2019 Detroit Lions

**rickbak** · October-17-19, 08:27 PM

If I was building [[or rebuilding) a team, I'd first concentrate on putting together the best possible O-line. With only a few exceptions, most RBs and wideouts are interchangeable parts anyway. Hell, the Packers won titles with guys like Chuck Mercein carrying the ball, but he was running behind Jerry Kramer and Forrest Gregg. When the Lions were actually winning championships in the '50s, they basically had a group of pedestrian backs running behind one of the finest O-lines of the era. Guys like Harley Sewell, Lou Creekmur, and Dick Stanfel opened holes, led sweeps, and kept the bad guys off Bobby Layne's back. The way the game is played today---push-shove-pass-catch, just like at the office picnic---all you really need is a wall of big uglies with quick feet and long arms giving an accurate passer the 7-8 seconds he needs to get off a throw to Insert Name Here. The O-line is everything. Zach Zenner could be a 1000-yard runner with the right guys up front.

FULL DISCLOSURE: I was a guard all through high school, so of course I'm a little biased. The blocking sled is where all failed fullbacks go. Hey, me and all those heavy-legged guys named Moose and Ox---we're a brotherhood!

**sirrealone** · October-18-19, 06:25 AM

They've invested a lot of draft capital and free agency money into the o-line over the past few years. Riley Reiff and later Taylor Decker were drafted as left tackles to anchor the line. Reiff was never that great and Decker has never played as well as he did during his rookie season, which is somewhat baffling. Larry Warford and Graham Glasnow were both third round picks, both pretty solid. Warford was allowed to walk once his rookie deal expired, and has been a pro-bowler in New Orleans. Probably should have kept him, in hindsight. Tomlinson was a first round pick, but was a bust, and Ragnow was our latest first round pick. He looks very solid. Wagner and TJ Lang were both high profile free agent signings. Lang has since retired and Wagner has been pretty good, but not as good as before he got his payday [[see: Snacks Harrison).

The thing I've seen about the offensive line is that isn't just about talent. Of course you need talented players but they also need to gel as a group. An offensive line can usually not come out as better than the sum of its parts, but it can definitely come out worse. I don't know if it's just a bad mix of players, or coaching, or what, but the Lions have just never really had the right group of players be able to gel into a cohesive unit.

It wouldn't surprise me in the least to see them go back to the well in the top end of the draft this year in another attempt.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · October-18-19, 08:04 AM

^^ Keep picking, trading, or signing FA's, until you get it right. OTH, maybe the current group can establish some cohesion among themselves. Stafford isn't going to have many good years left, he's close to being on the wrong side of 30 I believe.

**softailrider** · October-18-19, 08:18 AM

Big game on Sunday, they beat the Vikings they’re back in it, they lose and they are in a tough spot. Could be out of this thing by November. Easy part of the schedule coming up but not this Sunday.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · October-19-19, 05:59 AM

Originally Posted by softailrider

Big game on Sunday, they beat the Vikings they’re back in it, they lose and they are in a tough spot. Could be out of this thing by November. Easy part of the schedule coming up but not this Sunday.

I wouldn't say the Raiders, Bears and Cowboys will be all that easy.

**p1acebo** · October-19-19, 10:30 AM

Originally Posted by softailrider

Big game on Sunday, they beat the Vikings they’re back in it, they lose and they are in a tough spot. Could be out of this thing by November. Easy part of the schedule coming up but not this Sunday.

If they lose they are definitely out, I don't expect this team to climb out of that much of a deficit in the NFC north.

**Bong-Man** · October-21-19, 01:53 PM

So now the only stat that matters is an 0-3 losing streak. As usual, the only question now is how low can they go ? Had to really appreciate the Vikings' one sack of Stafford where our right tackle got a piece of their left end, Hockinson then got flattened like a pancake, the running back wiffed on the support, and down goes Stafford.

Not only do we rarely blitz, we always use one of our inside linebackers when we do. Nothing like allowing the opposing QB to read the blitz right in front of his field of vision. Meanwhile, have you ever seen Stafford ever read a cornerback blitz ? He never even sees them, let alone reads them.

Really have to like the New Orleans Saints. Lose your QB ? No biggie. Lose your RB ? We got another. I bet our former 3rd round pick [[Warford) is quite a happy guy.

**401don** · October-21-19, 02:58 PM

Guess the Lions couldn't handle the pressure of being Detroit's only semi respectable team. It's over. Trade Stafford for a couple of picks, toothpicks for all I care.

**Smirnoff** · October-22-19, 07:16 AM

Originally Posted by 401don

Trade Stafford for a couple of picks, toothpicks for all I care.

Insanity is keeping the same losing QB for 11-yrs & expect winning results.

Has anyone contacted league mgt to let them know the Vikings missed a FG & dropped a pass in the end zone & still won the game? Unbelievable how the ref's allowed this to happen?

**p1acebo** · October-21-19, 07:05 PM

It's too bad, I was looking forward to meaningful football in November. I guess it's just another year of needing a rebuild.

**softailrider** · October-21-19, 08:47 PM

I’m not a Stafford lover or hater. I do think he’s the best QB we’ve had in my lifetime [[Bobby Layne was before my time) He doesn’t seem to be able to win meaningful games. But the Lions never won anything with a lot of great players, Sanders, Sims, Farr, there’s more but that’s all I can think of at the moment.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · October-22-19, 09:38 AM

Originally Posted by softailrider

I’m not a Stafford lover or hater. I do think he’s the best QB we’ve had in my lifetime [[Bobby Layne was before my time) He doesn’t seem to be able to win meaningful games. But the Lions never won anything with a lot of great players, Sanders, Sims, Farr, there’s more but that’s all I can think of at the moment.

You left off probably their greatest receiver, Calvin Johnson. It's ironic to me Stafford is setting all these passing marks, [[fastest ever to reach 40,000 passing yards) yet hasn't won 1 playoff game in 10 years. He puts up "empty stats" but it's not all on him obviously...

**sirrealone** · October-22-19, 11:30 AM

Ironically, him hitting 40,000 yards in the fastest time ever goes hand in hand with the team not having success. Many of his yards came because of how often they were losing, so either they were passing in hopes of catching up or the other team was so far ahead that they'd let him get some yards during garbage time to avoid their own players getting hurt.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · October-23-19, 10:18 AM

Originally Posted by sirrealone

Ironically, him hitting 40,000 yards in the fastest time ever goes hand in hand with the team not having success. Many of his yards came because of how often they were losing, so either they were passing in hopes of catching up or the other team was so far ahead that they'd let him get some yards during garbage time to avoid their own players getting hurt.

I'll buy that. Dan Marino who put up big numbers as well, was looked at in the same light, but at least he reached a conference final, I believe. Stafford hasn't won a playoff game.

**rb336** · October-23-19, 11:53 AM

Originally Posted by Cincinnati_Kid

I'll buy that. Dan Marino who put up big numbers as well, was looked at in the same light, but at least he reached a conference final, I believe. Stafford hasn't won a playoff game.

yep, but - just like this debacle against the Vikings - he hardly cost them the games. This defense is HORRIBLE.

**EastsideAl** · October-23-19, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by Cincinnati_Kid

You left off probably their greatest receiver, Calvin Johnson. It's ironic to me Stafford is setting all these passing marks, [[fastest ever to reach 40,000 passing yards) yet hasn't won 1 playoff game in 10 years. He puts up "empty stats" but it's not all on him obviously...

The thing that bugs me most about Stafford is that he can't seem to put two good halves together, like the actually great qbs do. He either starts off like a house on fire, throwing the ball accurately downfield, leading long drives, and building up a lead, only to slip badly during the second half and stall out drive after drive while the other team wears the defense out. Or he plays indifferently or badly for 2 or 3 quarters, giving the other team a big lead, only to lead a 'stirring comeback' in the 4th quarter; a comeback that very often falls just short at the most crucial moments.

All of this, of course, builds up his stats and give the illusion that he is a potentially great quarterback. There have been many flashes of brilliance over the years, especially when he had better receivers like Calvin Johnson, but there has never been any real consistency at all. He is actually on the high side of mediocre. Good enough to keep his job, defeat bad or average teams, get big contracts, and build up gaudy-looking numbers, but not good enough or consistent enough to actually beat good teams.

In the meantime, the offense stagnates and the Lions can't get a consistent running attack because they keep drafting and signing these big pass protecting lugs on the OL with no speed. And so defenses find that they can sell out on the pass and eventually tee off on Stafford with blitzes and stunts, because the Lions pose no other real threat than Matt dropping back and gunning.

**softailrider** · October-24-19, 08:27 PM

Originally Posted by EastsideAl

The thing that bugs me most about Stafford is that he can't seem to put two good halves together, like the actually great qbs do. He either starts off like a house on fire, throwing the ball accurately downfield, leading long drives, and building up a lead, only to slip badly during the second half and stall out drive after drive while the other team wears the defense out. Or he plays indifferently or badly for 2 or 3 quarters, giving the other team a big lead, only to lead a 'stirring comeback' in the 4th quarter; a comeback that very often falls just short at the most crucial moments.

All of this, of course, builds up his stats and give the illusion that he is a potentially great quarterback. There have been many flashes of brilliance over the years, especially when he had better receivers like Calvin Johnson, but there has never been any real consistency at all. He is actually on the high side of mediocre. Good enough to keep his job, defeat bad or average teams, get big contracts, and build up gaudy-looking numbers, but not good enough or consistent enough to actually beat good teams.

In the meantime, the offense stagnates and the Lions can't get a consistent running attack because they keep drafting and signing these big pass protecting lugs on the OL with no speed. And so defenses find that they can sell out on the pass and eventually tee off on Stafford with blitzes and stunts, because the Lions pose no other real threat than Matt dropping back and gunning.

I think all of the above is totally on the money regarding Stafford.

**Ray1936** · October-27-19, 06:53 PM

Originally Posted by softailrider

I think all of the above is totally on the money regarding Stafford.

Darn it, Lowell, when ya gonna put a "like" button on DY?

**Smirnoff** · October-22-19, 11:56 AM

Began the season 9-62 against teams with a winning record.....

**sirrealone** · October-23-19, 02:48 PM

Very true. Stafford can sometimes throw on a dime, but other times he'll overthrow or underthrow a wide open target. He's a better than average QB but he's not elite.

**softailrider** · October-23-19, 09:17 PM

Kerryon will be back end of the season, just in time for the Lions playoff run.

**sirrealone** · October-24-19, 05:56 AM

Originally Posted by softailrider

Kerryon will be back end of the season, just in time for the Lions playoff run.

Good to know that he'll have no problem being able to walk to the fridge pain free to grab a beer. While watching the playoffs on TV.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · October-24-19, 10:18 AM

Originally Posted by softailrider

Kerryon will be back end of the season, just in time for the Lions playoff run.

Don't know what you guys think, but he's been a major disappointment to me. I get that he's was injured last year and now, but still.. Also, what was the reason for the Lions trading one of their better safeties in Diggs, after signing him to a new deal, and naming him a defensive captain. Just to sign a safety [[Marcus Gilchrist) who was cut by the Raiders? I guess Quinn is trying to mirror Belichick. Belichick is the master of shrewd, he just traded for Mohamed Sanu, and effectively, cut Josh Gordon after he suffered a knee injury.

**EastsideAl** · October-24-19, 10:51 AM

I don't know whether Kerryon is a disappointment or not. The Lions' poor run blocking means he will always be taking extra hits just to get a few yards and pretty much ensures that he's either going to be playing hurt or be out with an injury.

**p1acebo** · October-24-19, 01:57 PM

Originally Posted by EastsideAl

I don't know whether Kerryon is a disappointment or not. The Lions' poor run blocking means he will always be taking extra hits just to get a few yards and pretty much ensures that he's either going to be playing hurt or be out with an injury.

That is what I have observed as well. The O line has regressed this year, and Kerryon has to dodge the first tackler behind the line of scrimmage. It definitely sucks he is injured, the Lions need to go out and get a replacement if they plan on staying competitive.