Foreign Cars.

[krapug1]

Just to give an example here, I am 48 years old, and have never owned an
American made car.

When I was 18 and saved up for my first car back in 1979, my Father who worked for Chrysler, begged me NOT to buy a Chrysler product.

He knew that I would drive the heck out of any car, and as we worked in Government Affairs he knew the myriad of issues with Chrysler products back then.

The end result being I bought a car through the Chrysler dealer network, a Plymouth Champ, which was a 100% Mitsubishi product, but with the Plymouth name on it.

Fast forward to today, I drive a 1996 Saab 900SE, and a 1991 Saab 900S.
The both have about 170,000. miles on them, and they have required nothing more than regular maint., and one new clutch. Both of these cars are good for at least 300,000. miles. For the record neither have a GM engine.

I have NEVER had a car payment since 1984, and do not plan on having one ever again. I to this day, save up to buy a car, and then buy something that I know will go the distance.

What American made car can go the distamce ?

Ken

[wazootyman]

I work for a supplier that is owned by 4 very large Japanese companies and the last time I checked I WAS NOT paid in Yen. Should I give up my well paying job because you don't like competition?

What you're failing to acknowledge is that while foreign-owned employment has increased, overall automotive employment in this country has fallen dramatically. Not all of it can be blamed on rising sales of foreign automobiles; outsourcing by the big three has certainly had its effects. Regardless, at no point will foreign-owned jobs make up for those lost during the decline of the big three.

Some numbers can be found in this report from 2004: http://www.trade.gov/static/auto_reports_jobloss.pdf

Just to give an example here, I am 48 years old, and have never owned an American made car.
[...]
What American made car can go the distamce ?

How would you know, you've never given one a chance? You're making present-day purchasing decisions on a recommendation given 30 years ago. You can't realistically compare a 1979 'anything' to a 2009, foreign or domestic. I own two dometic vehicles - both Saturn, both made in this country. Excellent vehicles I've had next to no problems with.

You guys just don't get it. Most people here aren't bashing the Big3 cars. The problem is that many [[if not most) or their vehicles are built OUTSIDE the U.S. That makes them FOREIGN in my book.

No. At the end of 2008, GM operated more plants than all foreign automakers combined. It's reckless to state 'facts' when you've obviously done zero research to back up your claims. Moreover, when considering percent domestic content, GM, Ford and Chrysler come in as the top-three with 69%, 64% and 60%, respectively.

http://www.uaw.org/uawmade/auto/2009/index.cfm
http://www.levelfieldinstitute.org/f...act_sheet1.pdf
http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/2...utomakers.html

Beside, only about 50% of the money from the purchase of a vehicle goes to assembly and materials. The other 50% goes to R&D/engineering, overhead, employee benefits, selling costs, etc. Having worked in the automotive industry for some time, I can positively state there are a lot of people working for Ford in Dearborn that have no direct involvement in assembly, but their livelihood still has strong ties to the fate of the company.

http://msl1.mit.edu/classes/esd123/vyas.pdf

Re-check your window sticker. I'm sure it says "North American" content, not "American", thus it includes Mexico and Canada. Very deceptive.

Not true. Since 1994, the American Automobile Labeling Act [[AALA) dictates that American and Canadian content are shown together - this does not include Mexico, and most of the window stickers I've seen [[maybe all - can't say for sure) specify US/Canadian Parts Content. In addition, the source of the engine and the transmission are specifically called out by country.

http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/Cars/rules/...te/809208.html

It's not deceptive unless you don't actually read the label.

The biggest problem I've seen with the anti-pro-domestic [[or pro-foreign?) arguments is that many of them lack factual content; it's mostly heresay, union-bashing, or opinions formed on some lousy car they had 20+ years ago.

My opinion is that if you live in Metro Detroit, you're welcome to buy whatever you want. But if you buy a foreign car, you are not allowed to complain about empty storefronts, increased crime, bankrupt communities, layoffs, poor job prospects, or anything of the sort. I don't care if you blame unions, the governer, poor executive decisions - regardless, your short-sighted, selfish purchase decision makes a contribution towards the demise of our primary economic engine.

[lilpup]

Fast forward to today, I drive a 1996 Saab 900SE, and a 1991 Saab 900S.
The both have about 170,000. miles on them, and they have required nothing more than regular maint., and one new clutch.
What American made car can go the distamce ?

Ken

My last Escort has 250K+ on it when I sold it and my current Escort is approaching 190K. And my Escorts were a shitload less expensive than your Saabs.

[econ expat]

My last Escort has 250K+ on it when I sold it and my current Escort is approaching 190K. And my Escorts were a shitload less expensive than your Saabs.

Using BuyAmerican's logic,
Saab is indeed an American Car,
GM owns Saab, profits go to GM execs and shareholders.

[darwinism]

I wonder if the few pro-domestic extremists here on DetroitYes have ever analyzed their investment portfolio such as their mutual fund holdings and stocks ownership.

BuyAmerican should have all his/her retirement 401k investments, stocks, bonds, mutual funds and etc. allocated to auto companies that are based in SE Michigan. There better not be any signs of companies like Anheuser-Busch [[Brazil-Belgium), Samsung [[South Korea), Hitachi [[Japan), Arcelor Mittal [[Luxembourg), Siemens [[Germany), Nestle [[Switzerland), BASF [[Germany), Nokia [[Finland) or Prudential [[U.K.).

By the way, owning a "Southeast Michigan" car is only the beginning ..... what about the fuel to run the car ? Sure hope BuyAmerican has alternative plans to gas up his/her vehicles because this list of companies should not be a stop to buy gas from.

Companies and total barrels of crude imports from the Middle-East

[crawford]

BuyAmerican should have all his/her retirement 401k investments, stocks, bonds, mutual funds and etc. allocated to auto companies that are based in SE Michigan. There better not be any signs of companies like Anheuser-Busch [[Brazil-Belgium), Samsung [[South Korea), Hitachi [[Japan), Arcelor Mittal [[Luxembourg), Siemens [[Germany), Nestle [[Switzerland), BASF [[Germany), Nokia [[Finland) or Prudential [[U.K.).

Totally agree, but Prudential Financial is based in the U.S., in Newark, NJ.

There is also a U.K.-based Prudential, but it's an unrelated smaller organization that does not have a U.S. presence.

Keep in mind, too that more than half of adult Americans do not have an investment portfolio or even a 401K, so this discussion doesn't matter to most.

[wazootyman]

I wonder if the few pro-domestic extremists here on DetroitYes have ever analyzed their investment portfolio such as their mutual fund holdings and stocks ownership.

BuyAmerican should have all his/her retirement 401k investments, stocks, bonds, mutual funds and etc. allocated to auto companies that are based in SE Michigan. There better not be any signs of companies like Anheuser-Busch [[Brazil-Belgium), Samsung [[South Korea), Hitachi [[Japan), Arcelor Mittal [[Luxembourg), Siemens [[Germany), Nestle [[Switzerland), BASF [[Germany), Nokia [[Finland) or Prudential [[U.K.).

By the way, owning a "Southeast Michigan" car is only the beginning ..... what about the fuel to run the car ? Sure hope BuyAmerican has alternative plans to gas up his/her vehicles because this list of companies should not be a stop to buy gas from.

Companies and total barrels of crude imports from the Middle-East

When you've got arguments like these, who needs intelligent discussion?

[darwinism]

When you've got arguments like these, who needs intelligent discussion?

Exactly !

Many of the folks on here are such extremists that they thought they know it all. They perceive themselves as the most intelligent beings on earth, and everyone else outside of Southeast Michigan are just idiots. Come on, give me a break.

Many of us try to be more reasonable, such as Jared9903, who prefers domestic automakers, but wouldn't go absolutely batty over his wife purchasing an Accord or Camry. I am the same way - although I just bought a 2009 Chevy Malibu, and believe that I have done my part to put my money where my mouth is. If my brother buys a Nissan, so be it. We also have folks who see the big picture, like wash_man and tahleel, who understands that American means more than just Southeast Michigan.

So wazootyman, it really is quite subjective on DetroitYes how you categorize "intelligent discussions", my friend.