Rose Terrace

[Lorax]

I'm in Palm Beach fairly frequently, since it's only an hour's drive from me, but remember about 10 years ago there was a store called "Dodge Antiques" which was closed at the time, but I was told later was owned by John F. Dodge II, son of Horace II and his last wife, Gregg Sherwood, who I believe is still living in Palm Beach- she'd be in her 80's now.

I cannot confirm this, and I don't believethe store is still in business, but haven't looked for it either.

There are a few still in Grosse Pointe as well, I believe.

[Maof]

Did the Dodge children blow all of their money, or are there still a few wealthy ones around? Just wondering?

http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg...&GRid=14812762

go to this website and click on the childrens names. i think the son blew the cash and died after many years of drinking and the daughter died in her early 40's.

[exmotowner]

It just amazes me how much money some of these folks had [[and blew). WOW what a lifestyle huh! Can you imagine! Must have been nice!

[RoseTerrace]

Except for the "pearls" I found all the other links through my Google searches. I find your stories on the DIA intriguing and sad. Was this done quietly? Did her taste{Anna's/Duveen's} hold value and bring a lot of money for the DIA? Anything else you can offer as time allows would be appreciated.

http://www.internetstones.com/anna-t...-necklace.html Scroll down for a wealth of information.

[RoseTerrace]

I did a search when I first came to this site. I only found a few posts that mentioned Rose Terrace. Is there a different way to find these older posts you speak of? Yes, in this video I saw the narrator talks of steel mills, quarries and such being opened during the depression just to build the place. Harbor Hill? - are there ruins of the place?

http://www.gphistorical.org/autobarons/dodge/index.htm

"In 1918, to be closer to his brother, John purchased a large site with water frontage in Grosse Pointe Farms. John intended to build the largest home in the Detroit area, with 110 rooms and 24 baths. He added a peninsula with dock to this land for his new 104-foot power cruiser.

In January, 1920, the Dodge brothers attended the New York Auto Show. While at this show, both brothers were stricken by pneumonia. Tragically, while Horace survived, John died on January 14, 1920. Horace was devastated by the loss and never recovered, following his beloved brother in death on December 10, 1920. The brothers were once again together, now in the imposing mausoleum they had built in Woodlawn Cemetery in 1913.

In 1923, Matilda Dodge sold the Boston Boulevard house and moved into a charming three-story home on Lincoln Road, just a few doors from Jefferson Avenue and her sister-in-law's "Rose Terrace." She still had not decided whether or not to complete her late husband’s dream house on Lake Shore Drive [[although the greenhouse was fully operational and was eventually sold to her head gardener, Mr. DePetris).

Matilda Dodge remarried in 1925. She and her second husband, Alfred Wilson, built Meadowbrook Hall on the Rochester farm property. This house, completed in 1929, incorporated many details [[windows, stonework, etc.) removed from the unfinished Lake Shore Drive mansion, surely sealing its fate. The shell of this house was finally dismantled in 1940. Today, this site is covered by homes on Harbor Hill and the man-made peninsula is the private reserve of the street’s residents."

[lilpup]

Follow up to the whereabouts of the organ from Rose Terrace. Current owners of church tell me that the organ was sold fifteen years or so ago. They are willing to check offsite storage for records. I'll post further updates as the trail unfolds.

NW Baptist definitely didn't sell it other than with the building. The new owners must have done so just after purchasing the building.

[RoseTerrace]

NW Baptist definitely didn't sell it other than with the building. The new owners must have done so just after purchasing the building.

Yes, thats my understanding. Church has those records offsite on who purchased it. I would suspect they needing money and "it" needed work. I hope to hear something next week.

[lilpup]

It didn't need work at the time of the building sale, but it definitely required routine attention and maintenance. Pipe organs are not like today's plug in and forget electronic keyboards.

As I recall the most regular requirement was keeping humidity levels up in the pipe chambers, which required regular monitoring and refilling of the water buckets placed therein.

[RoseTerrace]

[QUOTE=Gistok;77252]It's sad to see the wrought iron gates of Rose Terrace when you drive by and see that they enclose a subdivision of smaller homes. I remember seeing the house from the street in its' heyday.

Looking at the "Street View" from Google Earth you can see the fence from the Swift estate that Anna purchased for her son Horace Dodge Jr.
"In 1926, Anna Thomson Dodge purchased the Charles Swift house adjoining her residence, "Rose Terrace," as a gift for her son, Horace, Jr. He resided in this home, whenever he was in the Pointes, until his untimely death in 1963. After that, Mrs. Dodge’s niece, Mrs. Yvonne Ranger, owned the home until it was razed in 1985."
http://www.gphistorical.org/autobarons/dodge/index.htm

[RoseTerrace]

My mom was the organist at Northwestern and loved having such a beautiful instrument.

Do you recall the sounds/music of the organ?

[lilpup]

I believe there are some recordings from Northwestern, if at least with the choir.

edit to add: come to think of it Northwestern used to record their services on cassette every Sunday. I wonder if anyone still has those or if they got taped over.

[RoseTerrace]

Did anyone trick-or-treat at Rose Terrace? I think it was this site someone posted they did some caroling over the Christmas period and got a cookie from Mrs. Dodge. Was Rose Terrace decorated for the holidays?

[GPCharles]

The John Dodge Trust continued from his death in 1920 until the death of the last income beneficiary in the early 1980s, the wife of Wesson Seyburn [[I can't remember her 1st name). They lived on an estate that ran from Jefferson to Lake St. Clair across from Bon Secours Hospital, now the site of the Sycamores Subdivision. The iron fence and gates are still there.

The files filled an entire room in the Wayne County Probate Court.

[Lorax]

The death of Winifred Dodge Seyburn in 1980 precipitated the demolition of her home "The Sycamores" which was a Bryant Fleming designed home dating from the early 1920's.

Really a masterpiece of space usage, including a central avenue of sycamore trees, forecourt of Belgian block cobblestones with wall fountains, granite trimmed parterres and a walled formal garden, gardner's shed and cottage, and garaging with chauffer's quarters.

I have photos taken shortly before demolition I can scan and post- although not of Rose Terrace, it's a related subject if the thread poster doesn't mind.

I will take your cue.

[RoseTerrace]

Its all related so please post photos. You did mention "I will dig out a few photos you may be able to use." Re: Rose Terrace. Have you come across any of those? Everything I have read states that to the end Anna Dodge maintained Rose Terrace to the highest standards. Did that apply to the Ellen Shipman landscaping? Thanks

[RoseTerrace]

The organ went to what was then Northwestern Baptist Church, which was on 10 Mile just east of Evergreen [[right across the street for Fieger's office). That church has since been sold with the organ going to the new owners. Whether or not they still have it or are using it I do not know. Northwestern restructured and is now Wellspring Church on Eight Mile in Farmington. You might contact them and see if there's someone there available to look for what information they have.

My mom was the organist at Northwestern and loved having such a beautiful instrument.

The organ now sits in storage in the Washington DC area waiting for restoration. Before the current collector purchased, parts had been sold off. Two "ranks" or pipes were used in the restoration of the Jay Gould organ from his NYC townhouse. http://web.me.com/bobtaylor5/aeolian/Welcome.html

[lilpup]

The organ now sits in storage in the Washington DC area waiting for restoration. Before the current collector purchased, parts had been sold off. Two "ranks" or pipes were used in the restoration of the Jay Gould organ from his NYC townhouse. http://web.me.com/bobtaylor5/aeolian/Welcome.html

Two pipes or two ranks of pipes? Each rank is multiple pipes.

[RoseTerrace]

Two pipes or two ranks of pipes? Each rank is multiple pipes.

Thats right - my mistake. Two ranks plus top octave of the swell chest and most of those pipes. I have no idea what a swell chest is?????
My hope is that the DIA will allow access to their archives. THEY have the three Duveen presentation books with photos by Mattie Edwards Hewitt given to Mrs. Dodge at the time of completion.
I want to the the "Icecream Room"!

[lilpup]

RoseT,

My mom [[a long time AGO member) wants to know which collector has the organ. Do you have the name? Hit me back via private message if you don't want to post that info publicly.

Thanks!

[RoseTerrace]

RoseT,

My mom [[a long time AGO member) wants to know which collector has the organ. Do you have the name? Hit me back via private message if you don't want to post that info publicly.

Thanks!

Sorry - I was told the current owner does not want to be contacted. I don't know who the person is. I was told a photo of the console might be sent to me. Its sounds like they have to move things around to get to it. I can send you a copy if I get it.

The Dodge Collection book from the DIA says the organ had a separate echo organ/celestial organ installed in the attic. "Its function was to answer the pipes of the main floor from on high."
Did your church have this celestial organ also?

[lilpup]

The organ had an echo chamber, as well as chimes, that was played from the main console. The echo chamber was installed distant from the other pipe chambers in order to aid the echo effect. If there was an entire other organ with console then no, the church didn't have it.

The gentleman who installed the organ at the church and maintained it [[and one of the few around here who does/did this type of large work) was Jim Abel of J.A. Abel Organ Service. My mom said he's the one who would know a lot more. I'll pm you the most [[not so) recent phone number she had for him.

[56packman]

Lilpup--I met your mother at Northwest Baptist in 1983 [[or so) she played the wedding of good firends of mine, and she allowed me to play the Aeolian. It was very much like the Meadow Brook hall mush-box, a typical mansion organ of the pre-depression days, except at Northwest it spoke right into the room, and the console was where you could hear all of the pipes very clearly, a design feature few mansion organs considered.
To answer your question, a swell chest is the large box [[8' long x 10" high, varying in width from 6" to 96" inches, depending on how many ranks it contains, the chest is a pressureized box with a valve assembly for each pipe. The swell division of the organ is one where the pipes are enclosed in a room with "swell shutters" wooden blades that resemble large venetian blinds that open and close to regulate the volume. Other divisions are "open" and are at the same volume all the time.

Those who are interested should get ahold of the book "Dodge Dynasty" to read the staggering amount of money the heirs of John and Horace Dodge burned through, they had none of the drive or work ethic that the brothers had, all of the money and O common sense.
Places lke Rose Terrace became obsolete fast, the rise in fuel costs and the loss of "the servant class" to factory work [[which was far prefferable to the former servants) spelled the doom of many. savor places like Meadow Brook as a rare survivor, even if it is the red-headed step child of Oakland U.

[p69rrh51]

If you are up for a crazy trip to the city look up Stephen Hume at the Goatyard at the end of St. Jean just before the boat lauch. He is distantly related to the Dodge family. One of my favorite stories of his is a conversation with Anna at her home the whole time she is swinging the famous long strand of pearls Horace purchased for her.

[lilpup]

To answer your question, a swell chest is the large box [[8' long x 10" high, varying in width from 6" to 96" inches, depending on how many ranks it contains, the chest is a pressureized box with a valve assembly for each pipe. The swell division of the organ is one where the pipes are enclosed in a room with "swell shutters" wooden blades that resemble large venetian blinds that open and close to regulate the volume. Other divisions are "open" and are at the same volume all the time.

The sound volume of the other divisions is controlled by foot pedals that regulate the airflow volume into the division. These pedals are on the upright part of the console and are above the pedalboard.

I got some specs from my mom I'll go over later, plus a photo from a recital flyer that shows a bit of the manuals and the stops on one side. She also has a cassette tape of at least one concert.

The correct spelling of the repair man's name is Aebel - A.J. Aebel Organ Service Co., originally located in Royal Oak.

[56packman]

Lilpup--the volume of a pipe organ is regulated by "swell shutters" the wooden blades that open and close, depending on how far you push the "gas pedals" [[swell shoes) over the pedal board. The pipes can only play at one pressure to be in tune, pitch is relative to pressure, length of resonator [[which is where the tuning adjustment is made for flue pipes) and other inflexible things like diameter [[="scale") and mouth cut-up [[height of rectangular opening through which air passes, producing the tone) -- these are set at the factory when the pipes are crafted. They blast away [[or sing away) at the same volume all the time, the shutters allow a percentage of that sound to go into the listening area. Many church/classical instrments have divisions that are not enclosed, and the volume is regulated by the number of stops [[sets of pipes having a different sound) that are drawn. But the pipes have to be on the same, factory-set pressure all the time to be in tune, otherwise it would operate like a slide whistle.