What Cities have lost 1 million residents?

[Danny]

Yes, I see New York City had a similar drop like Chicago, around 800,000 but New York bounced right back.

New York bounce back to new population of 8,390,000 in 2009 due to DONALD TRUMP'S and WALL STREET'S real estate and gentrification schemes. Just tow out the poor, homeless for the downtown to uptown. The City of New York did its part of banned all Porn Shops from Time Square and lure theatre, T.V. and movie industry from California there. Give them tax breaks for a couple of years and the plan really worked.

[DetroitPlanner]

ah..natural disasters dont count.

try again...

We need a city in the world that lost 1 million residents excluding causes from war or natural disasters.

But economic disasters do count?

[ghettopalmetto]

The big majority of the people who 'left' the City of Detroit did not leave. They moved to another part of the city that happened to be under a separate municipal government. To wall off the City of Detroit makes for interesting statistical games but does not speak to the population realities of the actual international city in which we live.

By contrast, in Gistok's example of Rome, along with the vanished cities, the population loss was actual. The population did not move to the suburbs.

Had Detroit not ended regional annexation beginning in the 1920's we would not be having this debate. There would be no one million loss, just a continual albeit slowing growth. Just because politicians carved up a city into separate governments, does not cancel out the fact that we are one family of communities and one city that has grown continually.

I understand what you're getting at, but when it comes time to balance the budget and provide services within the City of Detroit, that "wall" DOES matter. You can't sit here and argue that just because a place like Columbus has annexed cornfields non-stop for 35 years, that they've managed to avoid problems of urban decay and abadonment. It's just become hidden amongst all the shiny craptastic plastic chain junk that they've built on the periphery of the "city".

With that said, "Detroit" has only grown geographically for 35 years. The population is the same as it was in the mid-1970s. The only difference is that much new infrastructure has been constructed since then, and when you essentially double your physical size while retaining essentially the same tax base, some areas are going to suffer.

[Pingu]

Lowell totally nails it. Strip away the archaic political boundaries, and consider the real Detroit as everything that falls within defined population-density contours, and Detroit still kicks ass. Sure, within these contours we're still segregated, and there are varying levels of civic success, but as a whole things haven't changed much, other than everything's been scaled up a bit, white and black.

[woodwardboy]

Lowell totally nails it. Strip away the archaic political boundaries, and consider the real Detroit as everything that falls within defined population-density contours, and Detroit still kicks ass. Sure, within these contours we're still segregated, and there are varying levels of civic success, but as a whole things haven't changed much, other than everything's been scaled up a bit, white and black.

It's strange that the city itself, Detroit, is glossed over or excuses made why Detroit really isnt in a state of decline. Most cities in the world never reach the 1 million mark. That milestone is a major event and a source a pride for a city to reach 1 million. For a city to lose 1 million residents to other areas around the city itself indicates severe issues within the city. No other city in the world has been hollowed out like Detroit has been.

[bartock]

Rome lost 1 million residents but that was due to "barbarian" invasions. Anyone else have any city that lost 1 million resident; not due to war or natural distasters?

London from the 50s to the 80s-ish?

[Pingu]

It's strange that the city itself, Detroit, is glossed over or excuses made why Detroit really isnt in a state of decline. Most cities in the world never reach the 1 million mark. That milestone is a major event and a source a pride for a city to reach 1 million. For a city to lose 1 million residents to other areas around the city itself indicates severe issues within the city. No other city in the world has been hollowed out like Detroit has been.

"No other city in the world" has had to simultaneously absorb a massive influx of agrarian peasants and deal with the decline of demand for its manufactured products. All things considered, I don't think we've done too badly. Let me throw it back at you: What could we have done differently? Assuming, of course, that the existing and archaic political boundaries form a relevant template for this debate.

[bartock]

Detroit is not unique when it came to "absorbing agrarian peasants." St. Louis, Chicago, Milwaukee, Cleveland, New York, Indianapolis, Kansas City etc. all had their share of peasants from the south invading their cities. Only Detroit allowed the "patients" to run the assylum.
What made Milwaukee or Chicago or Cleveland different from Detroit? Why did the white residents stay and fight in these cities?
Why did Detroit's whites flee instead of fighting?

I'm curious as to what your answer to these questions are.

[English]

I'm curious as to what your answer to these questions are.

I am too. This poster seems to be obsessed with the fact that Detroit is 85% black.

[Pingu]

Detroit is not unique when it came to "absorbing agrarian peasants." St. Louis, Chicago, Milwaukee, Cleveland, New York, Indianapolis, Kansas City etc. all had their share of peasants from the south invading their cities. Only Detroit allowed the "patients" to run the assylum.
What made Milwaukee or Chicago or Cleveland different from Detroit? Why did the white residents stay and fight in these cities?
Why did Detroit's whites flee instead of fighting?

<snip-snip-snip> ... every time I hit the sweet spot on my Louisville Slugger every window within a one-block radius would have been at risk of being smashed. ... <snip-snip-fricking-snip> ... Speaking of radius, wood-dude, you're making me nervous. When you get smart-bombed, I don't want to be collateral.

[bartock]

It seems to me, that recent immigrants, or the lack thereof in Detroit during the 1930s-1960s may have played a role in its demise.

Compaired to other cities of this time period [[1930s-1960s) Detroit had a lower percentage of its population being foreign born. With the same pressures of southern blacks coming to its cities, northern cities with a higher foreign born population seemed to better stand their ground in their neighborhoods rather than flee like white Detroiters did.
So to answer your question, we can not undue the past, but we can pursue the future. Detroits answers to its problems today would be a massive influx of immigrants.
Make a deal with say, Iraqis wanting to leave their homeland. Give them greencards but they would have to stay in the city of Detroit or return to Iraq.
These immigrants will fight like mad to stay here in Detroit rather than return to Iraq.
Detroit must be willing to encourage the types of people willing to fight for their neighborhood, and immigrants will fight.

But your question was more about "why didn't whites stay and fight" - for whatever that means.

In my experience on this forum, most posters bring their point, issue, agenda, etc.; others respond, and sometimes interesting discourse ensues. No one need the "why do you think?" hypotheticals, which I think treads on primrose path territory. Just bring it, man, state your point, position, agenda, whatever. When you pound on 85% black this, and why do you think whites left that, it is hard to believe the point you are getting at is residency requirements for lax greencards to pseudo-political refugees. Let's go!!

[bartock]

[quote=woodwardboy;203480]Detroit did not have a sufficient foreign born population to fight off black instrusion. Dearborn and Hamtramck for example had high foreign born populations that are able to fight off black intrusion. Highland Park had low foreign born population and see what happened.
Having a high black population directly corelates to poverty, crime and social problems.[/quote]

Instead of starting several threads and hijacking another, you should have just made your hypothesis a thread topic.

[R8RBOB]

Detroit did not have a sufficient foreign born population to fight off black instrusion. Dearborn and Hamtramck for example had high foreign born populations that are able to fight off black intrusion. Highland Park had low foreign born population and see what happened.
Having a high black population directly corelates to poverty, crime and social problems.

This nonsense should be on the Glenn Beck show. High Black population!! Foreign born population!! What weed are you smoking on?

Hamtramck is home to many immigrants so yes they did keep many Blacks but not all of them outside the city limits. Hamtramck if you heard is on the fast track to filing bankruptcy so those foreign born and their kids can suffer the pain all alone.

How much do you know about Dearborn? Are you aware that Orville Hubbard's motto was "Keep Dearborn Clean?" Do you remember the non-resident ban that Dearborn enacted back in the 80's to keep Detroiters out of Dearborn parks? This was not the work of foreign born people as you attempting to point but by Whites.

You are aware that foreigners didn't move into Dearborn until the 70's and that was when the Hubbard administration was fighting to keep Blacks out after Civil Rights. What better way to stop the Blacks at the gate by inject a class of people that Blacks would have frosty relations with. The A-rabs. A-rabs [[now I know they are called Arabs but to properly represent the mindset of Detroiters, they are A-rabs) didn't have anything to do with keeping Blacks out, they were just an determent nothing more.

[Al Publican]

Since the 1990 Census Charlotte, NC has gained over 200K warm bodies. Charlotte now has a pop. of around 760K making it the states most populous city. Everyone here seems to be from NY State, PA, Mich, and other points north. As a result, the southern accent seems not to be the dominate tongue in the city.

Detroit, where I was born at Jennings Hospital on E. Jefferson, should put out the welcome mat for immigrants, legal and illegal, to attract more residents. Give away parcels of vacant land with the provision that something has to be built or grown on it. Tell the lumpen proletariat to do what Coleman Young said in 1973: "Hit 8 Mile."

[R8RBOB]

Amen.. Detroit needs to welcome ALL people. Also, the Detroit attidude needs to go. No other city in the world has lost as much as Detroit. Detroit lost its industry, its people, and its culture. All replaced by a hostile attitude against anything from the "OUTSIDE"

Dude, Detroit lost people like you and good fucking riddance. Stop watching Glenn Back and listening to David Duke.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

Detroit did not have a sufficient foreign born population to fight off black instrusion. Dearborn and Hamtramck for example had high foreign born populations that are able to fight off black intrusion. Highland Park had low foreign born population and see what happened.
Having a high black population directly corelates to poverty, crime and social problems.

Who is this clown? So being black directly corelates to poverty, crime and social problems? White people don't suffer from some of the same things? Are you crazy? What a f_ckin racist comment.

[R8RBOB]

So fearing people from the "outside" is good?
Beck and other white racists should go into business with the Detroit attitude.

I fear no one but like Beck, you are creating imaginary realities in your head. What Detroiters have you associated with gave you your view on Detroit?

[Bong-Man]

In 1940, Buffalo New York had a population of 575,000. Today that figure is about 250,000. They were once ranked 15th in city population. They are now 49th.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

In 1940, Buffalo New York had a population of 575,000. Today that figure is about 250,000. They were once ranked 15th in city population. They are now 49th.

Point being?

[Al Publican]

Detroit's demise is about class, not race. The small business class in Detroit is near non-existent. Most of the newly built commercial occupancies are for corporate outfits like Rite Aid and Payless Shoes.

My major at Detroit Denby High in the '60s was called "retail co-operative" when I worked and gained school credits for doing so; in 11th and 12th grades I got out of school everday at 11:30am, even when I didn't have to go to my job.

Booker T. Washington was a proponent of learning skills and self-empowerment through business ownership. That's what Detroit needs today in its schools.

[GOAT]

Yes Rome lost a million people but gained many more back when they cleaned up the sewers and removed teh trash. The same needs to apply to Detroit. The ghetto-hoods and the filthy scumbags need to go.

[menckensghost]

Detroit's demise is about class, not race.

Most of the problems in modern politics are about class not race. Race is a very convenient way do distract the masses from the real issue.

I haven't seen anyone talk about Detroit's population in relation to the overall U.S. population. When Detroit's population was at it's zenith in the 1950's and '60's the overall population of the U.S. was between 150 and 180 million. Now the U.S. population is approaching 310 million.

[English]

Also you have modern conveniences such as air conditioning making the Sun Belt more liveable.

[Patrick]

Don't know if Roma lost a million after 410 but it was near 25,000 in what was considered the Dark Ages. Really, Rome's cousin, Constantinople, had a population of over a million at that time. I guess this is maybe 700AD or so.

[CLAUDE G]

The question is when is Detroit going to hit rock bottom, where the only direction we can move is up?

First of all, although I do not agree with all the demolitions that have been taking place lately, but the only good they are providing is that they are seeding the area for economic growth.

I personally believe that once the population bottoms out, and we demolish all the abandoned structures people will actually start coming back into the city and rebuild it from the ground up.

Its going to take one little pocket in an area such as cork town where people are going to start buying up property and building condos. From there it will keep on expanding, and as the property values go up, the people who have money start moving in and the poor get pushed further out.

If you ever been to downtown Chicago near wrigley field, you see the exact same thing happening down there.