Detroit Update: On the Pistons Moving to Little Caesars Arena, and New Soccer Stadium

[Hypestyles]

So will there be a contractual guarantee that some of the tickets will actually be "affordable" like affordable housing set-asides?

Probably not.

[SpartanDawg]

what a difference a year makes..

[emu steve]

I was in Detroit over Thanksgiving week. I took some photos from Adelaide looking west toward the arena. Nice.

What impressed me was the view from street level. The buildings in front of the arena on Woodward completely camouflage the height of LCA.

I don't have good photos but I was impressed how far the twin parking garages extend toward Clifford. This alone make the project much bigger than simply a big arena. And then, of course, we have the stuff going up on either side of the arena by Henry and by Temple.

[313rd]

This article is [[2) two years old, but is very informative on how the financing takes place.

http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article...re-are-answers

[401don]

I was in Detroit over Thanksgiving week. I took some photos from Adelaide looking west toward the arena. Nice.

What impressed me was the view from street level. The buildings in front of the arena on Woodward completely camouflage the height of LCA.

I don't have good photos but I was impressed how far the twin parking garages extend toward Clifford. This alone make the project much bigger than simply a big arena. And then, of course, we have the stuff going up on either side of the arena by Henry and by Temple.

Did you really say you were impressed at how the giant parking garages make the project much bigger? And people accuse you of being an Ilitch supporter!

[emu steve]

Did you really say you were impressed at how the giant parking garages make the project much bigger? And people accuse you of being an Ilitch supporter!

Part of the problem there is that there was so much undeveloped land.

Anything which develops that undeveloped land for a productive use is good.

Parking structures are better than weeded lots.

[1953]

And, coming full circle, there is lots of developable land because Ilitch bought up the land and buildings and let them rot.

[hybridy]

Walsh Construction is lone respondent to Wayne County jail RFQ

better for Gores & Gilbert?

[southen]

Absolutely. I think it says that there isn't a lot of faith in the construction industry that this project will be moving forward or that it can be finished for a reasonable amount of money.

[EGrant]

Big article from SB Nation about the MLS expansion.

MLS wants a Detroit expansion team, but Detroit City FC fans want them to get lost

Yawn. I think letting this small, loud group speak for DCFC fans is hilarious. I'd surmise that the average soccer fan wants MLS here.

I like going to DCFC games, but I want to see Detroit and soccer on the regional and national stage. Anyone catch the MLS final? It was an awesome environment and shoots holes in the argument that MLS games are soulless corporate events.

[ekleezy]

EGrant, I completely agree. I regularly go to DCFC matches and stay in the supporters section. It's a lot of fun but I'd really like to have a bigger soccer team to root for. I wish Gilbert and Gores would try to incorporate DCFC into an MLS plan, but I also wish the Northern Guard supporters weren't so opposed to it.

[Mackinaw]

With all due respect to their legitimate and grassroots startup fandom, they need to grow the fuck up and get behind a pro team, having their say in same and ensuring that Detroit has an especially well-supported pro team. They are the local soccer fanatics and they hold the keys to whether a pro team will have a strong fanatic following, which is crucial. They likewise can have a say in various details about the team, even the configuration of the stadium seating, if they want it.

Why hold Detroit back to the semi-sub-pro leagues with a team that, though impressive and spirited, can be beaten by certain college teams, when you have the opportunity to join a legitimate pro league? Are you proving some kind of point by saying that Detroit should only compete with Erie PA and Muskegon MI and shouldn't be taking on LA Galaxy and hosting Arsenal for friendlies. OK, right. The Detroit franchise can also be called DCFC and said franchise can remain engaged in the sub-pros by maintaining the current squad as a feeder team, as is standard in soccer. If the Northern Guard only wishes to attend the sub-pro games, that is their choice.

[EGrant]

Again, this is a TINY group of middle aged hipsters who are making so much noise on social media that they fool legit publications into thinking that's what everyone thinks. No one outside their little pretend hooligan culture circle is saying no to the MLS. They aren't holding an MLS club or DCFC back; it'll happen whether they are pro or against and they'll have to deal with it. If their SUPPORTER BUILT CLUB is as strong as they say, it should have no problem continuing with an MLS team in the area. [[And I think they'll be fine)

Look at the DCFC Facebook page. The comments are almost all anti-NGS and pro-MLS. The NGS has been so argumentative, childish and so vitriolic, that anything they say falls on deaf ears at this point. They'd rather see all levels of soccer in America and Detroit fail if it isn't DCFC. I'd rather see the game grow. See you at Platinum Equity Stadium for the home opener in a few years.

[CrashDummy]

While I think the NGS truly believes that they are being inclusive, it seems what they really fear is the loss of their own exclusive club and the power that they hold over the team and the other fans, and even the neighborhood to a certain extent.

[emu steve]

Pistons will announce in two weeks location of practice facilities and team offices...

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/bus...ilty/97994782/

[emu steve]

Pistons will announce Friday...

http://www.freep.com/story/sports/nb...town/98328256/

[Hypestyles]

Interesting: here's a sample of how stadiums convert from hockey to basketball and back:

http://www.core77.com/posts/22530/ho...ll-field-22530

[emu steve]

Not related to Detroit soccer per se, but a very good [[I think) discussion of MLS [[preview) including expansion, stadiums, players, instant replay and miscellaneous other topics.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.d8b9bc1ec97b

[EGrant]

Orlando's stadium is awesome. That safe standing section [["The Wall") is incredible. LAFC's upcoming stadium also looks spectacular. Love to see architects finally showing some real soccer knowledge in American stadiums, as opposed to just building some generic stands and a cool facade. If Detroit wins the bid, I hope the architects create something that truly caters to the game, and doesn't end up being generic.

[emu steve]

Orlando's stadium is awesome. That safe standing section [["The Wall") is incredible. LAFC's upcoming stadium also looks spectacular. Love to see architects finally showing some real soccer knowledge in American stadiums, as opposed to just building some generic stands and a cool facade. If Detroit wins the bid, I hope the architects create something that truly caters to the game, and doesn't end up being generic.

http://www.freep.com/story/sports/20...roit/98785550/

[EGrant]

Wow a privately funded stadium? Didn't know that was possible.

[emu steve]

Looks like this will be high drama this spring as a decision is made at the Gratiot site.

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/spo...site/99434064/

[emu steve]

Wow a privately funded stadium? Didn't know that was possible.

Soccer stadiums aren't that expensive. Say 150 - 200M, exclusive of land.

NFL stadiums are now EXTREMELY expensive, 1B+. [[and, yes, TOO EXPENSIVE).

Nationals Park [[MLB, 2008) was about 650M.

The way I see it, MLS stadiums can still be built privately but MLB, NHL/NBA and NFL stadiums will require some public monies as all are now over 500M.

[Hypestyles]

Looks like this will be high drama this spring as a decision is made at the Gratiot site.

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/spo...site/99434064/

whatever choice is made, I want the owners to pay for their own stadium, wherever it ends up.

[MikeyinBrooklyn]

Hyperstyles, if I recall correctly, the Gilbert/Gores proposal does have them paying for the entire stadium [[plus surrounding projects). It also calls on Gilbert/Gores to cover cost overruns/delay costs not only on their project but also on the jail project. Now, I suspect with them at the helm there will be no overruns, but if the county were to need build the jail at either site, there is no reason to believe whatsoever that the project could come in on time and under budget. Just no history of that.

Now, the project does call on the developers to capture some amorphous efficiency savings at the new criminal justice project. That seems rather murky and potentially contentious, so I would prefer a straight up tax phase-in for the jail site project. I would not tax it for 4 years [[time to completely build it out), and then phase in property taxes at 20% of assessed value per year, so that in 5 years of operation it will be a full taxpaying project. There is no downside to city/county taxpayers on that, since the site is both not currently generating any tax revenue and costing the county $1.2M a month.

Today's detnews article doesn't really reveal anything new, but it does lay out rather clearly what a good bid Detroit has, with strong plan, ownership, fanbase, etc. It does also point out some weak spots in the bids of other cities [[for example, Saint Louis needing to pass a referendum next month to get a stadium, and the likelihood of that referendum failing).