Saks Fifth Avenue

[DetroitPlanner]

True, though I'm not sure if their presence has shrunk that much. The Petoskey "resort" store and Ann Arbor "prep" stores were basically boutiques, and maybe [[combined) amounted to a single department in a regular Saks store. It's possible they even had five stores for a very short period, as I think the Somerset and Fairlane Stores both opened before the New Center one closed. The one remaining Saks has expanded twice; once in the early 90's, [[basically total reconstruction in tandem with Somerset South expansion) and then again maybe 5 years ago [[additional floor).

The Fairlane store replaced the New Center Store. I can remember reading an article the day of the move and how the elevator operator lost her job she had for a long time. Its strange the stuff you remember. Since I grew up at Joy and Southfield, I was happy to see the Saks move close to my home but as a Detroiter I knew that losing the store was a bad sign.

New Center still kept Crowleys as an anchor for years. First on Woodward, then moved to New Center One in the mid-80's.

[MidTownMs]

The Fairlane store replaced the New Center Store. I can remember reading an article the day of the move and how the elevator operator lost her job she had for a long time. Its strange the stuff you remember. Since I grew up at Joy and Southfield, I was happy to see the Saks move close to my home but as a Detroiter I knew that losing the store was a bad sign.

New Center still kept Crowleys as an anchor for years. First on Woodward, then moved to New Center One in the mid-80's.

Crowley's replaced Demery's on Woodward & Milwaukee before it moved to the New Center Bldg.

[marshamusic]

Saks on Second Ave. was an elegant place. Because Hudson's had the exclusive Woodward shops but also a bargain basement and regular mid-price shopping, I daresay that Saks rivaled Hudson's for thick, rich ambiance.

I do have a memory of shopping there: in the early sixties, I went with my father to Saks, a truly swoon worthy excursion. He was going to buy my mother something special for a gift - her birthday was close to Valentine's Day - and he was counting on me not to ruin the surprise.

I was as proud as punch to be in such a gorgeous place with my handsome daddy, who was a successful business man for the times, with a few extra dollars to spend on my pretty mama.

We got to the department with perfume in the air, and all of the beautiful lady things - pretty quilted robes, long, sheer gowns, and peignoirs. The room looked exactly like the photo posted above; though, in the post-war years, it was much more lush and upholstered.

As my father came into the room, a sales lady, her mouth a prim slash of unwelcome, stopped my father as he crossed the threshold and, to my utter shock, asked him what he wanted. Flummoxed for a moment by such questioning of his obvious intent, he nevertheless tells her that he's looking for something nice for his wife.

She informs him that he can't afford anything in here.

My father, dressed in suit, tie and overcoat, probably has sold enough records in the last 24 hours to buy everything they have.

It was clear that what she meant was "leave".

I remember freezing in misstep as I entered the room, my hand in his, and felt, rather than saw, my father's humiliation - I knew not to look. I recall him letting her know that he could in fact, afford whatever he wanted, but I don't remember what happened after that; whether he bought what he came for in an ostentatious flourish, or if we simply left.

My shame was so great, my mind stopped working.

That's what I remember about Saks on Second.

[dtowncitylover]

True, though I'm not sure if their presence has shrunk that much. The Petoskey "resort" store and Ann Arbor "prep" stores were basically boutiques, and maybe [[combined) amounted to a single department in a regular Saks store.

I've seen the old storefront in Petoskey that was the resort store. It's now real estate office and before that a boutique store. It can't be more than 1,000 square feet, if that. But the small stores still represented the old money world that was American wealth.

[dtowncitylover]

Marshamusic, that's an unfortunate story however not uncommon especially amongst the higher-end department stores of cities back then. Some of us like to over-romanticize the department store of those days when they were at their peak, but forget it was still the America of the 1950s and 1960s.

[old guy]

I remember freezing in misstep as I entered the room, my hand in his, and felt, rather than saw, my father's humiliation - I knew not to look. I recall him letting her know that he could in fact, afford whatever he wanted, but I don't remember what happened after that; whether he bought what he came for in an ostentatious flourish, or if we simply left.
My shame was so great, my mind stopped working.

I can relate to that, although I wasn't in a situation where I was forced by the depravity of society that you were, to not look, but I remember those times and what some of my friends endured. And it was my mother, not my father. But just growing up extremely poor, your last sentence about the shame, really hits home and brings back an experience that I'd put out of my mind.

[DetroitPlanner]

My shame was so great, my mind stopped working.

That's what I remember about Saks on Second.

Makes me glad I am not old enough to remember any of that. Wow what a memory. Not a good one, definitely scarring. I am sorry for you and pops!

[marshamusic]

@dtowncitylover - Yes, because of such differing experiences and memories, we often do not share the same nostalgia for many of the same things in the city, though I am sure we all appreciate the objective beauty and quality of many Detroit icons of the past. @old guy - yes, no matter from whence or why, the feelings are the same. @Detroitplanner - ......and of course, not just me and my dad; multiply that experience by the thousands...

[DetroitPlanner]

@Detroitplanner - ......and of course, not just me and my dad; multiply that experience by the thousands...

I realize that, but it seems so surreal when you hear that if you have only experienced this through exhibits at historical museums. I can definitely understand your perspective on things, but I can't remember much before the hippies and Plum Street. I am willing to bet that many posters here can't even remember Reagan as President!

[Shollin]

I realize that, but it seems so surreal when you hear that if you have only experienced this through exhibits at historical museums. I can definitely understand your perspective on things, but I can't remember much past the hippies and Plum Street. I am willing to bet that many posters here can't even remember Reagan as President!

I remember Reagan. I was probably the only one outside of Minnesota that voted for Mondale.

[canuck]

Saks on Second Ave. was an elegant place. Because Hudson's had the exclusive Woodward shops but also a bargain basement and regular mid-price shopping, I daresay that Saks rivaled Hudson's for thick, rich ambiance.

I do have a memory of shopping there: in the early sixties, I went with my father to Saks, a truly swoon worthy excursion. He was going to buy my mother something special for a gift - her birthday was close to Valentine's Day - and he was counting on me not to ruin the surprise.

I was as proud as punch to be in such a gorgeous place with my handsome daddy, who was a successful business man for the times, with a few extra dollars to spend on my pretty mama.

We got to the department with perfume in the air, and all of the beautiful lady things - pretty quilted robes, long, sheer gowns, and peignoirs. The room looked exactly like the photo posted above; though, in the post-war years, it was much more lush and upholstered.

As my father came into the room, a sales lady, her mouth a prim slash of unwelcome, stopped my father as he crossed the threshold and, to my utter shock, asked him what he wanted. Flummoxed for a moment by such questioning of his obvious intent, he nevertheless tells her that he's looking for something nice for his wife.

She informs him that he can't afford anything in here.

My father, dressed in suit, tie and overcoat, probably has sold enough records in the last 24 hours to buy everything they have.

It was clear that what she meant was "leave".

I remember freezing in misstep as I entered the room, my hand in his, and felt, rather than saw, my father's humiliation - I knew not to look. I recall him letting her know that he could in fact, afford whatever he wanted, but I don't remember what happened after that; whether he bought what he came for in an ostentatious flourish, or if we simply left.

My shame was so great, my mind stopped working.

That's what I remember about Saks on Second.

Truth is definitely harder to bear than fiction. My compliments on an elegantly written repartee to the Detroit booers and naysayers, madam.

[marshamusic]

Thank you Canuck; not really intended as repartee per se, but just the truth of experience.

Most of us of a certain age have long, clear memories of varying degrees of such defacto situations, barring us from a nice, normal shopping experience in Detroit stores.

Mothers who traced one's foot on a piece of paper and discreetly slipped it in her purse, in case the sales person refused to allow us to try on shoes. The constant reminder to be careful not to pick up a hat and try it on, at the downtown Hudsons or other stores, lest one face a sales person's withering look and their order to remove a chapeau, sharply whispered [[in order to not disturb the ambiance of the floor) but humiliating, nevertheless.

The beautiful woman who ran the elevators [[remember the beautiful brass water fountains outside the elevator doors?) who had to be a light color to have such a job, and who were not allowed to be sales women no matter their color or beauty, or tasteful appearance.

It was around 1960 before the first black was allowed to even bus tables outside of the kitchens at downtown Hudson's - her name was Diane Ross, aka Diana.

Yes, DetroitPlanner, situations like this in my lifetime, not just in history books of a time and place far, far away......

But I digress; speaking of beautiful downtown stores, remember, Himolhochs? B. Seigels? Such beautiful merchandise, such elegance.

[A2Mike]

[[I was going to start a new thread on the topic of the New Center Saks but I found this one from a few years ago with some good commentary on the subject so I'll just add to it). ---- On a recent trip to Detroit I looked up one my favorite places in the 60's and early 70's [[before my move to Chicago) - the New Center area. While visiting the opulent Fisher Building I couldn't help but give a wistful glance toward the New Center Building, another Art Deco gem, which once housed a particularly fine Saks store, along with some good memories. I started patronizing the University Room there in about 1964 at the behest of some friends at Wayne and took quickly to the clothes and the whole atmosphere. I shopped there, and at the Ann Arbor store [[really a University Room itself) until my 1977 move to Chicago [[where I was disappointed to find that the N. Michigan Av. Saks wasn't nearly as nice as Detroit's). In the meantime I became friends with a retired saleslady named Sadie Robinson who had been with Saks since the day it opened. One day I happened to mention to her that I had had to wait longer than usual in the waiting room for the valet to bring my car, but that the room was a pretty nice place to wait. Sadie was highly informed about the store's history and told me that when it opened, that waiting room was intended for the customers' chauffeurs! The store obviously had been conceived as a pretty grand place, but I had no idea of the extent. It just sunk into me how rich and ambitious a place Detroit must have been in those long gone days. On a simpler note, I used to like lunching at a Cantonese restaurant just up the street from Saks called the China Doll. I've been to many Chinese eateries, but none so special as that. The whole area was a treat then, the new cars in the GM building, the art books at the Doubleday store in the Fisher Bldg., seeing "Equus" and "Chorus Line" at the theater there. Perhaps if the New Center and its amenities had been downtown there might have been enough momentum to keeps the the whole scene going.

[stasu1213]

A couple of idle thoughts.....


If I remember correctly, you could walk from the New Center Building to the G.M. Building without going outside. There is [[was?) a subway from New Center to the Fisher Bldg., and one from the Fisher to the G.M. Building.

Someone mentioned G.M. executives. Memory says Lothrop, between Woodward and Second [[the NCB is on the corner of 2nd and Lothrop) had 2 or 3 dining establishments tht catered to the executive trade.

that tunnel is still under the Fisher blg that run to the Cadillac blg and the Kahn

[stasu1213]

I wish that the higher end stores would open in that area once again

[SDCC]

[[I was going to start a new thread on the topic of the New Center Saks but I found this one from a few years ago with some good commentary on the subject so I'll just add to it). ---- On a recent trip to Detroit I looked up one my favorite places in the 60's and early 70's [[before my move to Chicago) - the New Center area. While visiting the opulent Fisher Building I couldn't help but give a wistful glance toward the New Center Building, another Art Deco gem, which once housed a particularly fine Saks store, along with some good memories. I started patronizing the University Room there in about 1964 at the behest of some friends at Wayne and took quickly to the clothes and the whole atmosphere. I shopped there, and at the Ann Arbor store [[really a University Room itself) until my 1977 move to Chicago [[where I was disappointed to find that the N. Michigan Av. Saks wasn't nearly as nice as Detroit's). In the meantime I became friends with a retired saleslady named Sadie Robinson who had been with Saks since the day it opened. One day I happened to mention to her that I had had to wait longer than usual in the waiting room for the valet to bring my car, but that the room was a pretty nice place to wait. Sadie was highly informed about the store's history and told me that when it opened, that waiting room was intended for the customers' chauffeurs! The store obviously had been conceived as a pretty grand place, but I had no idea of the extent. It just sunk into me how rich and ambitious a place Detroit must have been in those long gone days. On a simpler note, I used to like lunching at a Cantonese restaurant just up the street from Saks called the China Doll. I've been to many Chinese eateries, but none so special as that. The whole area was a treat then, the new cars in the GM building, the art books at the Doubleday store in the Fisher Bldg., seeing "Equus" and "Chorus Line" at the theater there. Perhaps if the New Center and its amenities had been downtown there might have been enough momentum to keeps the the whole scene going.

Mike...do you remember what street Saks was on? I moved to A2 in 1975 and don't remember a Saks...Jacobson's and Lord and Taylor I do remember. You mentioned a date of 1964, I'm wondering if it was long gone by the time I moved to Tree Town.
My eyes and memory have been failing me for years now...so no surprise here.

[p69rrh51]

Crowley's replaced Demery's on Woodward & Milwaukee before it moved to the New Center Bldg.

Designed by H. E. Beyster Corporation. Demery & Company 6433 Woodward Avenue built in 1940 Midtown Detroit, MI.

[A2Mike]

Mike...do you remember what street Saks was on? I moved to A2 in 1975 and don't remember a Saks...Jacobson's and Lord and Taylor I do remember. You mentioned a date of 1964, I'm wondering if it was long gone by the time I moved to Tree Town.
My eyes and memory have been failing me for years now...so no surprise here.

Ann Arbor's Saks store was on South State Street in the building just left of the Nickels Arcade now occupied by the Bivouac store. I think Bivouac, which was on the left side of the Arcade, expanded into the Saks space when that store closed. I moved to Chicago in 1977 and I'm not sure how much longer Saks was there.[ATTACH]22159[/ATTACH

[easternguy]

I just stumbled on this entry. My dad was the first manager of the Saks store in 1940 - 1946. He opened the store and we lived on Seward Ave. I have many memories and some pictures of that store. And yes there was a concourse that ran from the building to the GM building. As a child 7 years old I would walk to the GM exhibits by myself, but then again things were different then. I have a picture of the annual Sak's employees dinner held at the Book Cadillac Hotel. My favorite place was the J. L. Hudson department store particularly at Christmas. There was an aura about this period of time that has been lost and probably cannot be understood in todays world.

[dtowncitylover]

I just stumbled on this entry. My dad was the first manager of the Saks store in 1940 - 1946. He opened the store and we lived on Seward Ave. I have many memories and some pictures of that store. And yes there was a concourse that ran from the building to the GM building. As a child 7 years old I would walk to the GM exhibits by myself, but then again things were different then. I have a picture of the annual Sak's employees dinner held at the Book Cadillac Hotel. My favorite place was the J. L. Hudson department store particularly at Christmas. There was an aura about this period of time that has been lost and probably cannot be understood in todays world.

We would love to see those photos! That's amazing, thanks for sharing

[easternguy]

It took me some time but here are some of the many pictures I have of SAKS,
Taken August 13, 1940 probably while store was being prepared for opening. The building entrance at the exteme left of the picture also entered into the underground concouse to the Fisher and GM buildings.



Inside on Main FDloor. Can you imagine a retailer today having that much open space? Note modern [[at that time) furnishings and the ashtrays available for the "tres chic".


This was at the rear entrance and parking lot complete with uniformed doorman. Note the chauffer waiting at right.


For the store opening SAKs brought the New York executive staff and department heads to Detroit on a special flight. Twenty one people was about capacity for the DC-3 aircraft at that time.



Actress Billie Burke [[the good witch of the North in The Wizard of Oz) selling war bond stamps at SAKs. I still have my incomplete book of stamps toward purchasing a bond. Note the hats and gloves from an era that had some refinement.
I will post more as I sort them out. Most of the others are of the store interior. Ah, memories.

[jonathanlivingstonseagull]

It took me some time but here are some of the many pictures I have of SAKS,
Taken August 13, 1940 probably while store was being prepared for opening. The building entrance at the exteme left of the picture also entered into the underground concouse to the Fisher and GM buildings.



Inside on Main FDloor. Can you imagine a retailer today having that much open space? Note modern [[at that time) furnishings and the ashtrays available for the "tres chic".


This was at the rear entrance and parking lot complete with uniformed doorman. Note the chauffer waiting at right.


For the store opening SAKs brought the New York executive staff and department heads to Detroit on a special flight. Twenty one people was about capacity for the DC-3 aircraft at that time.



Actress Billie Burke [[the good witch of the North in The Wizard of Oz) selling war bond stamps at SAKs. I still have my incomplete book of stamps toward purchasing a bond. Note the hats and gloves from an era that had some refinement.
I will post more as I sort them out. Most of the others are of the store interior. Ah, memories.

Would love to see the pics. Am not able to view them in the format they were posted in.

[anonJD]

Saks on Second Ave. was an elegant place. Because Hudson's had the exclusive Woodward shops but also a bargain basement and regular mid-price shopping, I daresay that Saks rivaled Hudson's for thick, rich ambiance.

I do have a memory of shopping there: in the early sixties, I went with my father to Saks, a truly swoon worthy excursion. He was going to buy my mother something special for a gift - her birthday was close to Valentine's Day - and he was counting on me not to ruin the surprise.

I was as proud as punch to be in such a gorgeous place with my handsome daddy, who was a successful business man for the times, with a few extra dollars to spend on my pretty mama.

We got to the department with perfume in the air, and all of the beautiful lady things - pretty quilted robes, long, sheer gowns, and peignoirs. The room looked exactly like the photo posted above; though, in the post-war years, it was much more lush and upholstered.

As my father came into the room, a sales lady, her mouth a prim slash of unwelcome, stopped my father as he crossed the threshold and, to my utter shock, asked him what he wanted. Flummoxed for a moment by such questioning of his obvious intent, he nevertheless tells her that he's looking for something nice for his wife.

She informs him that he can't afford anything in here.

My father, dressed in suit, tie and overcoat, probably has sold enough records in the last 24 hours to buy everything they have.

It was clear that what she meant was "leave".

I remember freezing in misstep as I entered the room, my hand in his, and felt, rather than saw, my father's humiliation - I knew not to look. I recall him letting her know that he could in fact, afford whatever he wanted, but I don't remember what happened after that; whether he bought what he came for in an ostentatious flourish, or if we simply left.

My shame was so great, my mind stopped working.

That's what I remember about Saks on Second.

I guarantee this did not happen as you recall.

[southen]

I guarantee this did not happen as you recall.

you are such a "know it all" that you are now guaranteeing you know people's personal lives and stories? marsha is well known and well respected. you on the other hand...

[Gistok]

I guarantee this did not happen as you recall.

Sooo... now you are also psychic... as well as flippant and condescending....