Ilitch announces Huge plans for Red Wings Arena Project - Renderings Released

**emu steve** · July-20-14, 05:04 AM

As of TODAY, July 20, 2014 everything we thought or posted in the past isn't very relevant and today a completely different vision, dream for downtown and Midtown and much of it is to be built concurrently by 2017.

Light clearing of the site in fall 2014; heavy duty work begins in spring 2015.

[[We have a thread with almost 500 posts but are they still relevant? I'd say not. This vision seems to have exceed my wishes by many fold).

http://www.freep.com/article/2014072...SS06/307200110

EDIT: Just read Bill's article in Crains. The articles are complimentary, each has unique information.

http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article...WS03/140719845

I'm starting a new thread, if folks want to utilize it.
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Moderator Note: As this represents a milestone in this project, continued discussion will proceed in this new thread. Previous discussion begun in June 2013 may be read the now closed-to-posting thread:
Plans Unveiled For $650M Red Wings Arena, Entertainment District In Detroit

Images above and below from Olympia Development Press Release:

**emu steve** · July-20-14, 05:17 AM

I'm completely stunned by what I'm reading.

Instead of cobbling together an arena, a couple parking garages, an office building or two, etc., the Ilitches are trying to design a new city within a not-new, some said 'dead', city.

I'm absolutely stunned. I thought for sure they would say put an 'attractive' parking garage along Henry/Fisher, etc. emphasizing parking convenience over a bold vision of housing and shops. Attractive = a brick façade instead of a cement façade...

The concept of the arena is completely state of the art, not some boring replica of something built 10 - 15 years ago.

As I read the articles, I'm trying to determine what Ilitch can do HIMSELF and not require other investors to invest hundreds of millions of dollars.

The most obvious is the arena, which of course, is his baby. Yet, so much of what he plans is on his land adjacent, connected to, the arena.

Christopher or Mike [[Ilitch) just needs to say the word "go" and it can happen. They build the arena, the walkways, the housing adjacent to the arena, etc.

What I find amazing is that instead of 'concatenating' the arena to Fox Town and Comerica Park, they want to truly integrate Comerica Park, Fox Town, Hockey Town, the arena, etc. instead build an sports and entertaining district which goes 365 days a year, even if there is a 'dark day' for sports or entertainment.

And the grand design is that people should live very close and they will spend time and money in that neighborhood.

**emu steve** · July-20-14, 05:48 AM

P.S. this has to be bad news for that building out in Auburn Hills.

Folks want to be at the newest, state of the art, glitziest, etc. facility.

The Pistons may stay out there but in the next 5 years a lot of the other stuff will move to the new arena.

TennisAndMath · July-21-14, 06:24 PM

Originally Posted by emu steve

P.S. this has to be bad news for that building out in Auburn Hills.

Folks want to be at the newest, state of the art, glitziest, etc. facility.

The Pistons may stay out there but in the next 5 years a lot of the other stuff will move to the new arena.

Why are you so negative? You do realize people in Lansing, Grand Blanc, Birmingham, Rochester Hills, Lapeer and Troy ENJOY getting in and out of the Palace, right? You realize most suburban professionals PREFER just going to a game on a Tuesday, and don't want to deal with heading into Detroit [[for a variety of reasons), or going out to eat or drink before or after? You do realize some people worry about getting their car window smashed or being the victim of a crime, right? This whole us versus them narrative is so off-putting. Everyone in the region hopes this arena project is a success. Unfortunately people like you pray it destroys the burbs or something? It's a very unhealthy and obnoxious pursuit.

**rb336** · July-21-14, 06:37 PM

Originally Posted by TennisAndMath

Why are you so negative? You do realize people in Lansing, Grand Blanc, Birmingham, Rochester Hills, Lapeer and Troy ENJOY getting in and out of the Palace, right? You realize most suburban professionals PREFER just going to a game on a Tuesday, and don't want to deal with heading into Detroit [[for a variety of reasons), or going out to eat or drink before or after? You do realize some people worry about getting their car window smashed or being the victim of a crime, right? This whole us versus them narrative is so off-putting. Everyone in the region hopes this arena project is a success. Unfortunately people like you pray it destroys the burbs or something? It's a very unhealthy and obnoxious pursuit.

yeah, that's why the Pistons games are all sold out, even when they are not having a great year. Wait - that's the Wings.

The only reason bands choose the Palace is that it is newer. Heck, I bet there are acts out there who will pick the new arena just to see their name/logo on the roof

**Mackinaw** · July-21-14, 08:21 PM

Originally Posted by TennisAndMath

Why are you so negative? You do realize people in Lansing, Grand Blanc, Birmingham, Rochester Hills, Lapeer and Troy ENJOY getting in and out of the Palace, right? You realize most suburban professionals PREFER just going to a game on a Tuesday, and don't want to deal with heading into Detroit [[for a variety of reasons), or going out to eat or drink before or after? You do realize some people worry about getting their car window smashed or being the victim of a crime, right? This whole us versus them narrative is so off-putting. Everyone in the region hopes this arena project is a success. Unfortunately people like you pray it destroys the burbs or something? It's a very unhealthy and obnoxious pursuit.

LBPatterson, is that you???? Defensive no? EMU Steve ain't negative, and here he's just raising conversation topics [[like 800 per minute, but that's why we love 'em). It will be objective reality come 2017 that the better arena and the better location to watch any major arena event will be at the corner of Woodward and Henry. Hell, I even prefer JLA to Palace. I avoid the Palace because it's just such a schlep for us 6 and Mack Ave. professionals. Cmon man don't you knowwwww, there are people south of 696 [[try: majority of the region) that don't wanna go all the way up there on a Tuesday night, where they will literally have nothing to do beforehand [[outlet shopping, anyone?) except fight with traffic, and can't have more than a drink at the event because they gotta long distance home? [[P.s. nobody is forcing these clean liven' professionals you speak of to go out crunkin' before and after a Tigers game…that's optional…you're more than free to grab a white castle on the way down, park the car, attend, and leave, but at least you have the option).

I mean, I guess it comes down to whose complaints are more valid, and whose convenience more valuable, under your line of thinking. But if we're gonna go down that road, then that niche crowd of "professional people" in Lapeer can f'ing deal with their f'ing remote ass location [[honestly, where is Lapeer?) when the 'Stons and even fricken Disney on Ice move their asses downtown to a better venue in the center of the region. My sadness about their plight will be offset by my happiness for the fact that people on the southern and western edges of the metro can access NBA games more easily on a Tuesday night. Fair and square for all exurbanites! And Ann Arborites too!

Smashed windows eh? Maybe your friends are the people I see parking on abandoned lots in Brush Park, thinking that the con man waiving them in actually owns the place? I've actually never even seen smashed windows in the downtown area after an event, and I always park on the street, too.

**emu steve** · July-22-14, 12:21 AM

Originally Posted by Mackinaw

LBPatterson, is that you???? Defensive no? EMU Steve ain't negative, and here he's just raising conversation topics [[like 800 per minute, but that's why we love 'em).

I got optimism on steroids but I have company.

Here is the Detnews. They caught it too!! The emphasis is mine but the words belong to the News...

"With the M1 rail line coming, the rehab of a score of office buildings by Quicken Loans’ Dan Gilbert, the discovery by an enthusiastic young creative class of downtown, Midtown and Corktown, and the steady progress in resolving the bankruptcy, this is already an exciting time in Detroit.

That excitement level just increased tenfold with the first good look at the Ilitch plan."

From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2...#ixzz38Ahu2dUm

EDIT: [[from the Freep)...

And Daniel Loepp, president and CEO of Blue Cross Blue Shield of Michigan, echoed that.
“When people in the future tell the story of Detroit’s comeback, they will begin with a pioneer and visionary named Mike Ilitch. This is yet another game-changing investment in Detroit made by the Ilitch family,” Loepp said.

**ghettopalmetto** · July-22-14, 06:50 AM

Originally Posted by emu steve

I got optimism on steroids but I have company.

Here is the Detnews. They caught it too!! The emphasis is mine but the words belong to the News...

"With the M1 rail line coming, the rehab of a score of office buildings by Quicken Loans’ Dan Gilbert, the discovery by an enthusiastic young creative class of downtown, Midtown and Corktown, and the steady progress in resolving the bankruptcy, this is already an exciting time in Detroit.

That excitement level just increased tenfold with the first good look at the Ilitch plan."

From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2...#ixzz38Ahu2dUm

EDIT: [[from the Freep)...

And Daniel Loepp, president and CEO of Blue Cross Blue Shield of Michigan, echoed that.
“When people in the future tell the story of Detroit’s comeback, they will begin with a pioneer and visionary named Mike Ilitch. This is yet another game-changing investment in Detroit made by the Ilitch family,” Loepp said.

And all Ilitch had to do was destroy half of downtown Detroit over a period of 25 years, and collect government handouts to do so. Developing a handful of the 40-some blocks of Ilitch-made moonscape is hardly cause for celebration. That guy has been the biggest welfare queen in the City of Detroit, and we applaud him for it?

There sure is nothing like manufactured excitement, is there?

**Honky Tonk** · July-22-14, 07:41 AM

Originally Posted by emu steve

And Daniel Loepp, president and CEO of Blue Cross Blue Shield of Michigan, echoed that.
“When people in the future tell the story of Detroit’s comeback, they will begin with a pioneer and visionary named Mike Ilitch. This is yet another game-changing investment in Detroit made by the Ilitch family,” Loepp said.

There goes my breakfast.

**EL Jimbo** · July-22-14, 08:12 AM

Originally Posted by TennisAndMath

Why are you so negative? You do realize people in Lansing, Grand Blanc, Birmingham, Rochester Hills, Lapeer and Troy ENJOY getting in and out of the Palace, right? You realize most suburban professionals PREFER just going to a game on a Tuesday, and don't want to deal with heading into Detroit [[for a variety of reasons), or going out to eat or drink before or after? You do realize some people worry about getting their car window smashed or being the victim of a crime, right? This whole us versus them narrative is so off-putting. Everyone in the region hopes this arena project is a success. Unfortunately people like you pray it destroys the burbs or something? It's a very unhealthy and obnoxious pursuit.

Um...NOBODY enjoys getting in and out of the Palace unless they are masochists. I live in the Lansing area and I think the Palace sucks. The arena in and of itself is great. However, when you start and end the experience sitting in traffic because the area was never designed to handle it and there is NOTHING to do around it.

Also, let's face it. The people who are scared of Detroit are literally a dieing breed. The 30 something and younger crowd has no fear of heading downtown for an event. Those are the people who are driving the investment in downtown entertainment. Not the scarred old-timers whose numbers dwindle daily.

TennisAndMath · July-22-14, 08:48 AM

Originally Posted by EL Jimbo

Um...NOBODY enjoys getting in and out of the Palace unless they are masochists. I live in the Lansing area and I think the Palace sucks. The arena in and of itself is great. However, when you start and end the experience sitting in traffic because the area was never designed to handle it and there is NOTHING to do around it.

Also, let's face it. The people who are scared of Detroit are literally a dying breed. The 30 something and younger crowd has no fear of heading downtown for an event. Those are the people who are driving the investment in downtown entertainment. Not the scarred old-timers whose numbers dwindle daily.

The Palace is an incredibly convenient venue for us. We gave up my Pistons season tickets [[we had since it opened) because they're terrible, the crowd became annoying and it was a waste of time. We still attend all of the major concerts.

Your "nobody is scared" is more of the same BS coded language, which suggests anyone "afraid" of Detroit is an old racist. [[And in 2003, anyone against the war in Iraq was anti-American, right?) People should always be on high alert in Detroit. If they're not, it just highlights the suburban arrogance that everything is always OK because they're wealthy, savvy and super-smart. Nobody would dare touch them! I saw this arrogance both summers I spent abroad in college and on various trips oversees. Affluent and naive young Americans think some sort of bubble or shield protects them wherever they go. Sketchy district in Paris, ghettos of Thailand... most violent major US city? No problem, we're likable Americans!

If you don't think anyone is scared of Detroit, I'm wondering why no Detroit gas stations report an uptick in revenue when games are going on. Wonder why those brave "30-somethings and younger" aren't stopping for snacks or fuel.

**mwilbert** · July-22-14, 09:12 AM

Originally Posted by TennisAndMath

Your "nobody is scared" is more of the same BS coded language, which suggests anyone "afraid" of Detroit is an old racist. [[And in 2003, anyone against the war in Iraq was anti-American, right?) People should always be on high alert in Detroit. If they're not, it just highlights the suburban arrogance that everything is always OK because they're wealthy, savvy and super-smart. Nobody would dare touch them! I saw this arrogance both summers I spent abroad in college and on various trips oversees. Affluent and naive young Americans think some sort of bubble or shield protects them wherever they go. Sketchy district in Paris, ghettos of Thailand... most violent major US city? No problem, we're likable Americans!

If you don't think anyone is scared of Detroit, I'm wondering why no Detroit gas stations report an uptick in revenue when games are going on. Wonder why those brave "30-somethings and younger" aren't stopping for snacks or fuel.

I don't think you are entirely wrong, but I think you are wrong for the purposes of this discussion. It isn't that some younger people aren't apprehensive about Detroit, or that some younger people avoid Detroit gas stations, or whatever. It is that it mostly doesn't stop them from coming downtown and doing things in Detroit. I don't know whether that is because they think they are protected by a magic bubble, or if they are realistic about what the odds are of anything happening to them, but regardless that seems to be the case.

And do you ever hear reports of upticks in revenue at gas stations anywhere for any event? I don't. I don't think most people would consider it to be newsworthy. I would also say that there aren't exactly a lot of gas stations downtown, and if you were downtown, why would you stop at a gas station for a snack? Wouldn't you get one before you got in your car? Maybe you have to go to a gas station to get a snack after you leave the Palace, but that is because it is in the middle of nowhere.

**EL Jimbo** · July-22-14, 09:25 AM

Originally Posted by TennisAndMath

The Palace is an incredibly convenient venue for us. We gave up my Pistons season tickets [[we had since it opened) because they're terrible, the crowd became annoying and it was a waste of time. We still attend all of the major concerts.

Your "nobody is scared" is more of the same BS coded language, which suggests anyone "afraid" of Detroit is an old racist. [[And in 2003, anyone against the war in Iraq was anti-American, right?) People should always be on high alert in Detroit. If they're not, it just highlights the suburban arrogance that everything is always OK because they're wealthy, savvy and super-smart. Nobody would dare touch them! I saw this arrogance both summers I spent abroad in college and on various trips oversees. Affluent and naive young Americans think some sort of bubble or shield protects them wherever they go. Sketchy district in Paris, ghettos of Thailand... most violent major US city? No problem, we're likable Americans!

If you don't think anyone is scared of Detroit, I'm wondering why no Detroit gas stations report an uptick in revenue when games are going on. Wonder why those brave "30-somethings and younger" aren't stopping for snacks or fuel.

BS coded language? You are the one putting words into my mouth. I wasn't claiming anyone was a racist at all. All I was saying is that for years there was NOTHING to do downtown, it was dangerous, and most people had no business being there after 5 PM mon-fri. Downtown spent years like that that and to many older folks, that is how it still is down there in their mind.

Gen Y folks such as myself, were only kids when downtown was like that. For example, I was only 11 years old in 1992 when my dad said we were no longer going to Tiger Stadium for the night game because they happened to announce the verdicts for Budzyn and Nevers in the Malice Green case. By the time we became adults, downtown was slowly starting to turn itself around and we never had that fear of downtown like the previous generations did.

Also, I think you are trying to shift the bar here because your argument got blown up. Comparing downtown to sketchy neighborhoods in Paris and ghettos in Thailand is simply grasping at straws. Sure, it is very important to be mindful of your surroundings and to exercise caution in terms of where you go, but that is a LOT different than some of the suburban folks of a certain age who like to brag about having never set foot within the city limits of Detroit in the past 30 years.

Lastly, the only people the Palace is convenient for live in Oakland County...and it isn't even all of Oakland County. I tried to go to a midweek playoff game at the Palace in 2002 or 2003. We left from South Lyon for an 8 PM tip off at 5:30. Due to the traffic, we didn't get to our seats until halfway through the first quarter.

The Palace blows and the only way it remains successful as a concert venue is because it's facilities are vastly superior to that of the Joe or Cobo [[when it was still an arena). When this new arena opens up in 2017, the Palace is really going to be hurting.

**emu steve** · July-22-14, 08:43 AM

Originally Posted by TennisAndMath

Why are you so negative? You do realize people in Lansing, Grand Blanc, Birmingham, Rochester Hills, Lapeer and Troy ENJOY getting in and out of the Palace, right? You realize most suburban professionals PREFER just going to a game on a Tuesday, and don't want to deal with heading into Detroit [[for a variety of reasons), or going out to eat or drink before or after? You do realize some people worry about getting their car window smashed or being the victim of a crime, right? This whole us versus them narrative is so off-putting. Everyone in the region hopes this arena project is a success. Unfortunately people like you pray it destroys the burbs or something? It's a very unhealthy and obnoxious pursuit.

I'm about to bow out of this thread. Most anything I can offer has been said by others or myself.

Sorry for being so negative on the Palace. I just got caught up in the mini-civil war going on between OC and Detroit. There is some Detroit h8ting going on in this forum.

One of the problems in a slow-growth area, like Southeast Michigan, is that much gain is at a zero-sum game.

For decades [[!) OC's gain came at the expense of Detroit. Now a lot of Detroit's gain will come at the expense of OC. [[e.g., businesses which moved into downtown Detroit and, of course, the Lions with their Detroit-OC-Detroit moves, and maybe the Pistons, in time).

As other have mentioned, it would be nice if Southeast Michigan would grow faster in terms of population and commercial activity so that Detroit can grow, OC can grow, etc. and everyone can taste the fruits of growth.

**emu steve** · July-20-14, 06:06 AM

In case anyone missed this:

"Included in plans for the $200-million entertainment district are hundreds of market-rate rental units in at least four new mid-rise buildings that are set to go up around the arena as well as near Comerica Park. The apartments are expected to be ready for tenants by summer 2017.
The precise number of units is still being determined and is anticipated to exceed 500..."

According to the concept drawings, it appears that maybe two residential building will be built on the now surface parking lots along Woodward adjacent to Comerica Park. [[confirmed in Freep and Crains articles. 2017 is the expected completion date for those buildings as well).

[[I've read dozens of posts here complaining about those surface lots).

**Scottathew** · July-20-14, 07:46 AM

This is McLargeHuge.

Finally, Illitch doing something more than arenas and parking lots. He's even got plans to develop the lot between Comerica and Woodward, something I've been whining about for years.

He's got the money to make this happen. This combined with the revitalization already happening in CBD and midtown and M1 Rail, it would be just amazing to think what this area will be like in 5-10 years.

2,000 new residential units smack-dab between downtown and midtown. This could be a catalyst for development in the surrounding areas.

I'm hopeful and optimistic after seeing this.

**emu steve** · July-20-14, 08:19 AM

Originally Posted by 48307

This is McLargeHuge.

Finally, Illitch doing something more than arenas and parking lots. He's even got plans to develop the lot between Comerica and Woodward, something I've been whining about for years.

He's got the money to make this happen. This combined with the revitalization already happening in CBD and midtown and M1 Rail, it would be just amazing to think what this area will be like in 5-10 years.

2,000 new residential units smack-dab between downtown and midtown. This could be a catalyst for development in the surrounding areas.

I'm hopeful and optimistic after seeing this.

I don't see how ANYONE can be unhappy.

It seems, like dreaming, that every complaint folks had are being answered by these plans.

The Ilitches seemed to check every box I could come up [[with).

Even more important the Ilitches seem perfectly willing to spend more than they originally promised and there are venture capital monies lining up just wanting a piece of the action [[that is cited in the articles by Freep and Crains).

Instead of dreaming big and failing to deliver, this appears to be the opposite.

I remember when the original plans were put out, thinking the plans were a 'drop in the bucket' and a good 'first step' [[e.g., an arena, an office building, maybe two parking garages, a couple rehabs many blocks from the arena, maybe an apartment building or hotel, etc.).

Instead, it seems they took the 45 blocks and came up plans to improve each of them.

**rb336** · July-20-14, 08:09 AM

direct link

http://districtdetroit.com/

note that the arena renderings are "concept only" - but I kinda like the concept

**stinkytofu** · July-20-14, 08:18 AM

Whoa - if I'm reading this right they are even planning on putting two buildings on the lots in front of Comerica on Woodward? God I hope that's true.

http://1.cdn.nhle.com/redwings/v2/ex...t-Concepts.jpg

**Mackinaw** · July-20-14, 09:33 AM

Originally Posted by stinkytofu

Whoa - if I'm reading this right they are even planning on putting two buildings on the lots in front of Comerica on Woodward? God I hope that's true.

http://1.cdn.nhle.com/redwings/v2/ex...t-Concepts.jpg

They say that's a '2014' rendering yet the fricken STATLER is still there. LOL. I think this is from the archives. Are they just dredging up old plans on us and renewing former promises???? I mean, they promised us Wrigleyville in Detroit pre-2000. Now of course, today's market can support that and they'd be STUPID not to develop tall things along Woodward and Adams St. literally TODAY…but we're talking about the Illitches here, and I am looking at what appears to be an old rendering. What's up with this?

**Danny** · July-20-14, 09:37 AM

It won't be called Joe Louis Arena. But Little Caesar's Palace instead.

**drpoundsign** · July-20-14, 05:04 PM

There is some historic apartments, and Victorian homes on Charlotte Street. This is part of the character of the City.

**nain rouge** · July-21-14, 08:43 AM

Looks pretty good, though I'd like to see old renderings of the Comerica Park project to get a feel for how likely this is to get pulled off.

**buckster1986** · September-05-14, 03:06 PM

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20140905/BIZ/309050103/1361/Launch-of-$650M-Detroit-development-plan-expected-to-begin-Thursday

**stinkytofu** · July-20-14, 08:17 AM

Dig the concept, but as has been proven many times renderings often don't turn to reality.

I don't see any official word about Eddystone/Park Avenue [[though they are in rendering). Anybody read differently?