Art Van Opening Downtown Store

[illwill]

Patience is tough, I feel you there, but keep in mind how far downtown has come in the last 5 years. We are just now getting to the point that new construction makes sense and I think once things get going on the Hudson site you will see other more ambitious proposals downtown. Gilbert and Bedrock have also hinted that an announcement for the Monroe block will be coming next year. Momentum is definitely building and instead of comparing downtown to other cities right now, try comparing downtown to what it was just a few years ago. There is plenty to be optimistic about and downtown will eventually get to where we all want it to be.

I absolutely agree with you! And we also cannot forget how we got this far. Grass roots participation and organizations are still needed throughout the downtown region just as they are in the neighborhoods. This is still Detroit and we need a lot more involvement from everyone so we do not slip back into the negative.

[gthomas]

Yeah, I get what you're saying. It's just disheartening and having a feeling of "jealousy" in my soul when I visit other cities, even smaller cities are further than us. I'm always saying to myself "Why we don't have this, I'm confuse why they can invest here and not Detroit?".

I get the whole recession, bankruptcy, etc...thing. The ball is rolling, but we're still losing the race. I guess I should sit down and relax til year 2018. Maybe change my perspective on things. :/

[Dbest]

Yeah, I get what you're saying. It's just disheartening and having a feeling of "jealousy" in my soul when I visit other cities, even smaller cities are further than us. I'm always saying to myself "Why we don't have this, I'm confuse why they can invest here and not Detroit?".

I get the whole recession, bankruptcy, etc...thing. The ball is rolling, but we're still losing the race. I guess I should sit down and relax til year 2018. Maybe change my perspective on things. :/

I do the same thing when it comes to wondering why some of the amenities other cities have, Detroit doesn't? Sometimes that negativity can even overshadow fun that I'm having. Anyone who is infatuated with the COD shares these feelings. It's depressing wondering if/when.

There have many so many great things that have taken place downtown, it's undeniable at this point. As others have suggested, we have to keep things in perspective though.

Detroit is coming from a lot further down in the barrel than most, now couple that with how long it took to get the initial ball "rolling" and you are going have a slower pace. Not to mention how big downtown is, it will take a massive effort,over decades, to return to any congruent feel from block to block. It's understandably chopped up.

[dtowncitylover]

Yeah, I get what you're saying. It's just disheartening and having a feeling of "jealousy" in my soul when I visit other cities, even smaller cities are further than us. I'm always saying to myself "Why we don't have this, I'm confuse why they can invest here and not Detroit?".

I get the whole recession, bankruptcy, etc...thing. The ball is rolling, but we're still losing the race. I guess I should sit down and relax til year 2018. Maybe change my perspective on things. :/

I don't mean to pull a Bham, but it is because the general populace is poor. And before you say, "well they all come to the suburbs to shop so there has to be demand", that demand is not enough for some retailers. The demand in the suburbs is high because their buying power is stronger. They can afford to buy more things at once and in greater quantity. Economically disadvantaged people don't usually shop at Costco because it costs a membership and bulk can be expensive, despite the investment.

While I want to see a resurgence of retail in Detroit, we need to see population growth within the 7.2 have continual growth for many years to come. And I do think people are moving back in, but until the income and population is stable enough stores like Cartier can only be a dream. Growth can come however, with transit and with viable retail options like Target, outlet stores, and grocery stores. Art Van can be good because it's a showroom-based retailer [[aka theft should be minimal because it's probably difficult to steal a 200 lbs couch in downtown Detroit). It's a brand name company with local roots and have more mainstream/traditional designs.

I also look around cities and wonder why, but then I remember the reality of the situation.

[illwill]

I moved out of Michigan several years ago because I didn't want my entire life to go by, not experiencing what it's like to live in a large bustling city. Now, after getting my fix, i'm looking forward to being back in Detroit. I see all of the unique things Detroit offers that cannot be found in most other cities. We have a distinct vibe found nowhere else in the world and we're still a big city. We should embrace it and run with it. Development will eventually return to Detroit and we will have what other cities have. However, I hope it'll be done in a way that feels like Detroit and not Anytown, USA.

I hate to be pessimistic but the reason investors do not rush to invest in Detroit is because it's a majority black city. No question about it. You can travel through many other smaller, less-populated cities that have tons of retail throughout. The median income is high enough to sustain significant retail here in Detroit, as well. We have to get creative and look within to find ways to build a retail scene in the Downtown Detroit region. And then we have to support it. I like the idea of Art Van coming into the city however, I agree that they cannot sell over-sized furniture that one might find in their suburban stores. They need to specialize in furniture designed for smaller spaces with more of an urban feel. Possibly work with local furniture designers.

Yes, Detroit is very far behind many other cities but I guarantee you it'll come back. I remember telling myself, that I'll return to the city IF the Book Cadillac will ever be renovated. I NEVER in my entire life thought that would EVER happen! It's done and several others as well and many in the works. When Woodward reopens, the pedestrian flow of Downtown from Jefferson to the New Center will bustle. This will lead to more development down Grand Boulevard soon after and North towards Highland Park.

Personally, I'd like to see more black millionaires invest in the city since Detroit is 82% black. It only makes sense. I'd also like to see Dan Gilbert partner with more athletes and celebs such as Jalen Rose, Kid Rock, Eminem, Big Sean Magic Johnson, Isaiah Thomas etc... in the center city area. He has the knowledge so why not help them invest in the region. A 5 story mega-mall in the middle of the city with a hotel and condos on top can survive in this city. But it has to be done unconventionally, because we're in dysfunctional Detroit.

[gthomas]

I get it now, guess we gotta crawl before we walk?

[illwill]

I get it now, guess we gotta crawl before we walk?

I think it'll be a short walk before we begin to sprint. Detroit is coming back.

[Mind field]

I hate to be pessimistic but the reason investors do not rush to invest in Detroit is because it's a majority black city. No question about it. You can travel through many other smaller, less-populated cities that have tons of retail throughout. The median income is high enough to sustain significant retail here in Detroit, as well. We have to get creative and look within to find ways to build a retail scene in the Downtown Detroit region. And then we have to support it.

No. Race has little, if anything to do with it. It's all about incomes and CRIME. Money doesn't see color, it just sees opportunity and ROI. Low incomes and high crime make for a very hostile environment in which to invest. That's changing downtown, but the stereotypes and stigma remain.

[stasu1213]

Let's remove the harassing bums away from CBD and make the area enticing for retail to want to open in the district. I had said years ago that Downtown Detroit need a heavy police presence in cars, on bicycles, and on foot; Especially on Merchant's Row or anywhere on Woodward from Jefferson to Grand Circus Park.

It appear to me that the retail that had allowed to open in Downtown/Midtown have a Michigan connection. John Vartvatos is from Michigan, Carharrt started in Detroit, Art Van started in Michigan. Retail that don't have a Michigan connection are having a hard time trying to get started in Detroit. We don't know for sure if Nike, Restoration Hardware, Apple, are actually going to set up shop in downtown Detroit. They may announce that they are looking into Metro Detroit tri county area and not Detroit. Even chain restaurants such as Buffalo Wild Wings, The Roasting Plant, Texas De Brasil, etc had a hard time getting through the red tape that the city still throw up. I am happy and hoping that an Art Van will open downtown. The income downtown/Midtown/Lafayette Park/Brush Park will support it. There is money downtown eventhough the rest of the city is poor. I don't believe that downtown is poor itself

[SDCC]

I hope there is a clearance center; they do have some great buys every once in a while.

[belleislerunner]

I'm not sure why you think Dan Gilbert needs to invest with the millionaires you listed [[e.g. Magic Johnson). Johnson has had the 8 Mile/Woodward site for 15 years and you can see how successful he has been with that. You don't add dead weight to your projects, you add lift to your wings.

[maverick1]

I've been to GR, I can agree. I do feel they're progressing nicely and do love the new residential/hotel development. Soon they will surpass Detroit as far as "new residential highrise and retail options" compared to the rate we're going. It's alot planned here in Detroit, but not enough "new" options.

Maybe I'm a little impatient, but I feel we can do better. The city needs to make it easier for developers to invest here, close these loop holes. I know banks aren't lending etc..yeah yeah. I believe we're over that "let's test the water first" mentality. Clearly the demand is there, we can support up to 10,000 new residential units a year. We're only developing about 1,500 units [[steadily) a year. We're losing out on potential new and/or returning residents.

All I'm saying is, go hard or go home. Step your game up, just a tad. I'm tired of the mediocre style of development. We deserve a "Wow" development. District Detroit residential plans is okay...blah. Gilbert has a blank slate along Woodward, hope his retail plans and Hudson site meet that "WOW" factor, we got one shot! Make it good. Ijs

I'm not too sure you're being impatient. Developments move slower than a snail's pace in Detroit compared to other cities. That may not be a bad thing. I want Detroit's growth and improvement to be real and sustainable. I have a feeling that some of the cities that Detroit wants to be mentioned with have a model that's not sustainable.

[emu steve]

I'm not too sure you're being impatient. Developments move slower than a snail's pace in Detroit compared to other cities. That may not be a bad thing. I want Detroit's growth and improvement to be real and sustainable. I have a feeling that some of the cities that Detroit wants to be mentioned with have a model that's not sustainable.

I agree with your points.

It seems from what I read that Detroit's growth and improvement seems sustainable.

I don't see a lot of crazy speculation which is not sustainable. We talk about the big names spending hundreds of millions on development and they certainly aren't speculators but folks dedicated to make positive changes to Detroit.

As has been discussed many times, it does not seem that there is overbuilding of residential units in say CBD, downtown, Midtown, etc. which can't be absorbed. Actually the opposite.

Ditto with lodging. It seems that new rooms are coming online and being absorbed.

I just don't see crazy speculation being fueled by super low interest rates.

I don't see projects in CBD/downtown, midtown, New Center, etc. which don't seem to make sense.

I think folks outside Detroit will be surprised as new housing say in Brush Park, or near Comerica or the new arena gets spoken for as soon as it is completed. Doubt we'll see completed projects 1/3 empty.

Be interesting to see how new housing units in New Center are absorbed.

[maverick1]

I agree with your points.

It seems from what I read that Detroit's growth and improvement seems sustainable.

I don't see a lot of crazy speculation which is not sustainable. We talk about the big names spending hundreds of millions on development and they certainly aren't speculators but folks dedicated to make positive changes to Detroit.

As has been discussed many times, it does not seem that there is overbuilding of residential units in say CBD, downtown, Midtown, etc. which can't be absorbed. Actually the opposite.

Ditto with lodging. It seems that new rooms are coming online and being absorbed.

I just don't see crazy speculation being fueled by super low interest rates.

I don't see projects in CBD/downtown, midtown, New Center, etc. which don't seem to make sense.

I think folks outside Detroit will be surprised as new housing say in Brush Park, or near Comerica or the new arena gets spoken for as soon as it is completed. Doubt we'll see completed projects 1/3 empty.

Be interesting to see how new housing units in New Center are absorbed.

Exactly. I don't mind things happening a tad bit faster. I just don't want the bad things I see in NYC, DC, and other destination cities. Those cities are great, but right now those cities come at a price I think is too much too pay in the short term and unsustainable in the long term.

[illwill]

I concur with emu steve and maverick1. If we continue on this trajectory and with a little more creativity, I'd say we're on the right track.