Free Press endorses the Nerd

[gnome]

novine, you're looking silly. We get it, you don't like Synder because he is a republican, you don't trust republicans. That is understood.

But having Shenderson flip you around with linguistic jujitsu is making you look bad. You took your shot. You lost.

[Novine]

This isn't about Rick Snyder. It's about how Henderson is basing his endorsement for Snyder on his misguided view of state government. It makes a mockery of the values that the Free Press supposedly represents. Unlike the right-wing wack jobs that dominate the comments on the paper's web site, I'm also an actual subscriber and have been for years. Unfortunately for those of us who are actual readers and subscribers, Mr. Henderson's been more concerned with pandering to those fools than those of us who pay our own way. Am I ticked off? You betcha!

[gnome]

sorry man, it ain't working. You went out on a limb with your opinion-as-fact thingy, steven came in and rope-a-doped you to exhaustion. Now you're blindly swinging at ghosts.

[Det_ard]

Novine, write your editorial on why Virg is a better choice, and what specifically he'll do to address the problems looming for the next Gov.

I share the concern that Snyder, being a political rookie, may struggle to deal with the pros in Lansing. I'm also concerned that Virg's ideas are either a house of cards [[his "do business in MI for free" construction) or based on post-WWII strong-union, rising tides ideology that began to lose steam 50 years ago and is anti-prosperity now.

BTW, I thought Hoekstra and Dillon were the best choices too, SH.

Now both of you guys learn how to use the quote function,

OK?

[Lowell]

I have enjoyed the back and forth between Shenderson and Novine. Both of you make very good points. I wish the general public debate had the same degree of informativeness and civility.

It is my opinion that either candidate would be a good governor, but unless he is found in bed with the proverbial "live boy or dead girl" Snyder will be the next governor.

Too many things have conspired against Bernero's aspirations. It's 'their turn' and the economy sucks for the average person.

Bernero got matched against the wrong team. Like Snyder's primary opponents he is like a "four yards and a cloud of dust' ground-game football team that prepared to play another dirty fighting ground team. Instead he ran up against an adroit passing team and can't lay a glove on the quarterback.

Against any of the other candidates he would be a toss up. But the numbers aren't there for him and it would take the one of the greatest upsets ever for him to pull this one out.

So it is time to make the popcorn, sit back and watch how Snyder will double the anticipated deficit and pay for it with an amateur legislature dedicated to no new taxes.

[Danny]

Synder is a BAD NERD! His businesses deals is a tactic for revenge against athletic jocks.

WORD FROM THE STREET PROPHET

As the revenge of the nerds continues here in Michigan

Neda, I miss you so.

Don't vote for Synder. He will destroy Michigan and Detroit.

SAVE MICHIGAN FROM SNYDER!

[sehender1]

Novine:
Sorry I disappeared last night after I left work.
Thanks for your thoughtful criticisms of the endorsement; we certainly don't make picks expecting to keep everyone happy.

Obviously, you and I disagree about the Freep's choice here, but I suspect we'd agree on most other issues. Thanks again for the back-and-forth..

[[and gnome: thanks for lookin' out! ;-)

[MCP-001]

WTF? He's a lifelong R, the longest serving Gov. the state ever had and now will have thanks to term limits, and is respected by all but the most politically extreme!

Not the republicans I've spoken to.

Bring up the name of Bill Milliken, and watch the discussion become more caustic than a Joy Behr/Whoopi Goldberg tirade on The View.

He IS NOT respected at all in the gop today.

[MCP-001]

One last point:

Does everyone know that there ARE more choices for Guv than The Freep or The News are telling you about?

I posted this before on another thread, but for those of you who may have missed it, here they are again.

Maybe Mr. Henderson can enlighten us on why The Freep is hiding this fact from its readers?

Nolan Finley, feel free to jump in at any time with your excuse.

[Gistok]

Not the republicans I've spoken to.

Bring up the name of Bill Milliken, and watch the discussion become more caustic than a Joy Behr/Whoopi Goldberg tirade on The View.

He IS NOT respected at all in the gop today.

MCP-001, maybe you didn't catch Lilput's comments about him being like by all except political extremists... such as yourself.

Milliken represents a kinder gentler Republican era... he reached across the aisle and working in a bi-partisan way to get things done... not the fearmongering and gridlock that your party espouses now...

He will likely go down as the best Michigan governor of the 20th century.... at least for anyone with half a brain...

[MCP-001]

MCP-001, maybe you didn't catch Lilput's comments about him being like by all except political extremists... such as yourself.

Milliken represents a kinder gentler Republican era... he reached across the aisle and working in a bi-partisan way to get things done... not the fearmongering and gridlock that your party espouses now...

He will likely go down as the best Michigan governor of the 20th century.... at least for anyone with half a brain...

I'm not sure how to break it to you, Gistok, but it's not my party.

You may now continue with your pointless rant.

[Gistok]

I'm not sure how to break it to you, Gistok, but it's not my party.

Funny that.... I bet most of us here could find dozens of posts that would contradict that statement... but if you keep on saying it's not your party... eventually some of us [[all your posts aside) might even believe you!

But with you saying that Saros "collapsed the Bank of England" [[that's a stretch... unless you're a Hannity, Beck, etc.).... and you also saying that you think that people shouldn't be able to register at a Secretary of State office.... well let's say... you may not be a card carrying Republican... but you certainly are an apologist for them!

[Detroitej72]

Not the republicans I've spoken to.

He IS NOT respected at all in the gop today.

Your right. The fringe, tea-bagger element of the Republican Party refuse to endorse anyone who lacks extremest views across the board.

[Gistok]

I'm not sure how to break it to you, Gistok, but it's not my party.

You may now continue with your pointless rant.

You mean my discussion about Milliken.... funny YOU should call it that!

[daddeeo]

I'm waiting to see how someone can get rid of the deficit without raising taxes.
Sounds like Voodoo economics to me.

[Hypestyles]

detroit needs a special stimulus. either candidate who wins needs to realize this and follow up with policies that encourages re-employment and redevelopment here..

[R8RBOB]

detroit needs a special stimulus. either candidate who wins needs to realize this and follow up with policies that encourages re-employment and redevelopment here..

Funny that you would mention that. Back in 09 when the "Democratic branch" of Congress passed the stimulus, JoAnn Watson said that Detroit needed a stimulus package about 10 billion. Of course, the press blew her off and the story didn't stick but she did make a point that Detroit was in need of a stimulus.

[R8RBOB]

I'm waiting to see how someone can get rid of the deficit without raising taxes.
Sounds like Voodoo economics to me.

Snyder and I'm assuming he is going to be the next governor will have to raise taxes or cut every single program down to the bone. There is no escape from this reality. He wanted the job well he is going to get it and he is about to find out why Jennifer Granholm went from the "doll of Michigan" to the "hag of Michigan."

[mogo]

"Naive Mr. Henderson. The "No New Taxes" caucuses that have controlled the Republican House and Senate are going to vote for higher taxes on the corporate and moneyed elites of Michigan? Let me catch my breath as I try to stop laughing. You have to be kidding. No way, no how."
Laugh all you want. Numbers don't lie. $1.6 billion hole in next year's budget. Another $1.5 billion if Snyder's 6-percent plan is implemented. Tell me how YOU'D fill $3 billion without a tax increase.. You can't cut fast or deep enough to get that done. It will be blamed, somehow, on forces other than the "no new taxes" crowd, just as the income tax hike was a few years ago. [[remember that? Gop'ers actually voted FOR a tax hike; were you laughing then?) But the math won't work otherwise. If Snyder is going to do what he wants to do, what he [[properly) says we need to do, count on some sort of revenue being added to next year's budget.
Naive is thinking it can be done another way.

I'm pretty left leaning. Snyder seems to me to be a nice guy who is more interested in making Michigan better, as opposed to the more egotistical reasons that most other politicians seem to run. I really appreciate that he's not brought up a bunch of irrelevant moral issues. But, the above debate between SH -Isn't DYes great! Where else could we interact with one of the Saturday morning regulars- and Novine is probably the only issue I have with Snyder. Beneath the incivility, I think Novine makes a good point that this is a recipe for financial disaster. Add in that Scheutte [[who is also a shoe-in) wants to refill the prisons with non-violent offenders. Where the Hell will that money come from? If the GOP actually votes to increase taxes, I predict that the majority of the increase will be on the middle class, and not the extremely wealthy.

If I have to choose between the Democrats idea of taxing so there is enough money to spend on the things they believe will make life better for the citizenry, or the Republican plan to spend on things they believe will make life better for the citizenry, but without sufficient revenue/taxation, I'll have to go with the Democrats plan. Didn't Bernero also talk about cutting taxes? I've never done this before, but maybe I can't pick either.

[Hermod]

I'm waiting to see how someone can get rid of the deficit without raising taxes.
Sounds like Voodoo economics to me.

A couple of ways.

1. Reduce spending

2. Stimulate the economy so that tax receipts go up at the current tax rates.

[Detroitej72]

A couple of ways.

1. Reduce spending

2. Stimulate the economy so that tax receipts go up at the current tax rates.

1. Yes, lets close all our state parks like some cons propose. Never mind that they are one of the main sources of tourism dollars.

2. How do you propose that?

[mogo]

A couple of ways.

1. Reduce spending

2. Stimulate the economy so that tax receipts go up at the current tax rates.

1. No one opposes reducing spending, but no one is willing to give up the public services that they enjoy. It's always the other guys favorite things that need to be cut. So you can't just say spending must be reduced. You have to say what exactly you want to cut.

2. Taxes are not the reason the economy took a dump. We have lived for 30 years with wages that stayed flat against inflation. The whole country lived on phantom money [[e.g. credit cards and home equity loans based on over valued homes). There is not a problem with the supply side [[rich people and corporations still have plenty of money). The problem is that there is not enough demand because the middle class doesn't have enough money to buy things.

Now, can you revive my Sparty's in this game against Iowa? Please?

[Novine]

"1. Reduce spending"

We've done that. Someone is going to claim that state budget totals have increased over the past several years. But those increases are based almost entirely on additional federal funds for things like health care and unemployment assistance. The funds the state raises itself and spends on state services have been declining for years. The same is true of the number of people working for the state. Some state agencies and departments have been consolidated or eliminated. Some may claim it's not enough. But if the solution was simply to reduce spending, shouldn't we have seen some impact from that?

For those who push for tax cuts, explain to everyone why the personal income tax cuts that were in effect almost every year between 2000 and 2004 appeared to have little positive effect on the economy? Personal income tax rates were lower during most of Granholm's two terms than they were under John Engler.

The same is true of tax cuts for businesses. While many have complained about the MBT and the surcharge, it should pointed out that the MBT resulted in big tax cuts for many corporations. Also, many corporations got big cuts in their property tax rates around the same time as the passage of the MBT. Did those tax cuts result in improved economic activity in Michigan? I haven't seen any evidence of it. Remember this when we're told that the solution is to cut taxes.