Fortune 500 company to move regional HQ to One Woodward building

[bailey]

Fifth Third likes big signs. They are going to ruin the lines of the building.

Zero sum gain. It is simply a matter of musical buildings. No added jobs to the region that I know of, yes there will be some additional spending downtown, but it will come at the expense of Southfield. Would rather see us concentrate on growing new industries instead.

I think calling this move "zero sum" is incorrect. This move is getting another couple of hundred professional workers downtown. They need to eat lunch, grab coffee, hit a happy hour after work, heaven forbid they might even get a haircut or support some retail... etc. "Zero sum" would be moving from one suburban office tower in Southfield to one in Troy.

[DetroitPlanner]

I think calling this move "zero sum" is incorrect. This move is getting another couple of hundred professional workers downtown. They need to eat lunch, grab coffee, hit a happy hour after work, heaven forbid they might even get a haircut or support some retail... etc. "Zero sum" would be moving from one suburban office tower in Southfield to one in Troy.

I mentioned the additional spending downtown, but there will be less spending in Southfield. Regionally it is a zero increase. Can't get too excited about that. When we add jobs to downtown from outside the Detroit region that means we all do better.

What is the difference between it moving from Southfield to Troy as opposed to from Southfield to Detroit? It is all in the same region/market/ecology.

[iheartthed]

I mentioned the additional spending downtown, but there will be less spending in Southfield. Regionally it is a zero increase. Can't get too excited about that. When we add jobs to downtown from outside the Detroit region that means we all do better.

What is the difference between it moving from Southfield to Troy as opposed to from Southfield to Detroit? It is all in the same region/market/ecology.

My hunch is that people who work in dense business districts support more ancillary businesses than those who work in suburban office parks. If that is true then that means this is not zero sum.

[313WX]

I mentioned the additional spending downtown, but there will be less spending in Southfield. Regionally it is a zero increase. Can't get too excited about that. When we add jobs to downtown from outside the Detroit region that means we all do better.

What is the difference between it moving from Southfield to Troy as opposed to from Southfield to Detroit? It is all in the same region/market/ecology.

Having a stronger urban core benefits the entire region.

Before we can attract outside investment, they must first see that we [[as in the major economic players) have some faith in the region's urban core ourselves.

[motz]

I think calling this move "zero sum" is incorrect. This move is getting another couple of hundred professional workers downtown. They need to eat lunch, grab coffee, hit a happy hour after work, heaven forbid they might even get a haircut or support some retail... etc. "Zero sum" would be moving from one suburban office tower in Southfield to one in Troy.

Bingo, bailey aced it right there.

[SpartanDawg]

Bingo, bailey aced it right there.

on top of that here's what more jobs downtown does. Stops the unnecessary suburban sprawl that well all love to hate so much.

All of a sudden maybe a couple dozen of these employees maybe hate commuting with traffic everyday to downtown. They start to see the energy down here, they think "hey why not just move downtown"... this adds to the housing demand... more apartments/ condos get filled up and built... and before you know it we see all these vacant parcels downtown start to fill up.

Would you rather be out in the fringe suburbs driving on endless freeways to southfield? or living and working within a 5/10 minute walk/ commute, and having all the retail/entertainment you need within 5 square miles

[Eber Brock Ward]

on top of that here's what more jobs downtown does. Stops the unnecessary suburban sprawl that well all love to hate so much.

All of a sudden maybe a couple dozen of these employees maybe hate commuting with traffic everyday to downtown. They start to see the energy down here, they think "hey why not just move downtown"... this adds to the housing demand... more apartments/ condos get filled up and built... and before you know it we see all these vacant parcels downtown start to fill up.

Would you rather be out in the fringe suburbs driving on endless freeways to southfield? or living and working within a 5/10 minute walk/ commute, and having all the retail/entertainment you need within 5 square miles

Exactly this. Right now, we waste untold amounts of money as a region with people traveling all across the metro for their commutes and for business meetings and things like that.

Simply put, that's waste. That's more time that people can spend on the job or recreating, but it's just "poof!" and gone.

The more we consolidate and stop [[and, perhaps someday, reverse) the sprawl, the better able to compete we are as a region. It's just one less inefficiency.

[Bham1982]

I think calling this move "zero sum" is incorrect. This move is getting another couple of hundred professional workers downtown. They need to eat lunch, grab coffee, hit a happy hour after work, heaven forbid they might even get a haircut or support some retail... etc. "Zero sum" would be moving from one suburban office tower in Southfield to one in Troy.

Regionally, it's zero sum. There's no net economic difference for the region between moving from Southfield to Troy or moving from Southfield to Detroit.

[Scottathew]

Regionally, it's zero sum. There's no net economic difference for the region between moving from Southfield to Troy or moving from Southfield to Detroit.

Although if being downtown allows for more opportunities to spend money, more opportunities to go to lunch, then it's not zero sum.

If moving people to a bustling downtown where things to buy are just a walk away, then it will generate more economic activity.

[DetroitPlanner]

Although if being downtown allows for more opportunities to spend money, more opportunities to go to lunch, then it's not zero sum.

If moving people to a bustling downtown where things to buy are just a walk away, then it will generate more economic activity.

Regionally the same dollar is spent be it in Detroit or Southfield. It is not any different. People from Detroit work in Southfield and spend money there. It still supports the local economy and provides additional jobs to local people. The only place I see a line drawn separating Detroit from the suburbs is on a map. Economically it is one system.

What we want to do is concentrate on additional jobs and making our economy more diverse as a region. We all are in the same pool be it the shallow end or the deep end. When someone $h!ts it we are all impacted.

[DetroiterOnTheWestCoast]

Regionally the same dollar is spent be it in Detroit or Southfield. It is not any different. People from Detroit work in Southfield and spend money there. It still supports the local economy and provides additional jobs to local people. The only place I see a line drawn separating Detroit from the suburbs is on a map. Economically it is one system.

What we want to do is concentrate on additional jobs and making our economy more diverse as a region. We all are in the same pool be it the shallow end or the deep end. When someone $h!ts it we are all impacted.

While I agree that adding new jobs and expanding is better, the relocation itself results in the spending of additional dollars and a boost to the economy. Movers are hired; build-outs take place; equipment and furnishings are changed. Same thing happens if I buy your house and you buy mine; we'd both end up spending and buying to get into and adjust the new space.

And I agree with the other posters that strengthening the urban core and putting a damper on sprawl are in and of themselves beneficial to the entire metropolitan region. Ultimately, a stronger core will result in additional "new" jobs being attracted to the area.

[bailey]

Regionally, it's zero sum. There's no net economic difference for the region between moving from Southfield to Troy or moving from Southfield to Detroit.

It's only zero sum regionally if you believe having a thriving downtown/center city anchoring the metro area is not going to result in economic benefit regionally. Moving from Southfield to Troy doesn't move that needle... moving downtown does.

[jt1]

Regionally, it's zero sum. There's no net economic difference for the region between moving from Southfield to Troy or moving from Southfield to Detroit.

So you are saying that an average worker at the Tech Center spends the same as an average worker downtown and one employee's economic activity in one location is the same across the entire region. That would explain why there are so many in the 12 and Van Dyke corridor that have such a busy lunch rush.

[erikd]

Regionally, it's zero sum. There's no net economic difference for the region between moving from Southfield to Troy or moving from Southfield to Detroit.

I would tend to agree that a single example of a company moving from Southfield to Detroit, or moving from Southfield to Troy, is essentially a zero-sum situation. However, a mass movement of businesses into the city from the suburbs is not a zero-sum situation if it results in decreased regional sprawl.

For the last 60 years, the pattern of business movement in metro Detroit has been relentless outward migration. Detroit to Southfield, Southfield to Troy, Troy to Auburn Hills, etc. However, this regional movement has not been a zero-sum game. This incessant sprawl has created a situation where we have dramatically increased the amount of infrastructure, without a corresponding increase in jobs, tax base, and economic activity to support all of the outward expansion.

If the movement of businesses back into Detroit becomes big enough to slow down or stop this outward migration it will be a huge benefit to the region.