St. Jude Church/School Nostalgia

**7andkelly** · July-21-10, 07:53 PM

This is the HOF thread I know and love. Great stuff, folks.

Question: When the missile site was closed, did they dig down and remove the silos and bunkers, or just fill them in? Cement remnants of one of these sites can still be seen a River Bends Park in Shelby.

**Brock7** · July-21-10, 10:19 PM

I was too young to remember dismantling of the site and didn't pay much attention to the building of the new structures. Would anti-aircraft guns require silos and bunkers? The four guns were on the east side of Heilman with the center of them in line with Novara. I don't remember anything but grass being there - maybe the baseball diamond was half on the same ground. I think the basketball courts occupy that space now, and maybe the tennis court as well. Are any of the regular posters in this thread old enough to have observed the dismantling of the AAA site?

Edit: I just read your post more carefully and noticed you said missile. There weren't any missiles at Heilman, only anti-aircraft artillery. Though I think I've read that AAA sites were replaced with Nike missiles at other locations in the Detroit area.

**kellyroad** · July-21-10, 11:57 PM

Originally Posted by Brock7

I was too young to remember dismantling of the site and didn't pay much attention to the building of the new structures. Would anti-aircraft guns require silos and bunkers? The four guns were on the east side of Heilman with the center of them in line with Novara. I don't remember anything but grass being there - maybe the baseball diamond was half on the same ground. I think the basketball courts occupy that space now, and maybe the tennis court as well. Are any of the regular posters in this thread old enough to have observed the dismantling of the AAA site?

Edit: I just read your post more carefully and noticed you said missile. There weren't any missiles at Heilman, only anti-aircraft artillery. Though I think I've read that AAA sites were replaced with Nike missiles at other locations in the Detroit area.

The aerial picture was probably taken as early as 1956. Construction on St. Jude Church started in 1955. In the picture it appears the church is fully completed. Yet there are noticeable remnants of a military base. The military base part of Heilmann field must have been gone by sometime in 57 of 58.

Question: Was the military base established before or after that area became Heilmann Memorial Park?

Eastburn [[SJS class of 58) has offered many observations about this area previously. Perhaps a revisit is forthcoming????

I currently live near an old Nike site in Riverview that was complete with silos, missiles, and bunkers. That site was demolished and buried and is now an elevated soccer field between the fire station and city hall/police office. I too thought that the Heilmann area was a Nike missile site. Further discussion and investigation showed it was an anti-aircraft base. Many of the soldiers on that base would attend Mass at St Jude [[when the church was in the gym)

**Brock7** · July-22-10, 01:19 AM

The photo is from April 13, 1956. The photo from April 16, 1952 is not very clear - there appears to be some vehicles, but the base doesn't seem to be set up yet. According to one website the AAA site was there from '52 to '57.

According to this post by MikeM some of the locations listed by that website were Nike missile sites and never had guns, but the AAA sites had four guns and that's what the Heilman photo appears to have - I don't know how many missiles would be placed on a Nike site.

The plaque on the flagpole says Heilman died in 1951 and seems to say presented in 1952.
Attachment 6884

**Eastburn** · July-22-10, 06:00 PM

Originally Posted by jcole

I think Fr. Ording's sister was Margaret and I think she was his housekeeper at the rectory
I'm pretty sure she lived in the east half of the corner duplex, and the west half housed the Rapport Club. I used to have to take covered dishes and cakes and whatnot over there for Senior Dinners from my mom.

Right you are, JC! However, the only thing I ever heard her called was Miss Ording.

**Eastburn** · July-22-10, 06:06 PM

Originally Posted by kellyroad

The aerial picture was probably taken as early as 1956. Construction on St. Jude Church started in 1955. In the picture it appears the church is fully completed. Yet there are noticeable remnants of a military base. The military base part of Heilmann field must have been gone by sometime in 57 of 58.

Question: Was the military base established before or after that area became Heilmann Memorial Park?

Eastburn [[SJS class of 58) has offered many observations about this area previously. Perhaps a revisit is forthcoming????

I currently live near an old Nike site in Riverview that was complete with silos, missiles, and bunkers. That site was demolished and buried and is now an elevated soccer field between the fire station and city hall/police office. I too thought that the Heilmann area was a Nike missile site. Further discussion and investigation showed it was an anti-aircraft base. Many of the soldiers on that base would attend Mass at St Jude [[when the church was in the gym)

Huh? What? Is someone calling? You woke me up from a nice nap.

According to my not-too-accurate memory, the "army base" took over the south end of what was already Heilman Field. No missiles - just AA guns.

**Campfire Girl** · July-23-10, 10:55 AM

that's what happens when you JUST move into the neighborhood in 64 - you miss all the good stuff. It's no fun being the new kid on the block!

**jcole** · July-23-10, 11:02 AM

Yeah, considering you, Z and I were only 8 in '64, I don't think we were doing much hanging at the H, so you didn't miss much

**dtrrman** · July-23-10, 12:20 PM

Originally Posted by Eastburn

Huh? What? Is someone calling? You woke me up from a nice nap.

According to my not-too-accurate memory, the "army base" took over the south end of what was already Heilman Field. No missiles - just AA guns.

Nike detroit area Missile bases website interactive:

http://nikehercules.tripod.com/index.html

Some of the Nike-Hercules missiles were equipped with Nuclear warheads.

**7andkelly** · July-24-10, 08:56 AM

There were no nuclear missles at Heilmann? And I had attributed so much to them. What other explanations am I supposed to fathom now to explain my quirks.

**zitro** · July-24-10, 09:20 AM

Originally Posted by 7andkelly

There were no nuclear missles at Heilmann? And I had attributed so much to them. What other explanations am I supposed to fathom now to explain my quirks.

Red Dye #2

**jcole** · July-24-10, 09:28 AM

Originally Posted by 7andkelly

There were no nuclear missles at Heilmann? And I had attributed so much to them. What other explanations am I supposed to fathom now to explain my quirks.

You mean you didn't wear your tinfoil hat?

**7andkelly** · July-24-10, 10:37 AM

Originally Posted by jcole

You mean you didn't wear your tinfoil hat?

These days, I ought to be wearing some kind of hat.

**7andkelly** · July-24-10, 10:42 AM

Originally Posted by zitro

Red Dye #2

That, or lead paint, or cyclamates.

**Mkap** · July-24-10, 12:22 PM

Originally Posted by jcole

Yeah, considering you, Z and I were only 8 in '64, I don't think we were doing much hanging at the H, so you didn't miss much

Spent many a moon hanging at the outdoor pool over there when I was eight. Took the Red Cross [[I believe) life saving course when I was nine and ten. Whish I still had those certificates, but hey, we all can't be Z,

now can we? I've thrown away so much stuff I wish I still had for momentos.

**jcole** · July-24-10, 12:35 PM

Originally Posted by Mkap

Spent many a moon hanging at the outdoor pool over there when I was eight. Took the Red Cross [[I believe) life saving course when I was nine and ten. Whish I still had those certificates, but hey, we all can't be Z,

now can we? I've thrown away so much stuff I wish I still had for momentos.

Shhh, I just wanted to make CFG think she hadn't missed much.

**Mkap** · July-24-10, 12:37 PM

[quote=Brock7;165629]It looks like the play equipment might have been closer to the Maddelein corner than I remember it as well with diamond being in front of it to the east at one point.

The Engel house shows up in the DTE aerial shots as late as 1967. It can't be seen in the one from '49 because there are so many trees. This photo from '61 is clearer than the one from '67.
Attachment 6879

The next set of photos wasn't taken till '81 and the Engel house is gone by then, though the Salter house is still standing as can be seen in the cropped portion below. By '97 the Salter house is gone too.
Attachment 6880

Viewing the first 61 pic of the Engle house, I see the ballfield is on the south side. I had thought, because when my daughter played ball against SJ back about 1990, the ballfield was on the north side. Then looking at the 1997 pic it looks as if I rermembered correctly.

I don't ever remember playing ball on the south side diamond. I remember having the end of year pinic at Heilman and using those diamonds. Anyone else remember if we ever used the playfield for anything but American Football?

**Mkap** · July-24-10, 12:38 PM

Originally Posted by jcole

Shhh, I just wanted to make CFG think she hadn't missed much.

okay, sorry.

**jcole** · July-24-10, 12:42 PM

[QUOTE=Mkap;166441]

Originally Posted by Brock7

It looks like the play equipment might have been closer to the Maddelein corner than I remember it as well with diamond being in front of it to the east at one point.

The Engel house shows up in the DTE aerial shots as late as 1967. It can't be seen in the one from '49 because there are so many trees. This photo from '61 is clearer than the one from '67.
Attachment 6879

The next set of photos wasn't taken till '81 and the Engel house is gone by then, though the Salter house is still standing as can be seen in the cropped portion below. By '97 the Salter house is gone too.
Attachment 6880

Viewing the first 61 pic of the Engle house, I see the ballfield is on the south side. I had thought, because when my daughter played ball against SJ back about 1990, the ballfield was on the north side. Then looking at the 1997 pic it looks as if I rermembered correctly.

I don't ever remember playing ball on the south side diamond. I remember having the end of year pinic at Heilman and using those diamonds. Anyone else remember if we ever used the playfield for anything but American Football?

Powderpuff football

**kellyroad** · July-24-10, 02:04 PM

[quote=Mkap;166441]

Originally Posted by Brock7

It looks like the play equipment might have been closer to the Maddelein corner than I remember it as well with diamond being in front of it to the east at one point.

The Engel house shows up in the DTE aerial shots as late as 1967. It can't be seen in the one from '49 because there are so many trees. This photo from '61 is clearer than the one from '67.
Attachment 6879

The next set of photos wasn't taken till '81 and the Engel house is gone by then, though the Salter house is still standing as can be seen in the cropped portion below. By '97 the Salter house is gone too.
Attachment 6880

Viewing the first 61 pic of the Engle house, I see the ball field is on the south side. I had thought, because when my daughter played ball against SJ back about 1990, the ball field was on the north side. Then looking at the 1997 pic it looks as if I remembered correctly.

I don't ever remember playing ball on the south side diamond. I remember having the end of year pinic at Heilman and using those diamonds. Anyone else remember if we ever used the play field for anything but American Football?

The 61 photo seems to indicate that there might have been a baseball/softball field on the south west corner next to the home. I thought. however, that there was a small backstop on the northwest corner not to far from the play equipment..??? I don't think SJ school actually played on that quasi diamond...It seemed to be there for the young ones to take bp or practice fielding. Does anyone else remember that backstop?

**Hermod** · July-24-10, 02:28 PM

After WWII, the major cities and industrial area were ringed with battery positions for the 90mm and 120 mm antiaircraft guns. When the NIKE-AJAX missiles were developed, the AA guns were slowly phased out. The NIKE positions were placed out further from the target center. Over time, the NIKE-AJAX missiles were replaced by NIKE-HERCULES missiles in the same sites.

**Brock7** · July-24-10, 03:20 PM

[quote=kellyroad;166468]

Originally Posted by Mkap

The 61 photo seems to indicate that there might have been a baseball/softball field on the south west corner next to the home. I thought. however, that there was a small backstop on the northwest corner not to far from the play equipment..??? I don't think SJ school actually played on that quasi diamond...It seemed to be there for the young ones to take bp or practice fielding. Does anyone else remember that backstop?

I also remembered it as always being on the NW corner - which the photos prove is not the case. But a chain-link backstop with benches did still stand near the NW corner until sometime in the last several years - I sat there sometimes coming back from Vegas when they were building Heilman School and a few years after.