Abandoned churches of Detroit

[Pam]

Have African-Americans been turned away from the Catholic Church?

There are black Catholics in Detroit. I've seen them at some churches I have visited.
[[St. Charles Borromeo , St. Aloysius and some others I can't think of right now.)

Edited to add this church:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacred_...roit,_Michigan)

[Retroit]

That's been my observation as well, Pam. That is why I found the comments of krapug1 and Onthe405 somewhat puzzling. If there are not as many black Catholics as krapug1 thinks there should be, it is probably because when black Americans first converted to Christianity, there were not very many Catholic churches in the south, where most blacks lived. Many blacks you find in Catholic Churches came from the Caribbean, where Catholicism is/was more prevalent. If krapug1 was insinuating that the Catholic Church is racist, how would he explain the Catholic evangelizing efforts in Africa?

As for why aren't there more blacks, gays, divorcées, etc. in the Catholic Church, could it not be because they don't want to be there and not because the Catholic Church does not want them there? Last time I checked, Christ died for all people. At least that's what I hear on Sunday.

And I don't think it is too onerous for a church to have a few basic rites of initiation. Otherwise, what is the purpose of belonging to a church?

Sorry for the treadjack, but I didn't start it.

[DetroitZack]

Getting back to Detroit's abandoned churches.....
I was in this one a few years ago.

[terryh]

Where was that church Zack? What did you discover in the church?

[stinkbug]

You made an excellent point. Yes, one reason for abandoned churches is the population decline in Detroit city, BUT it was made worse by the fact
that the Roman Catholic Church in the USA has RARELY made itself welcoming to Afican Americans, and thus you have more empty Catholic Churches than needed to be. It is one of many, many, reasons that I am a PROUD
Ex-Catholic.

Ken

....and before any of you blindly, loyal Cathoilcs start any of your whining about it's open season on the Catholic Church. In our great nation every institution is subject to scutiny, the RC church is no different.

Well, before you get too excited, we're not on the same page. I was generally holding Catholics themselves to blame, not the institution itself in this case.

For all the multitude of problems and sins of the Catholic Church, racism is generally not one of them. As someone else pointed out, there are millions of African and Caribbean Catholics. By being enslaved in the south, and developing their own spirituality which is a far cry from the liturgical rigidity of the RCC, the Catholic Church never developed a huge AA following. Percentage-wise, there are even less black Lutherans in the USA than black Roman Catholics, so by that logic they are even less "welcoming". Still, there are some integrated and predominantly black parishes.

The RCC isn't really racist because it has generally embraced a univeralist dogma. One's Roman Catholicism matters more than anything else. So much so that the allegiance of Roman Catholics in this country were questioned all the way up through Kennedy. The Catholic Church is the most widespread religious institution on earth. You can find a Catholic Church in more countries than you can find anything else.

That said, I decry the Archdiocese for closing its schools in the city AND inner burbs to build fancy new ones in sprawl townships. They could have, and should have adapted to meet the needs to the urban population. The Jesuits did it, and they're doing fantastic. Not to mention pouring money into the John Paul Cultural Center...

-inner-city Catholic

[DetroitZack]

Where was that church Zack? What did you discover in the church?

This one is at Fischer and Chapin. When I was in it is was pretty trashed unfortunately. I will try to dig up the pictures. It's sad how much stained glass is missing.

[detroit48212]

Visit www.forgottendetroit.com, then click the album for saint cyrils. St. Cyril was a large church on St. Cyril street in Zipcode 48213, a street parallel, to Van Dyke, one block west, north of Harper and ended at Grinnell[[about 1/2 mile s of E.McNichols). The Catholic church closed in 1989, relocated in Sterling Heights. The building was sold to two other denominations/congregations prior to it's permanent closing & then eventual demoliton a few years ago. The website I suggest has photos of the enormous beautiful structure in various years of abandonment plus demolition photos.Lots & lots of good photos. I grew up in the area, attended St. Cyril grade & high school & discovered the suggested website while searching for info on the old neighborhood on the internet. The old Eastown theatre, which is still standing, is in the same area as the old St. Cyrils, albeit several blocks southeast but in walking distance. That whole area was a gem in it's day, lots of good retail, everything & anything in walking distance. Too bad so many old neighborhoods like it in Detroit didn't survive and evolve like old suburban neighborhoods such as downtown Royal Oak, Ferndale, even Hamtramck.

[stinkbug]

Visit www.forgottendetroit.com, then click the album for saint cyrils. St. Cyril was a large church on St. Cyril street in Zipcode 48213, a street parallel, to Van Dyke, one block west, north of Harper and ended at Grinnell[[about 1/2 mile s of E.McNichols). The Catholic church closed in 1989, relocated in Sterling Heights. The building was sold to two other denominations/congregations prior to it's permanent closing & then eventual demoliton a few years ago. The website I suggest has photos of the enormous beautiful structure in various years of abandonment plus demolition photos.Lots & lots of good photos. I grew up in the area, attended St. Cyril grade & high school & discovered the suggested website while searching for info on the old neighborhood on the internet. The old Eastown theatre, which is still standing, is in the same area as the old St. Cyrils, albeit several blocks southeast but in walking distance. That whole area was a gem in it's day, lots of good retail, everything & anything in walking distance. Too bad so many old neighborhoods like it in Detroit didn't survive and evolve like old suburban neighborhoods such as downtown Royal Oak, Ferndale, even Hamtramck.

I completely agree with you on that last part.

The question is, what can Detroit still do to make its remaining neighborhoods attractive like RO, Ferndale, and yes, even Hamtramck?

[kryptonite]

I am a Protestant and to a degree must protest some of the anti-Catholic rhetoric posted. I recall that by 1980 probably 80+% of historically white Protestant churches had already left Detroit for the suburbs. A few Lutheran and Episcopalian churches remained in the neighborhoods and some old Protestant churches Dowtown and Midtown were left operating. The only remaining synagogues in 1980 were Temple Israel in Palmer Park, which closed around mid-1980 [[I could be wrong on the name and the closing date) and the Downtown Synagogue.

And don't overly criticize the congregations that exited the city. I have attended Lutheran churches in Detroit with security guards patroling the parking areas and had a friend who had her car stolen from an east side church parking lot once and the same car broken into and nearly stolen a second time.

There is more to churches leaving Detroit than just racism and population loss. There are many factors involved in the exodus, just as with the population of white, and now black residents leaving the city en masse.
To bash the Detroit archdiocese for closing so many churches is really not fair, the Catholic churches operated in the Detroit neighborhoods long after the Protestant, Orthodox and Jewish congregations left the city.

[Mackenzie68]

Can anyone tell me what happened to the congregation of Grace Methodist Church? It was on West Chicago just west of Wyoming. There is no clue that it was ever there, but I remember some good times in the sixties.

The other nearby church to me was Ward Memorial Presbyterian on Plymouth Road. I know that they relocated to Livonia and now have a huge campus in Northville. And I found out that they first met in Parker School. I met a man who had the job of helping them set up for Sunday services when he was a boy living on Manor.

[stinkbug]

I am a Protestant and to a degree must protest some of the anti-Catholic rhetoric posted. I recall that by 1980 probably 80+% of historically white Protestant churches had already left Detroit for the suburbs. A few Lutheran and Episcopalian churches remained in the neighborhoods and some old Protestant churches Dowtown and Midtown were left operating. The only remaining synagogues in 1980 were Temple Israel in Palmer Park, which closed around mid-1980 [[I could be wrong on the name and the closing date) and the Downtown Synagogue.

And don't overly criticize the congregations that exited the city. I have attended Lutheran churches in Detroit with security guards patroling the parking areas and had a friend who had her car stolen from an east side church parking lot once and the same car broken into and nearly stolen a second time.

There is more to churches leaving Detroit than just racism and population loss. There are many factors involved in the exodus, just as with the population of white, and now black residents leaving the city en masse.
To bash the Detroit archdiocese for closing so many churches is really not fair, the Catholic churches operated in the Detroit neighborhoods long after the Protestant, Orthodox and Jewish congregations left the city.

Excellent post.

[DetroitZack]

Lets get this thread back on topic guys.

Visit www.forgottendetroit.com, then click the album for saint cyrils. St. Cyril was a large church on St. Cyril street in Zipcode 48213, a street parallel, to Van Dyke, one block west, north of Harper and ended at Grinnell[[about 1/2 mile s of E.McNichols). The Catholic church closed in 1989, relocated in Sterling Heights. The building was sold to two other denominations/congregations prior to it's permanent closing & then eventual demoliton a few years ago. The website I suggest has photos of the enormous beautiful structure in various years of abandonment plus demolition photos.Lots & lots of good photos. I grew up in the area, attended St. Cyril grade & high school & discovered the suggested website while searching for info on the old neighborhood on the internet. The old Eastown theatre, which is still standing, is in the same area as the old St. Cyrils, albeit several blocks southeast but in walking distance. That whole area was a gem in it's day, lots of good retail, everything & anything in walking distance. Too bad so many old neighborhoods like it in Detroit didn't survive and evolve like old suburban neighborhoods such as downtown Royal Oak, Ferndale, even Hamtramck.

Thanks for posting this! And welcome to the forum. I wasn't aware that this church existed, I bet it was pretty nice in its day. It's too bad what happene to it along with the neighborhood.

[kathy2trips]

Where was that church Zack? What did you discover in the church?

I thought that looked familiar. I've always been fascinated by that church, in my mom's old neighborhood at the corner of Chapin and Fischer. It was formerly St. Thomas Lutheran Church, which is now in Eastpointe. http://www.stl-eastpointe.org/history.html

I'd be very sad, if I belonged to that church.

[kathy2trips]

.....Roman Catholic Church in the USA has RARELY made itself welcoming to Afican Americans.........Ken........and before any of you blindly, loyal Cathoilcs start any of your whining about it's open season on the Catholic Church. In our great nation every institution is subject to scutiny, the RC church is no different.

The Catholic Church has had an Office for Black Catholic Ministries [[OBCM) for many, many years, and have not shown such accommodations to other races. You may have had your reasons for leaving Catholicism, but "non-acceptance" does not ring true. Talk about whining!

[DetroitZack]

Here is the First Unitarian Church at 2870 Woodward [[intersection of Woodward and Edmund). It was built in 1890.



This picture is from 1906. I wonder when the house next to it was demolished.

[Whitehouse]

Here is the First Unitarian Church at 2870 Woodward [[intersection of Woodward and Edmund). It was built in 1890.



This picture is from 1906. I wonder when the house next to it was demolished.

I think the answer is in the church. The church seems to be notably smaller in the current state. There are some windows missing on the side so I expect this chuch suffered the same fate as many other buildings along woodward. Getting smaller in the name of progress. The streets were widened some time ago and I think that house was demolished in the process... If the lines in fromt of the church in the old picture are railtracks then that was the center of the road. Well, judging by the current size of Woodward the church must have been "adjusted" accordingly.

[windsor_shane]

does anyone know where this is?

[ddaydetroit]

Shane that is a great picture what website is that from?

[Lorax]

does anyone know where this is?

That's the former Abyssinian Church on Woodward. I'm sure it's a goner at this point with the weather breaching the interior.

[Ocean2026]

Lorax is correct- there are more interior pics from that church linked on this thread. Is it a goner? Has anyone gone inside? What neighborhood would that be?

[Whitehouse]

That's the former Abyssinian Church on Woodward. I'm sure it's a goner at this point with the weather breaching the interior.

It's got a wiki.

The exterior looks in a really good shape if you ask me.

And about the First Unitarian Church at 2870 Woodward, posted above, the remodelling happened in 1936. So that could be also the year in which the house next door disappeared.

[windsor_shane]

this is the site i got it from.

http://www.opacity.us/

[smudge pot]

I'm ashamed of my fellow Catholics for abandoning the beautiful churches built by their ancestors which are of truly amazing and inspiring proportions...in favor of what are essentially strip malls in the exburbs. Oh well...closer to their subdivisions; further from black people.

Before they abandoned their churches, they abandoned their homes. I'm not ashamed of them, I'm sad for them. As for their ancestors, they were full of hope and optimism, however, if any are looking down on us now, I doubt a single one of them would resent their children and grandchildren for getting out of Dodge, and leaving those things made of stone and brick behind. Look at what those very ancestors themselves left behind in Poland, only to be later destroyed by Hitler and Stalin. Let's not get too worked up over a few buildings in Detroit, let's just be thankful that the dream of those ancestors is being realized somewhere in America, somewhere nearby, somewhere safe, healthy, and happy.

[Pam]

For anyone who wants to go look at some of the many churches that are still open:

http://www.detroithistorical.org/mai...ic_houses.aspx

http://detroit1701.org/Religion.htm

http://aodonline.org/AODOnline/Paris...=SearchOptions

[DetroitZack]

Thanks for posting that, Pam. I've always loved that detroit1701 website. This kinda gives me an idea for a new thread. Churches currently in use, I go have exterior AND interior photos. What do you all think?