In Detroit bankruptcy, what will happen to DIA?

**rjk** · February-21-12, 07:24 PM

Does anyone know what would be considered the DIA's most prestigious piece of artwork? If another museum could pick one piece from the DIA's collection what would it be? Just curious.

Coaccession · February-21-12, 07:55 PM

Originally Posted by rjk

Does anyone know what would be considered the DIA's most prestigious piece of artwork? If another museum could pick one piece from the DIA's collection what would it be? Just curious.

Does anyone know who would be considered Detroit's most prestigious murder victim? If enhanced public health and safety could save one life from among Detroit's residents and visitors, whose life should it be? Just curious about why the focus here keeps coming back to keeping artworks in town instead of saving lives of police and firefighters and paramedics... and artists and teachers and and doctors and store clerks and students and...

Some folks do see enhanced public health and safety as incompatible with keeping artworks in town -- I don't -- and come down on the side of the artworks instead of the public, but let's spare a thought for the public on this thread, and the services that matter most to them. Others see any added city funding as wasted rather than enhancing public health and safety -- they might be right -- but is that all there is to say on the subject?

**Wheels** · February-21-12, 08:26 PM

Lets piss it away on drugs and booze and hookers. At least we could have some fun.

**Gistok** · February-21-12, 09:19 PM

Originally Posted by rjk

Does anyone know what would be considered the DIA's most prestigious piece of artwork? If another museum could pick one piece from the DIA's collection what would it be? Just curious.

As something that can be moved... it would be Pieter Brueghel the Elder's Wedding Dance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:The_Wedding_Dance.JPG

Only about 45 confirmed Brueghel's are known to exist worldwide, with 1/3 of them tied up in Vienna's Art Museum. Most of them are in European museums, with probably fewer than a 1/2 dozen elsewhere. Not only is it valuable because it's rare, but Brueghel painted 2 major scene types... landscapes... and peasant genre scenes of common folk in everyday life. This is of the 2nd type... and among those it's one of the very best, with over 100 people in the scene. He painted several peasant wedding scenes, and this is his finest. It's pained not on canvas, but on wood.

Another very valuable artwork is the Diego Rivera Murals... "Detroit Industry". Many art critics say that Rivera, the greatest Latin American painter of the 20th century, created his finest work here in Detroit, and at Rockefeller Center in NYC. But of course the Rockefeller's hated the communist connection that Rivera painted into their mural, and within a year had it destroyed for a much tamer [[and lamer) mural by another artist. So the surviving Detroit mural wins in that department.

Of the American paintings... Frederick Church [[late 19th century "Hudson River School landscape painting")... his work "Cotopaxi" is my personal favorite, and arguably this mammoth painting is one of the DIA's crown jewels.

http://www.dia.org/object-info/baeac490-f496-4a17-b917-dd0216d11492.aspx

Church, and his Hudson School cohort Albert Bierstadt painted huge canvasses of the American west. These massive canvasses traveled around the country and to Europe to show the magnificent beauty of the American West. However Cotopaxi is a painting of a volcano in Ecuador [[tallest active volcano in the world).... and the colors are outstanding. Both Church and Bierstadt paintings have seen enormous gains in both popularity and value over the years. I believe that Cotopaxi was a steal at $700,000 back in the 70s.

On a different note... DIA Founders Society Chairman Richard Manoogian owns George Caleb Bingham's "The Jolly Flatboatmen".... the best of a series that he painted about life on the Mississippi in the early 19th century. Many art critics call this painting one of the 1/2 dozen most important American paintings of the early 19th century.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:George_Caleb_Bingham_The_Jolly_Flatboarmen.jp g

When Manoogian bought the painting many years ago [[I think he paid $5.5 million), it was on loan to the National Gallery in Washington on the Mall, with the stipulation that it stay there for a set period of time longer. It recently went on tour, and its' current whereabouts I have not been able to ascertain online. Perhaps Manoogian's picture will be coming home to Michigan [[he has a collection of art at his Masco HQ in Taylor, and a lot of masterpieces on loan or gifts to the DIA). So technically this painting is not a DIA acquisition [[yet).

And then there are the Van Gogh's at the DIA. The DIA's finest Van Gogh is a portrait of Joseph Roulin [[gift of Josephine Clay Ford originally in the Ford House in GPS)...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Portrait_of_the_Postman_Joseph_Roulin_[[1888)_ van_Gogh_DIA.jpg

**beachboy** · February-21-12, 09:28 PM

Thank you, Gistok, for a very cogent summary of DIA's jewels!!

Coaccession · February-22-12, 08:11 PM

Originally Posted by beachboy

Thank you, Gistok, for a very cogent summary of DIA's jewels!!

Between the Old Master Breugel -- excuse me, Elder Master -- and the Impressionist Van Gogh, could it be that Bing has half a billion dollars right there at today's high prices? And he's been telling union negotiators the City will be out of cash in April? Excuse me, but unless the City Charter makes Detroit a museum, it seems that honest financial accounting requires assets like those to count for something on its balance sheet. Honest management accounting, in turn, requires a decent return on a billion dollars in assets. Those four assets alone -- the Breugel, the Van Gogh, the Church and the Rivera -- ought to generate tens of millions of dollars of revenues annually for Detroit. And the DIA has over 60,000 objects! And the Founders Society needs a millage to fulfill its DIA management contract???

Did the Founders Society and the City let the Fords put restrictions on the Van Gogh Postman and Rivera Industry gifts, or can the City do whatever it decides with those? Clearly it can do what it wants with the Breugel Dance, a city purchase, and the Church Cotopaxi, a Founders Society purchase that must have been turned over to City ownership in due course.

Again, I believe the City has much better financial and cultural alternatives than outright sales of these assets. If it didn't, though, wouldn't its obligations to public safety and health still demand that it use that billion dollars for something other than keeping these artworks in town instead of LA or Arkansas or Qatar or Dubai? Bing has billions. Why can't fire fighters get police backup when a mob starts forming? Because the art is more important than firefighters' lives?

Thanks, indeed, Gistok, for letting us know which artworks might be more important than the firefighters lives. Is a Warhol more important than a policeman needing backup, or a citizen who has to wait for help to arrive because backup isn't available?

**Wild** · February-22-12, 10:39 PM

Originally Posted by rjk

Does anyone know what would be considered the DIA's most prestigious piece of artwork? If another museum could pick one piece from the DIA's collection what would it be? Just curious.

I'm thinking the Van Goghs and the piece of the Gate of Istar.

**1953** · February-23-12, 01:01 PM

Coaccession, stop being a jerk.

These paintings were donated or purchased with the intention that they be kept in perpetuity for public benefit.

They are not for sale.

**1953** · February-23-12, 01:07 PM

P.S. Illiquid assets are not counted as cash on a balance sheet. The city will be out of cash.

**Gistok** · February-23-12, 01:17 PM

Originally Posted by Wild

I'm thinking the Van Goghs and the piece of the Gate of Istar.

That piece of the Ishtar gate is small potatoes compared to the Berlin Pergamon Museum's entire gate....

http://www.flickr.com/photos/youngro...n/photostream/

**Mikeg** · February-24-12, 08:00 AM

Originally Posted by Coaccess...

..... Bing has billions......

Only if Bing can find investors willing to put billions of their hard-earned money into an untried, trademarked, patent-pending, legal "innovation" [source].

Given the way President Obama changed the normal rules of bankruptcy and took GM and Chrysler bondholders to the cleaners instead of the workers, who would be willing to purchase a "Collector Title[[TM)" and put themselves into the position of possibly becoming a subordinated creditor to a municipality that has not yet undergone a long-overdue financial restructuring?

I'm surprised that Lowell allows someone to use a trademarked word for their username. Since the holder of that trademark appears to also be the the person who is posting under that username and has been pedalling his legal product for some time now, shouldn't his posts belong in the "Free Ads" section of the forum?

**Baselinepunk** · February-24-12, 12:01 PM

"I'm surprised that Lowell allows someone to use a trademarked word for their username. Since the holder of that trademark appears to also be the the person who is posting under that username and has been pedalling his legal product for some time now, shouldn't his posts belong in the "Free Ads" section of the forum?"

That's what I don't understand. I pointed this out more than a few pages back; Lowell even made an appearance on this thread when this guy got really loose when folks [[like me) we basically telling him that his "concept" sucked, and get lost. Lowell just basically said "Hey, keep it cool." and let this dood continue to flail and shake this bullshit around. I'm sure this guy is hoping that someone from the City thinks this is a great idea and try to implement it; giving this DB some cash and fleecing the DIA's collection as a by product.

I've seen and heard DBs like this in the galleries and art world before; it's nothing new. Someone is always trying to capitalize on situations like this; the art world is no different. After I had a chat with some little birdies from C-Town; I decided not to waste my time with this DB and hoped that Lowell would eventually show this DB's ass the door.

Still waiting ...

Coaccession · February-26-12, 02:26 AM

Here's some new red meat for the Deaccession Police substation in Detroit:

http://theartlawblog.blogspot.com/20...-would-be.html

They can call Donn Zaretsky names for a while, and impugn his motives, for having the temerity to use Laura Berman's Detroit News column to point out "their favorite argument: If you sell, we will sanction you. Therefore, in order not to be sanctioned, you should not sell. Can't beat that logic." Read the whole thing.

You'd think that particular police substation would close soon -- hey, Detroit's cutting its public safety budget, so it probably can't spare any budget for art safety -- but there are always volunteers willing to do vigilante work for the 1%. They gotta stay on the good side of the billionaires who run the Founders Society to provide the fanciest possible backdrops for their corporate and high society events. No matter how many other 99%ers lose their jobs unnecessarily -- or their lives -- to trumped-up budget cuts, their diligent service might put the Deaccession Police among the lucky ones who get to keep some leftovers after serving champagne and canapes to the rich.

Ohh... wait... I'm sorry... the Deaccession Police only have pure motives! It's Donn Zaretsky who's trying to make a buck off Detroit. Have at him, Deaccession Police...