Why is M1 Rail so cheap?

[Gpwrangler]

No...you wait. Besides, what do you care? How often do you ride the #53?

Just wait til it starts running.

[Honky Tonk]

It'll work fine for it's intended purpose, hauling fans back and forth to parking lots.

[313WX]

It'll work fine for it's intended purpose, hauling fans back and forth to parking lots.

In other words, a farther reaching People Mover...

[ABetterDetroit]

The streetcars are too light to clear traffic. People watch out for real trains [[well except a few hundred per year that manage to get hit) but they'll just laugh at these things and cut in front of them. It's gonna be a real circus.

I have little doubt that this will be a great revenue earner for the DPD and the word will get out that it's expensive and risky to mess with the train if you don't have your house in order. Then a council member or the city clerk will scream to high heaven about the "unfairness and costs of impounding" associated with getting in the train's way and the word will get out even faster. When there's money to be made, law enforcement works more efficiently. Like it or not, it's just a fact of life.

[Bobl]

Honky Tonk and 313WX are correct. It is a parking shuttle, a revenue raiser, and for some local neighborhood residents, a ride to work. Nothing more, nothing less.
Dedicated bus lanes, similar to those used in Grand Rapids, would have been much less expensive, and easily expandable.

[dtowncitylover]

It'll work fine for it's intended purpose, hauling fans back and forth to parking lots.

Pray tell us, what parking lots are going to be served by this? I would imagine most Tiger/Lions fans park within a 5-10 minute walk from the stadiums and will have no use for this. A family or group isn't going to pay $5-10 parking 2 miles north to have to pay an extra $5-10 for a transit trip which will also include RT fare. I'm so sick of the argument.

And Bobl, this too is easily expandable, just build it further north. And add an E-W line. The value of a streetcar is much more than stupid BRT.

[professorscott]

Honky Tonk and 313WX are correct. It is a parking shuttle, a revenue raiser, and for some local neighborhood residents, a ride to work. Nothing more, nothing less.
Dedicated bus lanes, similar to those used in Grand Rapids, would have been much less expensive, and easily expandable.

Dedicated bus lanes would have been impossible. MDOT was unwilling to take away traffic lanes for the purpose. Otherwise the streetcar would be running in dedicated lanes.

Also, this ignores one of the 800 lb. gorillas in the room: who would operate these buses? DDOT? Really? SMART? SMART only minimally serves Detroit, because Detroit is one of those famous opt-out communities. The thing that makes M1 credible, that makes it likely people will use it, is that it's NOT being operated by the City. The private interests providing the bulk of the funding for M1 had no interest in buses, so that money would have gone away, and with it the $25M TIGER funds.

I'm all in favor of dedicated bus lanes where it makes sense to do that. But lower Woodward wouldn't work.

[rbdetsport]

Transit Signal Progression will be operating with the streetcar [[which can be run as light rail in the future when the line expands north). The signal at Mack and along Mack tend to be the major bottleneck after a Tigers game. I imagine this will be accounted for when the new signal timings are implemented along Woodward and Mack.

[ronaldj]

I may be talking out of my ass here. But I think the number is $162 million to complete this lame-brained project. The City, County and Statate are out of their minds to push this project through.

Coleman Young pushed forward the Peopl Mover with funds generated by the Jimmy Carter administration.

What did we get? A little useless round about.

Why? DIA and Detroit Public Library, after EPA consideration, were considered in danger of falling into the ground if an undergound railroad [[sorry for the cheap joke) was insitigated and passed by their front doors. Therefore, Detroit squandered federal monies on a useless, albeit, tourist friendly ride around downtown.

Has the EPA been heard from on the current project? I have not heard a peep. No fan of theirs but where is the noise regarding maintaining the integrity of these buildings once the jackhammers start hitting Woodward in their vicinity.

[ghettopalmetto]

I may be talking out of my ass here. But I think the number is $162 million to complete this lame-brained project. The City, County and Statate are out of their minds to push this project through.

Coleman Young pushed forward the Peopl Mover with funds generated by the Jimmy Carter administration.

What did we get? A little useless round about.

Why? DIA and Detroit Public Library, after EPA consideration, were considered in danger of falling into the ground if an undergound railroad [[sorry for the cheap joke) was insitigated and passed by their front doors. Therefore, Detroit squandered federal monies on a useless, albeit, tourist friendly ride around downtown.

Has the EPA been heard from on the current project? I have not heard a peep. No fan of theirs but where is the noise regarding maintaining the integrity of these buildings once the jackhammers start hitting Woodward in their vicinity.

The EPA would be concerned with contaminants in soil. They do not have structural engineering expertise, nor do they exercise regulatory powers with regard to structural engineering.

I question where you get your information. Undermining of the DIA, Detroit Public Library, or any other building, are only a concern if you're digging tunnels in close proximity to existing foundations--the definition of "close" dependent upon the depth of existing building foundations as well as the soil type. Ultimately, responsibility falls on the Professional Engineer who signs and seals the engineering documents of the new construction.

But those are all moot points, aren't they?

[ndavies]

Coleman Young pushed forward the Peopl Mover with funds generated by the Jimmy Carter administration.

The money came from President Ford not Jimmy Carter. He had appropriated $600 Million to build a region wide system. The city was the only group able to get there shit together enough to build a portion of the entire system.

[dtowncitylover]

I may be talking out of my ass here.

You got that right.

You should probably go do your own research on the project and transit history in Detroit before you make lame-brained assertions.