Tent City?

[sumas]

It sounds to me like you may be in a position to get government assistance to provide help. It could be a win/win.

Of course we have considered what you suggest, government rules are bizarre and keep changing with no notice. Don't like sounding selfish but we do need to consider what we do and impact on us. How can we help people if we get screwed helping'

Can't help but ask, were you heavily involved with Creekside at some point. Your name is just so familiar. Its been a bit since we were heavily involved with the org. So many people I deeply respected have now passed, Suzanne died, Patty died. Anne moved from her drop dead fabulous home after a bullet came through her wall and lodged in her pillow while she was in bed. John has just given up. Sharron tried to forge on but hard to carry the burden alone. The city CDC members are fools. Still know plenty of people there but all got frustrated with politics so they just forge on privately. So much of the leadership is gone and the strong ones left get no support. The temple is floundering and sold off lots of residencial property which undermined some of the stability. Brown ruined the island and Morgan estates failed enterprise destroyed the Fisher woodlot. Don't get me started on that bastard. He makes Brown look good. If you aren't who I think you are this is all gibbersh so just ignore, in that case.

[sumas]

I don't know what's going on with this situation. From what I read here, I have mixed emotions.

What I don't understand is, I have digital cameras from an Iphone to a good digital camera, a $40 Kodak point & shoot 14 mega pixel camera, a cheap cell phone camera and a digital movie cam, all of which I can shoot a photo, download it on my computer and post it within a few minutes. A picture is worth a thousand words right. I think that's what this forum is lacking these days are photos of what's going on. Let's keep it a little interesting. I rarely see photos, other than Lowells these days that tell a story others can interpret in a meaningful way. Everyone's always taking pictures constantly, but we rarely see anything here. Snap a photo, create a story. Give a bit more insight to what's going on in these situations.

Just my two cents.

Sorry old guy, my computer skills are limited. I do have a digital camera but no clue how to post them. However I do have other talents and getting people help is one. I don't want want to see these people become "snowflakes", a term used in Moscow for the dead and homeless discovered when the snow melts. Holidays however is not a great time to contact agencies.

Peoples hearts are good. They got deluged with donations, probably lots that can't be used. They were buried understuff in bags when I was there last. They are living in pup tents. Not a lot of room to hoard. My husband has Parkinsons and can't haul stuff away. A friend is coming from the westside. I don't live far and plan to see if they can use a folding table to just sort stuff if they have not already.

My take on the story is these people need help on different levels. If a problem is identified, work to fix it. There is a problem, they are trying to highlight the way we treat our neediest citizens, Pretty crappy and judging from comments on the forum, people want to just hide them away.

Easy, out of sight, out of mind. Forget the tremendous need. Few have bothered to engage them. Just sweep them away. They are not begging, it is not a pit and they are people in trouble

Real people are there. Well I'll do do my best to find them housing but really haven't seen any one exactly stepping forward to tell their stories, just a lot of vitrol.

I could care if people are disturbed but sanitation that is really a big issue. I'll know more tomorrow but really can't do much until after the New Year

[Vic01]

...You fail to understand that the protest needs to be visual to a point. THEY NEED HELP.

Sanitation is terrible and I stick to my comment, pitch in with neighbors and get a port a potty. Most likely I might visit tomorrow. If I find out they can have a port a Potty, pretty sure I can russle up a donation.

...Get them a portapotty or pay us 1k a month to house and hide them behind my stockade fence. Quit bitching and look to help for better accomodations/jobs/assistance for the ones that can't help themselves at all, via social help
organizations

I am working on getting them appropriate help but frankly they aren't in my backyard they are shitting in yours. Get proactive.

1. It's not a "protest", it's some illegal squatters in a city lot sleeping in tents.
2. I stick to my comment back at post #50 "I'm confused... It's illegal for the tenters to be living next to legal residents, yet a poster suggests the legal residents should "Take a collection, rent a porta potty" for them to enable them to stay there in a more sanitary condition"?
Also, I'm fairly certain that it would be illegal to place a portapotty on city property without a permit. Oh, I forgot we're not worried about being legal are we? Would a reputable company even come out and set one up...?
3. If you want to "help" maybe you could drive the tenters over to the doorstep of the social help organizations so that they could be "visual" and protest there.
4. I will agree that DetBill should "quit bitching" here on the forum... and get his condo neighbors together and go bitch at the health department, the city council, the cops, and every other city agency that is allowing the tenters to stay on city property. Maybe their legal "protest" would get some action?
5. I'm also fairly certain that it's against some ordinance, law, or whatever, to live in a tent all year even "hiding behind a stockade fence"... you might get away with it though. What message will it send to ignore the housing ordinances, laws, etc? What the hell, might as well set 'em up with an illegal electric hook up too, right?

[Dan Wesson]

Just for curiosity's sake,
I would like to know he make and model of these pup tents.
Some of them are downright expensive.
There are three season tents.
No four season tents are marketed as such.
When temps drop to the teens and below
these folks are in danger and not from the usual suspects alone.
Lot's of calories needed to maintain body heat.

[DetBill]

Sumas, I applaud you for your efforts, not trying to bitch on here ,
we have been pro active, already talked to the city, police and health, they indicated they are looking into it. We found it interesting the oaper indicated no one had issues with it when we had talked to the police about it earlier that week. A couple of us went to talk to a couple of people. They told us they had no interest in refuge alternatives and basically were just going to stay.
thats about as pro active as we can be. Its time for the authorities to straighten this up. We have no interest in this area living next to a growing field of human waste.

[DetBill]

Already have done that Vic, over a week ago , thep police indicated they were looking into alternatives, talked to two of the habitants, no luck there for sure. Sorry if you think Im bitching but Im not content living next to this mess. We work hard in this area to keep it looking good and to see it turning into a cesspool in a illegal occupation is not good. Best not to accuse someone till you ask them if they have done anything first

[sumas]

Sorry Bill, clearly they can't stay there. I can be bitchy its true, but I am looking into orgs that can help relocate these individuals who are quite varied in needs, abilities and mental health. Different folks have different dilemmas Not sure who you talked to but I found articulate people highlighting that they would rather freeze than face the depravity of the bulk of the shelters. Certainly did not talk to all and yes a fair portion of homeless have problems that living in a tent will not solve.

Its the holiday, not much can be done Until after the new year, herding people away is no solution. The point should be solutions not contempt. Intelligent relocation. jobs for those capable should be a priority.Assisted living or disability income for the mentally wounded and placement in government housing.

Compassion not hostility works wonders. I get hugs and kisses. They want solutions too. I'll do my best to bring in help for relocation.

[Vic01]

Already have done that Vic, over a week ago , thep police indicated they were looking into alternatives, talked to two of the habitants, no luck there for sure. Sorry if you think Im bitching but Im not content living next to this mess. We work hard in this area to keep it looking good and to see it turning into a cesspool in a illegal occupation is not good. Best not to accuse someone till you ask them if they have done anything first

Bill,
I wasn't accusing [[just borrowed the term "bitching" from another poster), and I think you're concerns are 100% valid. I was encouraging you to gather up a handful of neighbors and show up at various city offices repeatedly, be a pain in their ass, keep doing it weekly until you hear more than "we'll look into it". Be the squeaky wheel...

The term "protest" is thrown around often these days. Take a few neighbors, make up your own cardboard signs, "DPD encourages illegal squatting" or "City Council encourages illegal squatting" [[if they're not addressing it, then they are encouraging it), "Health Dept. allows health Hazard", then go stand on the street in front of their headquarters for an hour and the City County Bldg for another hour. Have printed handouts to pass out stating your neighbors concerns. Email your concerns to all the local news outlets letting them know when you'll be on the street "protesting". I'll bet some local news reporters will be glad to talk with you, and if any story/interview like that hits the TV news [[or even the paper), the odds in your favor go way up. Bad press from legal residents gets action.

p.s. If you pm me the time/place, I'll bring hot coffee.

[sumas]

Better to take coffee to the homeless. I had hoped today [[Sunday)to go there but had unexpected holiday company. My point is to talk to the "leaders", Mary Jo & CJ to catalogue needs of the group and varied difficulties To understand can lead to resolution. Certainly it is not desirable for residents nor the "tent" people to remain there. I have been compiling a list of orgs/churches, social services and individuals that can provide help with housing. There are many people that can be enlisted to resolve these problems.

A forumer asked for pictures which I can take, but only with express permission from the individuals. Kind forumers will no doubt assist me posting them. More information on needs is definitely in order. More than happy to bring those that will come to my home for a decent dinner and discussion.

Frankly I am still underwhelmed at the compassion on this forum. Vic is the only one on the forum directly affected.

Of course.... he doesn't want vagrants, your words not mine, shitting in his back forty.

Proactive help , creative solutions, communication, go way farther then un affected parties screaming. Please spare me your My tax dollar spent on bums crap.

Annoy me enough, mean, hate spewing, selfish, souless people, I'll rent a porta potty my self, buy a free standing fire pit, a kerosene heater, rent a big tent and join them. I might be 60, disabled, no trust fund income but the treatment of the truely poor with no resources that respect human dignity is untenable to me.

[sumas]

Vic please understand I am in your corner too. This is a bad situation. Both sides need to be looked at too. I have been an activist all my life and am obviously out spoken. For whatever reason the plight of these people touch me.

I pledge to do my best to help these folk. I do understand your frustration but these people are not scary. I will be working the phones this week but honestly the holiday season makes things slow in action innitiated. Certainly some people can't be helped but as I have not met all of them I can't yet comment. Have a little patience, please. You don't want them there for obvious homeowner reasons/sanitary concerns nor do I, for humanitarian reasons.

Different concerns but same goals.

[Vic01]

Sumas,
Two things -
I think that you may be confusing me with DetBill, it's his backyard, not mine. I am not "directly affected." I was merely offering him my support/encouragement [[in my own outspoken manner) to go through steps to bring results, up to & including getting on the evening news.

For the record, I did not use the term "vagrants", I simply pointed out that they were "illegal squatters in a city lot sleeping in tents."

Good luck, and I wish you well with all the "grass roots" assistance plans. I also encourage DetBill to raise a ruckus, get the media involved, and let the appropriate governmental agencies sort the mess out.

[sumas]

Sorry Vic, sorry Det Bill for my mix up. Actually I have contacted via email news, radio and TV but my goal is to heighten awareness/policing/fining of sleaze bag disgusting homeless shelters. Certainly I would hope to see balanced reporting. I also hope to see creative solutions/options to re integrate desparate displaced people into suitable housing and as applicable, employment.

Channel 7 has covered the plight. I had nothing to do with that but it is a start.

[SDCC]

I’ve walked by the tents several times; there appear to be around 7 or 8 of them. Walking back from downtown I walk along Larned until I get to the tents, then cross at the park next to them to get on Jefferson. I walked by several times and each time there seem to be people dropping off food and toiletries.

The shelters in Detroit are terrible, dirty, and bug infested. The NSO [[Tumaini Center - 3430 Third Avenue) is the worst. From their website “NSO is the only 24-hour/seven-days-a-week organization serving homeless people who have nowhere else to go due to behavioral difficulties, mental illness or physical challenges”. http://www.nso-mi.org/programs.php
The NSO has no bunks- the homeless sit in chairs all night – causing a majority of them to develop swelling in both legs. Some of the monitors [[most have sat in those very chairs) are impossible to get along with and they are constantly getting into it with the various “consumers” – as the clients are called – on a nightly basis. One shining light is that if a person can stick it out at NSO the facility has various programs to place individuals in apartments. Currently that process is taking 2 to 3 months for those that qualify.
With that said most [[about 75%) of the “consumers” are not interested in getting an apartment, and have been utilizing the NSO for years and years. It is a place to come to, in whatever condition they may happen to be in, sleep it off and get a sandwich. The NSO has no kitchen facilities; it relies on the generosity and kindness of the good people of the Detroit metropolitan area. People are constantly stopping by with food and toiletries, especially on Saturdays.

The Mission across the street from NSO has kitchen facilities and overnight.

Peter - Paul [[which is a clean facility) has food, showers, shaving, and laundry services – 7:00 to 11:00 am, m – f.

There are many more facilities in and around the downtown area.
I would say many of the permanently homeless visit all of these facilities.

[G-DDT]

Are the shelters run by the Catholic Church the same?

Catholic shelters [[that is, the few I experienced that haven't been shut-down-shelters do have a lot of enemies-folks forget even Margaret Sanger actively tried to shut down charity operations for the poor-read "War against the Weak" by Edwin Black) are better up there. The Catholics have a wonderful "open door" policy on a lot of things [[and the religious presences as far as their shelters go is almost absent, as dramatically compared to the fundaMental Intercity Gospel Missions out there). The drawback is that shelters like that in their short-handedness will hire just about anyone; this leaves room for bullies, exploiters, donation stealers, those with agendas, apathetic burn-outs, former homeless with a grudge [[happens), those running schemes in the background, the unqualified, and a whole bunch of others who should not be in that position.
I was bullied by a Coloniel Sanders type in Kentucky [[despite following the rules to the "T") once. Others backed him up. When I checked up years later, the same folks that defended him, said he was "rotten". Seems he showed preferential treatment to a Dale Gribble-style white supremacist who didn't follow-up on his required TB results. "Sanders" let "Gribble" slide. Dude had TB and gave it to three others. One of them sued successfully, and the "Coloniel" was ousted.

[G-DDT]

Yes, there is a vast difference between panhandlers, tent dwellers, buskers, etc. The vast majority of homeless are invisible to the public, they are too busy hustling from one side of town to another to eat, make appointments [[VA, legal, food pantries, social workers, benefits, medical, etc.), catch their breath at a day shelter [[or stay out of the harsh elements), etc. I'm not a big fan of "caste systeming" the poor, but it occurs often. That is why some shelter programs are designed for those making a [[sober and sane) effort to improve. Heck! although I never once panhandled, I noticed different panhandlers operate differently [[cup shakers, sign-flyers, "S'pange"-mutterers, vendors -used to be an awesome one that hung out in front of the Majestic-, task-inventors, and even those that operate through a facility that gets them a vendor's license to sell a homeless newsrag for a base price of $1.). However, many of the aggressive ones are not homeless at all, and you will never find them in community kitchens, shelters, social service offices, or other such locations commonly populated by the homeless.
One of my first bosses when I lived in Boston was a tent city dwellers and local Irish-genius eccentric who operated a bookstand right in Harvard Square. He had a system and he knew the loopholes that allowed him [[one of them being that some town charters will allow the sale of ice, cut flowers, and any printed material can be sold for no more than $2) to stay there in a public location with no license. He was a celebrity to many, perched in front of the tobacco shop, with his wife and "kids" [[dogs), playing Grateful Dead out of speakers attached to his bike-rig, accepting printed donations, had a storage space, and always full of a sharp-witted tongue.

[G-DDT]

Yes, it is common for many homeless to not want to be a burden to their families [[met a lot of dudes who had long-distance relations to their wife and kids, while they struggled with sobriety-issues and getting self-empowered). One of the best paraphrased quotes at the beginning of Spiegelman's Maus was by the concentration camp surviving father "Friends? Your friends? If you lock them together in a room with no food for a week, then you could see what it is, friends!" Not that I would encourage this tactic, but you will truly observe who a genuine friend is when the situation arises where you fall. We all fall. We are human and imperfect. Therefor, one wants a true friend who does not bail on you or crossover to the jeering masses ready to stab a back in you. Shame is: when such an event does occur, do not be so shattered to find out just how many friends will abandon you, because the ratio is high.
One of the best tactics I learned in earlier social circles was to act in a humble and base form [[not stupid or grotesque, mind you-just a display of you at your weakest). This goes contrary to all we've had instilled in us about affectation and first-impressions. Those looking to judge you or find something they can latch on to exploit will passover you like the angel of death. You don't want those kind for your friends.
I always felt sorry for those who did acquire the exploitative types. There was a supermodel at Zoot's who did just that: find who was upcoming and on the edge, while snubbing those she thought unworthy, but when one went downhill, I saw a number of times where she turned nasty and royally betrayed them and character-assasinated them for her own unnecessary self-edification. I'm glad I was deemed unworthy by her. Last I heard, she went off to Chicago to go ruin some other folk's lives in some edgey art and activism scenes there. Think I saw her in some snarky publication called Lumpen.

[Django]

G-DDT I like you.

Zoots, thats a blast from the past. My dog Django and Zoot were buddies back then. I may know of the model your speaking of and it wouldn't surprise of her actions.

I have more to say on this issue but I have to get back up on the 75 off ramp with my sign to get $$ for my fix, then back to the tent where I live in luxury. Gawd I love this life.

[Jimaz]

G-DDT I like you....

Me too. I suspect G-DDT has a lot to teach us all that we don't yet know. I am grateful for these insights.

I myself have been visiting a madhouse recently where it occurred to me that most "normal" folks would have no idea that such an environment even exists much less what goes on there!

Why in this society are so many "unpleasentries" kept secret from us ordinary citizens? What is to be feared from truth and why is truth hidden in the first place?

I love it when secrets are exposed even with all their warts.

Now I'm considering that even Edward Snowden is a patriot. What did he have to gain personally? Absolutely nothing. On the contrary, he had everything to lose! There's a hero right there.

[sumas]

I’ve walked by the tents several times; there appear to be around 7 or 8 of them. Walking back from downtown I walk along Larned until I get to the tents, then cross at the park next to them to get on Jefferson. I walked by several times and each time there seem to be people dropping off food and toiletries.

The shelters in Detroit are terrible, dirty, and bug infested. The NSO [[Tumaini Center - 3430 Third Avenue) is the worst. From their website “NSO is the only 24-hour/seven-days-a-week organization serving homeless people who have nowhere else to go due to behavioral difficulties, mental illness or physical challenges”. http://www.nso-mi.org/programs.php
The NSO has no bunks- the homeless sit in chairs all night – causing a majority of them to develop swelling in both legs. Some of the monitors [[most have sat in those very chairs) are impossible to get along with and they are constantly getting into it with the various “consumers” – as the clients are called – on a nightly basis. One shining light is that if a person can stick it out at NSO the facility has various programs to place individuals in apartments. Currently that process is taking 2 to 3 months for those that qualify.
With that said most [[about 75%) of the “consumers” are not interested in getting an apartment, and have been utilizing the NSO for years and years. It is a place to come to, in whatever condition they may happen to be in, sleep it off and get a sandwich. The NSO has no kitchen facilities; it relies on the generosity and kindness of the good people of the Detroit metropolitan area. People are constantly stopping by with food and toiletries, especially on Saturdays.

The Mission across the street from NSO has kitchen facilities and overnight.

Peter - Paul [[which is a clean facility) has food, showers, shaving, and laundry services – 7:00 to 11:00 am, m – f.

There are many more facilities in and around the downtown area.
I would say many of the permanently homeless visit all of these facilities.

I am pleased to see that some on the forum understand the complexities of homelessness. I read your post and thought OMG. I had a phone conversation just a while ago this evening with someone who briefly went to NSO for help. Honestly I thought I had seen and heard the down dirty on these shelters which is bad,really bad, the description of conditions given, made me gasp. I spare the weak of heart and choose to not feed trolls who think the homeless deserve contempt and take extreme glee in others adversities. Sigh

[Jerry Van]

Men With Broken Hearts
By Hank Williams

You will meet many just like me upon life's busy street
With shoulders stooped and heads bowed low
And eyes that stare in defeat
For souls that live within the past where sorrow plays all parts
For a living death is all that's left for men with broken hearts
You have no right to be the judge, to criticize and condemn
Just think but for the grace of God it would be you instead of him
One careless step or thoughtless deed and then the misery starts
And to those who weep death comes cheap
These men with broken hearts
Oh so humble you should be when they come passing by
For it's written that the greatest men never get too big to cry
Some lose faith in love and life when sorrow shoots her darts
And with hope all gone, they walk alone
These men with broken hearts
You've never walked in that man's shoes or saw things through his eyes
Or stood and watched with helpless hands while the heart inside you dies
Some were paupers, some were kings and some were masters of the arts
But in their shame they're all the same
These men with broken hearts
Life sometimes can be so cruel that a heart will pray for death
God, why must these living dead know pain with every breath?
So help your brother along the road, no matter where he starts!
FOR THE GOD THAT MADE YOU, MADE THEM TOO
These men with broken hearts

[Willi]

Maybe they need to plant a garden in the spring ...........

[sumas]

Thank you Jerry Van, I like country music but can't say as I knew that song.

When I first went it was five pup tents and 9 people. Its grown a bit but people would be surprised to know that additional tents are former homeless that join in the protest against disgusting conditions in most homeless shelters.

This is an unfunded real grass roots effort to protest demeaning of the poor but collecting money, good money to treat people like shit. I am proud of them.

Due to the blurb on channel 7, people have been showering them with donations and there is a community that exists among the homeless , Lots of cross over and trying to survive can become a full time job so they are trying to get clothes etc. to others in need. Heart warming really.

There is no garbage litter, just a a huge mound of bagged donations,mostly clothes and blankets kind thoughts but practical stuff is what they need They aren't shitting in the copse of trees. They aren't littering. They have been getting non parishiable food donations also that they are sharing with others in need. I find them sharing,caring and giving unlike some on this board. The haves mostly hoard, the have nots share with understanding and kindness.

This is no diatribe against suburbs, the amount of community service, work. involvement is outstanding and then of course there are trolls. So many on this forum have done so much for Detroit. Each of us, with heart, find projects and programs that suit our skills and touch our hearts.

You on the forum, Detroit and Suburban alike, know who you are and such great gratitude and good wishes pour out from Detroiters in need and to good people who have faith in the inate value of people

[sumas]

Sorry Lowell but I and others do like to bait trolls from time to time. They like to post negativity and sadly those are the threads that garner the most attention.

Being a braggart and a me me person according to the not so charming forumers. Our big contribution today was to take boxes of wood matches. for their grill. I think it cost me one dollar maybe. Got lots of hugs for such a simple necessity.

A photographer from the forum joined us and they were as charmed as us at the commitment to freeze their butts to make an unfunded statement on how society treats the needy.

[Django]

A few pics I took with Sumas yesterday at the tent city. The folks there were wonderful. I got a small tour and absolutely everyone was friendly. Stacks of food that were given out to anyone who needed it. Some had places to live but came here to look over things and distribute the donations. I really liked what Sumas said about the haves hoarding and the have nots sharing. I would like to think the haves will someday know the joy of being in a community that a green front yard, a new car, and a regular dinner out is not the line between a world community. Seems we are very well on our way to a caste system. I know and you know that not every loaf of bread bakes perfect like the haves think they do, the have nots know that if your not baked perfectly you generally get tossed to the trash. I understand the whole idea that if you start giving, people will just expect it and rely on it but with all the wealth in this country that is hoarded our school system is in the shitter compared to other countries, we have more incarcerated than any other country.....Jeff Danials explains it better, I know this is just tv show but the stats are accurate. I DARE you haters to watch and respond to this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4r7hIWln7Q Its fairly short. Hope you like the pics.

[Django]

Thank you Sumas and Ronaldj for bringing me over to tent city and introducing me to everyone. It would have been a lot more difficult photographing without your knowing everyone there. They certainly love you. LOVE, what an amazing thing. Money and a condo, meh.