is going to be painted blue & silver and fans are gonna be foaming at the mouth. So while I take the wienie safe bet of calling an 8-8 record I hope you're right.

[firstandten]

Assuming there are no injuries of note we could be looking at 9-7. We all know however that there will be injuries and the key is if the Lions have enough talented depth players to keep the train rolling when the injuries start hitting and we know around the middle of the season, they will hit. They hit every team in the NFL.

I'm not sure yet if they have that depth yet so I will go with 8-8

[Thruster315]

I'm seeing a trend here from the people that have spoken up with their far flung predictions:

smogboy 9-7
kenp 8-8 sober; possibly more with a hit to the bong
downriviera 10-6 with the caveat of a healthy Stafford
downriviera 8-8 without Stafford
gnome 11-5
firstandten 8-8
-and my call at 8-8

So far all of us have predicted at least a .500 season. What happened? All of the naysayers and bandwagon jumpers scramble off and have become Eagles fans alluva sudden?

I don't have an issue with someone if they think we'll be less than that but give me some evidence that this bunch will collapse like a house of wet toilet paper. The excuses that this team still sucks because they're owned by Old Man Ford are well... about as old as Old Man Ford himself. We can't flog on Millen's sorry ass any longer although we still have a few of his draft picks. The history of this franchise in our lifetime sucks and it's documented already. We get it. But let's enjoy the Lions butter for awhile. We finished strong last year. We've got stability. And I dare say we're trending up. If you disagree... bring it on.

[gnome]

Now don't think I'm bagging on your pick, gnome. If I recall you were the one who aced last year's prediction with the 6-10 early on. Who the hell am I to bet against someone with your Miss Cleo psychic skills?

Even a blind squirrel finds an occasional acorn. FYI , I've sent my official Miss Cleo turbin out to be blocked and steamed. It should be back before the Tampa trip.

[kenp]

The smokey bowl of hope and change.

Thats funny

[kenp]

Just heard the awful new, Leshoure is out for the season with a torn achilles.
This is going to hurt, he was being counted on to gives us a solid contribution in a area of weakness.
We better start looking around, we need to run and Best isnt the answer.