Canadians Planning to deliver water to Detroiters whose water is shut off

[Wesley Mouch]

Without getting into the who's right/who's wrong of this issue I applaud the Canadian effort.

TW, what about this effort is laudable? They've done nothing. Bringing water jugs is nothing but symbolism. The same water is available at their local church.

I see this issue as a non-issue. It is simply a talking point -- and I don't agree with applauding talking points.

If you believe water should be free to everyone, that's a reasonable opinion. I don't agree. But in Detroit, we are indeed awash in good, cheap water. It would be a more difficult argument in, say, LA, Sacremento, or Phoenix. Giving away water there would be an environmental resource waste.

[Jimaz]

... I think this was brought up made up on the fireworks thread, it is amazing people can find money to buy all sorts of useless crap, but can't pay for a basic utility they need to live....

There. Fixed that for ya.

[trotwood]

WM with due respect I believe my post was rather clear. I don't believe it requires me to explain what I find "laudable" about the effort.
P.S. There's no need for you to give accolades to this or any other gesture you don't agree with. I wasn't speaking for you nor attempting to change your view. This is my opinion.

TW, what about this effort is laudable? They've done nothing. Bringing water jugs is nothing but symbolism. The same water is available at their local church.

I see this issue as a non-issue. It is simply a talking point -- and I don't agree with applauding talking points.

If you believe water should be free to everyone, that's a reasonable opinion. I don't agree. But in Detroit, we are indeed awash in good, cheap water. It would be a more difficult argument in, say, LA, Sacremento, or Phoenix. Giving away water there would be an environmental resource waste.

[Zacha341]

Many variables, no doubt. Most rental duplex, quad and apartment dwellings do not receive separate water bill accounts for water bill, so customarily the landlord pays the bill adding the cost to the rent. Some of these dead-beats with multiple units must be hiding from their tenants and DWSD. Again more dissipation of Detroit housing as tenants move, leaving dwellings to be stripped and rot. At least the basements will not fill up with water.

[Jimaz]

This issue reminds me of the scene in DetroitYES Home » Detroit Connections » Fun Videos » Frank Herbert's Dune where Lady Jessica declares that House Atreides will no longer practice the demeaning custom of selling "squeezings" [[waste water) to Fremen at the door of the royal palace.

She says, "Give them back their money. Go on. This 'custom' stops now. Do as I said. Do as I said. Water will never again be sold at the Atreides door. At the end of every meal, any person who calls at this door may receive a full cup — free."

The scene is set up at 20:20 and culminates at 25:33 in Part 1 of 2.

[rex]

For those residents getting their water shut off that live in a rental home. That water should remain on and the suburban slumlord who owns the property should instead have their water shut off until they pay that shit.

[Wesley Mouch]

WM with due respect I believe my post was rather clear. I don't believe it requires me to explain what I find "laudable" about the effort.
P.S. There's no need for you to give accolades to this or any other gesture you don't agree with. I wasn't speaking for you nor attempting to change your view. This is my opinion.

Not to worry. Only a discussion. I like to learn how others think. It helps me form reasonable opinions.

You do not need to explain yourself, of course. Might help others share and understand -- or maybe help you enrich your opinion.

[Scottathew]

For those residents getting their water shut off that live in a rental home. That water should remain on and the suburban slumlord who owns the property should instead have their water shut off until they pay that shit.

Many landlords have it setup in the contract that the tenant is responsible for utilities including water, gas, and electricity.

In those cases, it's not suburban slumlords, but rather tenants not prioritizing spending correctly.

[trotwood]

Not to worry. Only a discussion. I like to learn how others think. It helps me form reasonable opinions.

You do not need to explain yourself, of course. Might help others share and understand -- or maybe help you enrich your opinion.

Understood&agreed but as I said in the beginning I'm not willing to get into the 'who's right/who's wrong' in this situation.
My original statement/post was as involved as I care to get in this discussion on this topic.

[Zacha341]

It could be 'Detroit' slumlord or family member renting to their family member with their own water shut off! From what I am hearing some folks got a surprise of surprises! It had been going on for years [[the non or partial paying that is).

For those residents getting their water shut off that live in a rental home. That water should remain on and the suburban slumlord who owns the property should instead have their water shut off until they pay that shit.

[softailrider]

Many landlords have it setup in the contract that the tenant is responsible for utilities including water, gas, and electricity.

In those cases, it's not suburban slumlords, but rather tenants not prioritizing spending correctly.

Of course it depends what's in your lease or rental agreement. However, DTE has gone after some landlords for unpaid accounts on their properties, going so far as to shutting off service to their private residences. I personally know someone who got this treatment from DTE.

[douglasm]

Lowell makes a good point about water being tied to sewer. It is the only leverage the city has to get the sewer bill paid.

As to who pays in a rental, some cities have allowed the utility bill to go in the tenant's name WITH A LARGE SECURITY DEPOSIT. If the back utility bill reaches the amount of the deposit, the utility is shut off, no questions asked. This may be in violation of state law, though. In many states[[Washington for example) the utility bill is tied to the property, and a failure to pay results in a lean on the property. And, unfortunately a shut off for the tenant.

[Jimaz]

281 Pimps Mass Arrest, Detroit's Humanitarian Water Crisis & 5 Censored Books

The Detroit segment begins at 7:55.

[sumas]

Well actually I think cable is over-priced so that is why I don't even try to afford it. I've fully adapted to streamed TV now.

To the point: You know the dead-beat landlord is a factor here. Most of these two and four-family homes and other rental property in the D have one [[1) water bill going to one particular resident [[unit) that is to be paid by owner of property who chooses/ chose to ignore it, until -- well, until the day of reckoning: shut off.

I agree about cable. We bought that box thing and sometimes it works and sometimes not. But heck there is always the local library,

We rented a flat in GPP. The landlord kept the original bill and sent copies for us to pay divided between the two. A single delightful man lived in the one unit, we were a family of four so every other month we would pay the full bill. The landlord who kept the original bill would write it off as a deduction and was out of pocket on nothing.

[Zacha341]

Yeah, I have wifi and between my converter and ROKU box I do ok OFF THE CABLE pay grid. Though I do wish Netflix offered more for streaming but ROKU has some decent stuff.

And yes I have have rented before and thank goodness my landlord was on top of paying the water bill and not falling behind.

I agree about cable. We bought that box thing and sometimes it works and sometimes not. But heck there is always the local library,

We rented a flat in GPP. The landlord kept the original bill and sent copies for us to pay divided between the two. A single delightful man lived in the one unit, we were a family of four so every other month we would pay the full bill. The landlord who kept the original bill would write it off as a deduction and was out of pocket on nothing.

[Jimaz]

This issue reminds me of the scene in DetroitYES Home » Detroit Connections » Fun Videos » Frank Herbert's Dune where Lady Jessica declares that House Atreides will no longer practice the demeaning custom of selling "squeezings" [[waste water) to Fremen at the door of the royal palace.

She says, "Give them back their money. Go on. This 'custom' stops now. Do as I said. Do as I said. Water will never again be sold at the Atreides door. At the end of every meal, any person who calls at this door may receive a full cup — free."

The scene is set up at 20:20 and culminates at 25:33 in Part 1 of 2.

I would like to dedicate that post to Jjaba. I think he would approve.

[JBMcB]

A lot of the rental issues seem to stem from the renter or landlord not paying their bills. Either the renter gives the money to the landlord and the landlord pockets it - or the renter doesn't pay the bill directly and the landlord ends up with a lien on their property.

Couldn't this be solved rather simply by the water department sending two bills - one to the renter and one to the landlord? Then, whomever is supposed to pay can send their check in. If the renter or landlord are delinquent, it should be pretty obvious as the non-payment shows up on both bills.

[Danny]

FWIW, the poll at the end of the OP article is currently at:

Do you consider it a human rights violation to shut off water services to those whose bills are in arrears?

Yes 70.16% [[3,109 votes)

No 29.84% [[1,322 votes)

Let's watch how that changes as all the flying monkeys start doing their dirty deeds.

Water is our natural birthright, not just a human right violation. We need water to live. Without it we just die.

Humans can find a way to get drinking water without using corporate services.

Let's say you live in the home with no running water or being homeless. Here are some steps that you get access to water to drink and bathe:

1. There are public drinking fountains found municipal centers, libraries and some big box stores.

2. To bathe yourself there are family restrooms in most public areas.

It's a pity that DPW have to shut-off water to poor folks in Detroit ghetto hoods. But by law that have to do it. You have to pay your bills on time just like other utilities. If you don't have the income, you don't pay, go into debt and file bankruptcy. Or seek help from your family, friends, church and other welfare service agencies. Everytime you use DPW services, you are using their pipes, sewage and treatment plants. Also, some educational services need to be taught to poor folks that saving water is not only good for the environment and it save money on your next bill.

When I was living in my Detroit home. My family were saving water by taking shorter showers, washing dishes and clothes less. Watering your lawn less. Let God water your lawn more. And having a water saving device like putting a brick in your toilet.

When some your poor Detroiters fix your income and set a budget plan, then you can pay your water bills. Otherwise wait for Conyers for your bailout.

[Zacha341]

Danny, I'm hearing you, and I am not defending DWDS on any level but there is a cost of treatment and sewarage and the remaining staff of folks working, running and maintaining the systems and what not that make water usuable, who in turn have their own water bills. Or w'ed all be down at the river front with a bucket for something less than fully drinkable. Or hand it off to the feds and have them tax us for the processing?

Water is our natural birthright, not just a human right violation. We need water to live. Without it we just die.

[DetroiterOnTheWestCoast]

You think Detroit water rates are high? At $21.71 per 1,000 cubic feet?

http://www.dwsd.org/downloads_n/cust...ater_rates.pdf

Try San Francisco rates for a single family residence:

http://www.sfwater.org/index.aspx?page=168

Compared to your $21.71 for 1,000 cubic feet.....

First 4 "units" = 4 ccf [[400 cubic feet) = 4 x $4.86 = $19.44
Next 6 "units" = 6 ccf [[600 cubic feet) = 6 x $6.52 = $39.12
$58.56

And that's just for the water, not the various other charges. The SF rates are increasing dramatically each of the next several years.

My current bill was for 20 days under the previous rates and 10 under the new ones. I used only 4 units; i.e. 400 cubic feet. My total bill was $60.00.

I think Detroiters must use one heck of a lot of water to get bills of $75 under your low low rates.

[Wesley Mouch]

...snip...My current bill was for 20 days under the previous rates and 10 under the new ones. I used only 4 units; i.e. 400 cubic feet. My total bill was $60.00.

I think Detroiters must use one heck of a lot of water to get bills of $75 under your low low rates.

I pay about $40/mo in Hamtramck for normal family usage. I think that's quite reasonable.

I would gladly pay an additional $2.00 a month to provide central water dispensers to the rare person who truly can't express their natural right to seize the water of others for their use.

[poobert]

Canadians rarely miss an opportunity to act holier-than-Americans.

Look at their treatment of the aboriginal people and they've got a past as checkered as ours, as everyone's. Why can't they just mind their own goddamned business?

[Ray1936]

My water source is Lake Mead. It's down 110 feet; its lowest level since 1937 when it started filling after completion of Hoover Dam [[okay, Boulder Dam for you Democrats). If you're sending water, send some out this way, will ya???

[Lowell]

Greet the water bearers from Canada.

[Honky Tonk]

Greet the water bearers from Canada.

I think we should turn the tide against gouging taxpayers.