Who were the best and worst Mayors in Detroit History/

[softailrider]

Um...no.

Coleman Young's so-called "reform" meant criminals could now get away with murder - literally. He "fixed" STRESS by rendering the police department worthless and impotent. [[And the corruption which followed within the department under Young's tenure is legendary).

Young's term was the turning point beween the days when Detroit was actually a good livable city and when it became what it is today.

I absolutely agree with the above, Young's tenure destroyed the city.

[Fnemecek]

Best
Hazen Pingree

Worst
Dave Bing

[Bearinabox]

Gribbs was mayor from 70-74 and my dad's tennis partner from 80-92. I don't think he had much of an impact, except for setting the stage for CAY's reign of blame [[everything bad was caused by those people north of 8 mile!)

STRESS was started on Gribbs' watch, wasn't it? I'd say that's a pretty significant occurrence, although I don't know how much he personally had to do with its implementation.

[mikefmich]

I absolutely agree with the above, Young's tenure destroyed the city.

I am no fan of CAY, but that's a broad brush. The city started imploding years before he came along, though in earlier years it was hard for most folks to see.
But he did squat for the cake that was already baking except to put the icing on it.

[Detroitej72]

Thanks gnome, you're OK too.

Isn't John Lodge currently[[for the last 30-plus years) standing in as a member of the band, "The Moody Blues?"

[Gistok]

Best
Hazen Pingree

Worst
Dave Bing

Let me guess... Ken Cockrel Jr. was your 2nd worst....

[Detroitej72]

Let me guess... Ken Cockrel Jr. was your 2nd worst....

Gistok, I see a pattern here.

On a side note, I feel Detroit's First,[[and only Polish Mayor) has gotten screwed!!!

Here lies the racist tendencies of Detroiter's[[both black and white)!

It's not a case of black and white, they seem to hate Polish folks!

[Fnemecek]

Gistok knows me well.

[Gistok]

Fnemecek.... as far as Bing goes.... I'll grant you that it's hard to find a "lower key" politician than him. He hasn't exactly exuded a lot of enthusiasm as KK used to. But I think it's too early to write the obituary just yet. He said he was going to be a 1 term mayor... and by all appearances, that's the way it seems.

What he's doing behind the scenes is hard to determine... and that can be frustrating. Although that would mean wait-and-see... I'll grant you that the city can't afford to wait and see.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

Um...no.

Coleman Young's so-called "reform" meant criminals could now get away with murder - literally. He "fixed" STRESS by rendering the police department worthless and impotent. [[And the corruption which followed within the department under Young's tenure is legendary).

Young's term was the turning point beween the days when Detroit was actually a good livable city and when it became what it is today.

I disagree. Something had to be done with a police force that was 95% white and racist. How do you think the riots of 67 got started?. Whites were leaving the city before Young got in office. A young black person couldn't even walk to the store without being intimidated by the "Big Four" and STRESS. " Where you goin Boy" ? I'm not blaming everything bad that happened to Detroit on Young. Detroit was starting to decline when Jerome Cavanagh was Mayor.

[gnome]

I believe TIME ran a piece The Decline of Detroit, in 1961.

[softailrider]

I am no fan of CAY, but that's a broad brush. The city started imploding years before he came along, though in earlier years it was hard for most folks to see.
But he did squat for the cake that was already baking except to put the icing on it.

I'll agree that the problems started way before Young was elected for his first term. However, there's no denying that by the end of his run we had lost almost the entire middle class tax base.

[mikefmich]

I disagree. Something had to be done with a police force that was 95% white and racist. How do you think the riots of 67 got started?. Whites were leaving the city before Young got in office. A young black person couldn't even walk to the store without being intimidated by the "Big Four" and STRESS. " Where you goin Boy" ? I'm not blaming everything bad that happened to Detroit on Young. Detroit was starting to decline when Jerome Cavanagh was Mayor.

Perhaps Cobo & Miriani? After the war years, the automakers started building a ton of new auto plants in s.e. Michigan....at least 20 or more. Not one of them were built in Detroit. Couple that with the freeway construction that cut a wide swath thru PV, and the redlining of blacks vis a vis the housing/mortgage industry, IMHO the death rattle started in the early 1950's....but few if any realized it at the time.

While the riots accelerated the white flight to the burbs, it was well under way in the mid to late1950's when Oakland & Macomb started sprouting housing developments like weeds.

I thought Cavanaugh wasn't a bad mayor....perhaps his biggest mistake was a half-hearted attempt at fixing the budget with the income tax. Well meant, but it wasn't the fix he hoped for. I was coming of age in that era, and I full well remember many resident taxpayers who were friends, relatives, fellow church goers say screw this noise, I'm outta here.

He also embraced the emerging civil rights movement, which I thought was ballsy on his part. Others wouldn't have touched that with a ten foot pole in that era.

Pretty personable guy, I met him a couple of times when my dad was on the New Detroit Committee for a couple of years after the riots. I think he gave it his best shot.

Seriously by the time he arrived in office in the early 60's, I don't think anyone could've slowed down what was the chugging locomotive that was the fall of Detroit.

[Danny]

Charles Bowles was aTERRIBLE Detroit Mayor! His support with the KKK and other political corruption made Detroiters very upset that recall notice has happen.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

I'll agree that the problems started way before Young was elected for his first term. However, there's no denying that by the end of his run we had lost almost the entire middle class tax base.

So that's all his fault that the businesses left? I would think it was a combination of things.

[kryptonite]

CAY was a vulgar buffoon without any people skills and to my knowledge few political skills. Do people recall that after he made numerous insults about Ronald Reagan that Detroit's funding for a Woodward subway line just disappeared? The People Mover was still built but no subway. I never cared for Reagan myself, but as mayor of a large city in the days that large cities received substantially more federal funding you don't bite the hand that feeds you. CAY never learned to work with other elected officials for the good of the city, hew was too busy insulting them.

From what I can recall of Kilpatrick, he seemed to have substantial skills as far as working with other officials at the state and county level, and his mother assured him good access to some federal politicians. Kilpatrick in my opinion had great potential but god did he blow it.

[5thSFGP]

An easy choice - Coleman Young was by far the worse mayor. Young's departures from reality are far too numerous to list. "Nero" Young fiddled while the city fell down around his ears and served as the role model for the baffoons who followed him into office. While it may be said that the city was set to implode before his time, he did little of note to prevent - and even hastened the city's crash.

[kryptonite]

I never had the impression that Young even realized Detroit was turning into crap. His ego was so huge that he seemed to think he was doing a fine job and all of Detroit's problems were caused by suburbanites.

I lived in Detroit most of the time he was mayor, I never noticed much of anything improving.

And what a racist, he never improved race relations in the least, I guess because he didn't want to.

[5thSFGP]

I often wonder if anyone had the guts to tell Young that if he ran the middle class off that his tax base would go with them? If he was told, was he too stupid and egotistical to believe them?

[Detroitnerd]

Um...no.

Coleman Young's so-called "reform" meant criminals could now get away with murder - literally. He "fixed" STRESS by rendering the police department worthless and impotent. [[And the corruption which followed within the department under Young's tenure is legendary).

Young's term was the turning point beween the days when Detroit was actually a good livable city and when it became what it is today.

That is a minority view, and those who cling to it are usually old, racist police. Perhaps you should read "The Algiers Motel Incident," and consider if you would like to be a black person with Detroit police such as those covered in the book?

[Ray1936]

That is a minority view, and those who cling to it are usually old, racist police.

Yeah, that's me, if it will make you happy.

[Detroitnerd]

Yeah, that's me, if it will make you happy.

We've had this out before, Ray, and I understand your sensitivity to the issue, but I think it's pretty clear that when I say defenders of STRESS are usually old, racist police, it does not mean that all old police are racist, yes? You've never been anything but decent on this board, and your own words speak to a character that is far removed from that sort of ugliness.

My dad was a cop, and joined the force out of a genuine desire to help people, so I know it ain't all Buford T. Justice out there.

[Augustiner]

I often wonder if anyone had the guts to tell Young that if he ran the middle class off that his tax base would go with them? If he was told, was he too stupid and egotistical to believe them?

I assume that by "the middle class" you mean "the white middle class," since as far as I know there wasn't a significant exodus of black middle-class Detroiters during Young's tenure.

What did Coleman Young have to gain, from a political perspective, by reaching out to a group that overwhelmingly voted against him, was unlikely to be won over by him in the future, and had been steadily leaving the city for decades anyway? Maybe it would have worked to the benefit of the city for him to do so, but that isn't how politicians operate.

[5thSFGP]

I think to use the term "white middle class" there tends to be a rather broad stroke. The reality is that the majority of those who could afford to look elsewhere - did, and still do. What Coleman had to gain by reaching out to all groups was a continuation of a potential tax base that financed the services of the city - in all areas, which in turn would have held opportunities in education, employment, etc., that would have enabled the city to prosper. Now I realize that that concept may not have been politically correct then, but it's easy to see what the results of his administration have been and continue to be. The sad part is that he was elected and re-elected based on some pretty superficial factors - race for example, not accomplishments. Sadly, it does not appear to have changed much . . . .

[Augustiner]

I think to use the term "white middle class" there tends to be a rather broad stroke. The reality is that the majority of those who could afford to look elsewhere - did, and still do. What Coleman had to gain by reaching out to all groups was a continuation of a potential tax base that financed the services of the city - in all areas, which in turn would have held opportunities in education, employment, etc., that would have enabled the city to prosper. Now I realize that that concept may not have been politically correct then, but it's easy to see what the results of his administration have been and continue to be. The sad part is that he was elected and re-elected based on some pretty superficial factors - race for example, not accomplishments. Sadly, it does not appear to have changed much . . . .

I'm not sure what any of that has to do with my post. You asked whether Young was too "stupid and egotistical" to recognize the implications of his actions. I'm suggesting that those actions may have worked to his political benefit, regardless of their overall impact on the city, and may have been motivated more by his pragmatic desire to further his political career than by stupidity or egotism. Of course, I'm just speculating; I have no idea what Young's actual motivations were for making the choices he made about how to run the city and how to talk to the press. I'm just pointing out one plausible explanation.

As for whether Young was a good or a bad mayor, well, I don't have a strong opinion about that. Maybe I'm the only person in this town who doesn't. I'm too young to personally remember much of his time in office, and I think the city probably would have gone to shit between the early 70s and the early 90s no matter who was mayor. He did some good things, he did some bad things, and I think both his admirers and detractors tend to overstate his impact because he was such a polarizing figure.

As far as "people live where they can afford to live, then as now," you really can't have that discussion without bringing race into it, and you don't seem willing to do that. I guess I should leave it at that.