Detroit Mayoral Race 2017

[Meddle]

100%? Doesn't Detroit have both a resident and non-resident income tax?

That wasn't the question.


The question was, how many of them are PAYING taxes, not how many SHOULD be paying.

[emu steve]

That wasn't the question.


The question was, how many of them are PAYING taxes, not how many SHOULD be paying.

How does someone working downtown avoid having city income taxes, resident or non-resident, withheld from the income?

Best way to collect income taxes are before the employee sees his pay check.

Are you speaking of city residents claiming to be non-residents?

[Honky Tonk]

100%? Doesn't Detroit have both a resident and non-resident income tax?

And refresh my memory, but didn't those same downtown [[and Midtown) employers start a residential subsidy program for their employees who live within the city? Buy or rent.

I'm not sure of the specific companies, but they moved their enterprise downtown and offered their employees the residential subsidies. What more could they do?

Sounds to me like they 'went the extra mile' to be both good employers and be good for the city.

More of your B/S post. You've been on this forum long enough to have seen this article which was posted a few months ago:

http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article...ity-income-tax

SO, "less than 15% of the occupants in Midtown and Downtown are paying 2.4% COD taxes". 15% of 7K is 1050 residents. I'll let them each make $100,000 a year. 2.4% of that [[I'll give them they all work and live in the City) is $14, 280,000. To cite your earlier example, you've just given a billionaire a tax break of $50 million, even $100 million, to collect $14,280,000. Shrewd, Steve.

[emu steve]

Didn't see the article, but I'm aware of the problem, but that has nothing to do with bringing more businesses and employees downtown.

Tax enforcement is a different issue.

I get it. It's an enforcement issue. Build more beds at the WC jail for those should spend some time...

[Meddle]

How does someone working downtown avoid having city income taxes, resident or non-resident, withheld from the income?

Best way to collect income taxes are before the employee sees his pay check.

How many are on the books, receiving normal checks? How many are independent contractors, self employed consultants, etc.?

How many of the food service and similar employees work for tips only?

How many of the employers are honest enough to make those distinctions properly?

Are you speaking of city residents claiming to be non-residents?

And there's that possibility too; paying the .5% instead of the larger amount.

[Honky Tonk]

I get it. It's an enforcement issue. Build more beds at the WC jail for those should spend some time...

No, Steve, I don't think you do.

[O3H]

Close the tax loopholes, go after those sidestepping the Detroit City Tax.
Hopefully the mayor doesn't back down on this important issue.

Residents who work in the city pay 2.4% tax on their income;
nonresidents who work in the city pay 1.2%.
Businesses are assessed 2% corporate income taxes.
Taken together, the income tax is the city’s largest source of revenue
for its annual budget of about $1 billion, ahead of property and
casino taxes and state revenue sharing.

Recent revenue estimates set by the city-state Financial Review Commission,
the board that has oversight of the city’s finances post-bankruptcy,
project income tax revenue will be more than $273 million in the 2017 fiscal year,
nearly $279 million the following year and more than $284 million in the 2019 fiscal year.

[ABetterDetroit]

The city income tax evasion issue across city borders requires the State of Michigan to give a shit. Considering they were only willing to start withholding for city income taxes a couple of years ago I sure wouldn't hold my breath.

Expecting a city or Mayor of some 600 odd thousand to have the resources to solve this on its own is a little unrealistic.

The state has the power to enact laws and financial penalties with teeth for falsifying a legal address for instate income tax evasion or fraud on auto insurance yet those useless turds do nothing.

I think it is fair to ask why? I am willing to bet that if this was a wide spread problem affecting the Traverse Citys or Birminghams in this state that action would have already been taken.

[erikd]

How many are on the books, receiving normal checks? How many are independent contractors, self employed consultants, etc.?

How many of the food service and similar employees work for tips only?

How many of the employers are honest enough to make those distinctions properly?



And there's that possibility too; paying the .5% instead of the larger amount.

There is certainly an issue with Detroit residents not using their Detroit address as their "official" legal address, and using a suburban address in order to avoid paying the Detroit resident city income rate [[and the Detroit auto insurance rates.), but that is an issue of individuals committing tax evasion and insurance fraud on their own.

The question of how many employers in downtown/midtown Detroit are committing tax evasion by keeping their employees off the books, or falsely denying that their employees are actually working in the city, is a different issue, and one that is certainly less likely to occur, especially amongst the companies that are receiving the tax breaks discussed here.

Any company that is paying employees "off the books" is commiting federal and state tax fraud. While this practice is not uncommon for small businesses [[especially with certain part-time or temporary workers), it is not at all common practice in larger companies of the type being discussed here.

I seriously doubt that the Ilitch/Gilbert/GM/etc. level companies are keeping their employees off the books, or falsifying their employee records in order to commit tax fraud.

[Honky Tonk]

There is certainly an issue with Detroit residents not using their Detroit address as their "official" legal address, and using a suburban address in order to avoid paying the Detroit resident city income rate [[and the Detroit auto insurance rates.), but that is an issue of individuals committing tax evasion and insurance fraud on their own.

The question of how many employers in downtown/midtown Detroit are committing tax evasion by keeping their employees off the books, or falsely denying that their employees are actually working in the city, is a different issue, and one that is certainly less likely to occur, especially amongst the companies that are receiving the tax breaks discussed here.

Any company that is paying employees "off the books" is commiting federal and state tax fraud. While this practice is not uncommon for small businesses [[especially with certain part-time or temporary workers), it is not at all common practice in larger companies of the type being discussed here.

I seriously doubt that the Ilitch/Gilbert/GM/etc. level companies are keeping their employees off the books, or falsifying their employee records in order to commit tax fraud.

I work for a "global" company, and had to jump through hoops to get them to take out COD taxes. They just couldn't seem to grasp the idea, weren't interested, and asked me if I could just take care of it myself. After submitting the proper forms I finally got it straightened out. So I would say no, if you don't claim residency in Detroit, they're not going to take out COD taxes. The corporate problem is companies are buying small mom and pop stores in foreign countries, putting their logo on the door, and claiming that to be their main headquarters to avoid taxation. Buy "American".

[Oddz313]

Well the debate is tonight for a race that has not generated much buzz, experts say Young will have to just about knock Duggan off the stage to have a chance.....http://www.deadlinedetroit.com/artic...e#.WfCBm1tSxhE

[Oddz313]

New Coleman attack ad released mainly talking about crime and poverty, it also says elect a real Detroiter...http://www.deadlinedetroit.com/artic...y#.WfDZlltSxhE

[corktownyuppie]

More of your B/S post. You've been on this forum long enough to have seen this article which was posted a few months ago:

http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article...ity-income-tax

SO, "less than 15% of the occupants in Midtown and Downtown are paying 2.4% COD taxes". 15% of 7K is 1050 residents. I'll let them each make $100,000 a year. 2.4% of that [[I'll give them they all work and live in the City) is $14, 280,000. To cite your earlier example, you've just given a billionaire a tax break of $50 million, even $100 million, to collect $14,280,000. Shrewd, Steve.

I'm not taking a position on the structure of this [[or any other future) deal. I do, however, need to take a position on the math.


Giving a billionaire a $100 million tax break one time in order to collect $14,280,000 will pay for itself in 7-9 years, depending on what interest rates you are using. And that after its paid off, it's $14,280,000 [[and rising) every year after that.

Paying $100 one time in order to gain $14 per year with no time limit is an easy decision, math-wise. Politically, morally, sociologically...these are different questions.

Lastly, you are only including the income tax in this equation. If these are people living downtown, then you also need to add in the increase in property taxes you're bringing in.

Again, not a political position. I'm just saying that if we are going to look at the cost side of any proposal, we have to weigh it against the benefit side.

I am not married to any side on this. If my math is incorrect, I am humbly open to other analysis I may be missing on it

[Oddz313]

My prediction for today is that Duggan wins by about a 65-35 margin and most council incumbents win re-election with McCallister being new, Leland maybe having a fight in his district and maybe an at large seat being surrendered. I hope Waters at large does not get the win but I have a feeling she might be the boner move for the night.

[JBMcB]

Giving a billionaire a $100 million tax break one time in order to collect $14,280,000 will pay for itself in 7-9 years, depending on what interest rates you are using. And that after its paid off, it's $14,280,000 [[and rising) every year after that.

My issue with these kinds of tax breaks is that they aren't a one time deal. After a few years, another tax break is worked out to "keep" the team in the city. Something like this happened in Virginia, where a city paid for a new stadium AND gave the team tax breaks. Once the tax breaks were ended, the team moved to a different city.

Granted, it's a bit of a different situation with Gilbert, as he owns everything around the stadium so it's in his best interest to keep the teams around. That won't mean he won't get another tax break pushed through, though.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

The race for City Clerk seems a little suspect to me. Early in the night, Gilchrist had a huge advantage over Winfrey, then around 11pm, it was announced that Winfrey had a miraculous rally, and passed him, and won by 1,482 votes. I'm sure he's going to call for a re-count.