Tigers: Attendance down, viewership down. Why?

**Smirnoff** · July-08-14, 05:10 PM

BTW: Who likes to watch Avila at bat swinging around at those mosquitoes all the time.....

**Smirnoff** · July-08-14, 05:12 PM

Any somebody mentioned, not sure who, that Coke is still on the roster?

**Honky Tonk** · July-08-14, 09:15 PM

Originally Posted by Smirnoff

You mean you don't like those "water weenies" ???

Sounds like a National Lampoon movie.

**Oddz313** · July-08-14, 11:32 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

Ah, but they were SO cheap! That was the point. You could get a crappy bleachers ticket and that meant you were there for the GAME, not the fucking Ferris wheel or goddamn restaurant or overpriced bullshit that abounds at You-Paid-For-It Park.

You can complain about that section, about the "bleacher creatures" that inhabited it, about a billion shitty things about sitting in the bleachers, but I'll tell you one thing: You could go there without dropping $100 a head, drink beer, eat OK, smoke, and watch the game. And I think that gets to the heart of why "attendance is down." Like it's a freakin' mystery ...

Wait are we talking about Belle Isle now

**Oddz313** · July-08-14, 11:40 PM

An open intox and a bag of the green will run you a lot more than $100 at belle isle these days, the cops will be eating your grilled goods as you get hauled off to be processed into the meat grinder known as the american judicial system.

Drinking and smoking with the bleacher creatures with cheap tickets in tow is a thing of the past. The younger generations better not dare be young,wild and free like their parents or grandparents. Pick them young whipper snappers up by their ankles and shake every shilling out of them, if they try.

**bailey** · July-09-14, 05:33 AM

Originally Posted by Oddz313

An open intox and a bag of the green will run you a lot more than $100 at belle isle these days, the cops will be eating your grilled goods as you get hauled off to be processed into the meat grinder known as the american judicial system.

Drinking and smoking with the bleacher creatures with cheap tickets in tow is a thing of the past. The younger generations better not dare be young,wild and free like their parents or grandparents. Pick them young whipper snappers up by their ankles and shake every shilling out of them, if they try.

They can't be young wild and free because all those parents and grandparents that WERE are in charge now.

baby boomers have to be the most self absorbed, hypocritical generation of folks to ever walk the earth

**Honky Tonk** · July-09-14, 06:53 AM

Originally Posted by Oddz313

An open intox and a bag of the green will run you a lot more than $100 at belle isle these days, the cops will be eating your grilled goods as you get hauled off to be processed into the meat grinder known as the american judicial system.

Are you sure YOU'RE not talking about Fantasy Island?

**Oddz313** · July-09-14, 07:02 AM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

Are you sure YOU'RE not talking about Fantasy Island?

"The plane, the plane" Nope its just a police helicopter

**Oddz313** · July-09-14, 07:04 AM

Originally Posted by bailey

They can't be young wild and free because all those parents and grandparents that WERE are in charge now.

baby boomers have to be the most self absorbed, hypocritical generation of folks to ever walk the earth

Pretty much, "They were different times"

**carolcb** · July-09-14, 07:15 AM

I don't live in Detroit anymore, but if I were there I would be at as many games as I could pay for. Are you still complaining about the Tigers after last night?

**Honky Tonk** · July-09-14, 07:21 AM

Originally Posted by Oddz313

"The plane, the plane" Nope its just a police helicopter

Are you sure it isn't 2 young women suffocating a 3rd in a mud hole on Belle Isle? Maybe it's a shoot out in the parking lot because someone looked @ someone crosseyed and 'dsrespected them?

**Oddz313** · July-09-14, 08:12 AM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

Are you sure it isn't 2 young women suffocating a 3rd in a mud hole on Belle Isle? Maybe it's a shoot out in the parking lot because someone looked @ someone crosseyed and 'dsrespected them?

Those are not the instances, some of us are referring too. The murder rate was high in the 70's and 80's as well. Those people will always be considered criminals but now 6 pack joe is as well

**Honky Tonk** · July-09-14, 08:31 AM

Originally Posted by Oddz313

Those are not the instances, some of us are referring too. The murder rate was high in the 70's and 80's as well. Those people will always be considered criminals but now 6 pack joe is as well

I think some of "us" have our dates mixed up, just like our thread titles. This one's titled "Tigers: Attendance down, viewership down. Why?"

http://www.macombdaily.com/20080627/...-friends-death

http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2010/08/...parking-space/

**Detroitnerd** · July-09-14, 08:37 AM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

I think some of "us" have our dates mixed up, just like our thread titles. This one's titled "Tigers: Attendance down, viewership down. Why?"

http://www.macombdaily.com/20080627/...-friends-death

http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2010/08/...parking-space/

I dunno, Honky. You can always wave yellow journalism in people's faces and scream about crime. But crime has been in steady decline since the 1980s, hasn't it? I've lived in the city for 12 years now and never been shot, killed, just got my wallet stolen once. I got my wallet stolen TWICE in the 12 years I lived in New York. Every big city has big city problems. But not every big city is surrounded by triumphalist suburbanites who watch the city's big murder/robbery/death/rape of the day on the nightly news and declare they'll never go there.

We have this really unusual culture where so many people in the suburbs don't understand that the city isn't just hobags and gangsters, and politicians who are eager to exploit that ignorance by proposing actions that hurt larger classes of people. It's sad.

Anyway, back to Tiger baseball ...

**emu steve** · July-09-14, 08:45 AM

Originally Posted by carolcb

I don't live in Detroit anymore, but if I were there I would be at as many games as I could pay for. Are you still complaining about the Tigers after last night?

I was in town this weekend, leving in a few minutes but will take another drive through downtown for my empirical analysis of conditions on the ground [[or 10, 15 or 20 stories up).

I bought tickets off of StubHub - got good deals.

I bought parking from Olympia [[on Woodward on the north side of Henry) for $15 bucks Sunday and $10 bucks last night [[very good deal).

Don't hate me because I gave Ilitich $25 for his surface parking.

I assume the next time I'm in town it will be gone and a big mud hole.

BTW, the game last night was great. The reversed call when the Tiger was called out at second was a TRUE game changer.

**Honky Tonk** · July-09-14, 08:51 AM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

I dunno, Honky. You can always wave yellow journalism in people's faces and scream about crime. But crime has been in steady decline since the 1980s, hasn't it? I've lived in the city for 12 years now and never been shot, killed, just got my wallet stolen once. I got my wallet stolen TWICE in the 12 years I lived in New York. Every big city has big city problems. But not every big city is surrounded by triumphalist suburbanites who watch the city's big murder/robbery/death/rape of the day on the nightly news and declare they'll never go there.

We have this really unusual culture where so many people in the suburbs don't understand that the city isn't just hobags and gangsters, and politicians who are eager to exploit that ignorance by proposing actions that hurt larger classes of people. It's sad.

Anyway, back to Tiger baseball ...

You don't mean me in your suburban rant, because I've been in Detroit for 63 years to your 12, [[it used to be 10), and I'm still here. I don't live in Detroit Towers, but in the trenches. As far as you avoiding becoming a victim, that's great, [[I mean that) and consider yourself lucky. A lot of people have not been anywhere near as fortunate as you've been. Detroit's mass exodus should make that evident. If Detroit continues on it's "business as usual" path, well, I'll have to join you in Hamtrack. "Play Ball".

**Detroitnerd** · July-09-14, 09:02 AM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

You don't mean me in your suburban rant, because I've been in Detroit for 63 years to your 12, [[it used to be 10), and I'm still here. I don't live in Detroit Towers, but in the trenches. As far as you avoiding becoming a victim, that's great, [[I mean that) and consider yourself lucky. A lot of people have not been anywhere near as fortunate as you've been. Detroit's mass exodus should make that evident. If Detroit continues on it's "business as usual" path, well, I'll have to join you in Hamtrack. "Play Ball".

Well, I moved away when I was 21, like a lot of folks. I was born in Detroit, grew up in the suburbs, moved back 12 years ago and moved to Hamtramck two years ago, which I still consider to be "the city," so that explains the discrepancy in my numbers. And I really do feel for all the victims of crime and people who suffer. But I think concerns about violent crime are routinely overstated these days. When Chicago starts looking like a meat grinder compared to Detroit, I think that's evidence of a real shift.

Anytime you want to join us in H-town, come on up. Plenty of room.

**Honky Tonk** · July-09-14, 09:09 AM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

Well, I moved away when I was 21, like a lot of folks. I was born in Detroit, grew up in the suburbs, moved back 12 years ago and moved to Hamtramck two years ago, which I still consider to be "the city," so that explains the discrepancy in my numbers. And I really do feel for all the victims of crime and people who suffer. But I think concerns about violent crime are routinely overstated these days. When Chicago starts looking like a meat grinder compared to Detroit, I think that's evidence of a real shift.

Anytime you want to join us in H-town, come on up. Plenty of room.

A close friend moved OUT of Hamtown TO Chicago, in search of a better life. Shortly after, Detroit's crime #'s started dropping, and Chicago started having serious problems. To this day, I think HE was responsible for Detroit's crime problem.

**Detroitnerd** · July-09-14, 10:15 AM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

A close friend moved OUT of Hamtown TO Chicago, in search of a better life. Shortly after, Detroit's crime #'s started dropping, and Chicago started having serious problems. To this day, I think HE was responsible for Detroit's crime problem.

Haha. Oh, brother … their loss is our gain.

**paddlebobb** · July-10-14, 08:26 AM

I read all these comments with great interest, and there's a bit of truth in all of them. Baseball, and all sports for that matter, have been evolving from simple games to spectacles, probably due to the ascent and growth of ESPN and their ilk. For me, they have taken away a lot of the freshness and intimacy of the games. To go to a Tiger game at the Corner some years back, all it would take is a quick decision to go, and about $10 in your pocket. That being said, one could park in the neighborhood, walk over the bridge, buy a bleacher ticket, hot dog and beer and really enjoy the game. It takes a lot more planning and cash today. Once you walk in modern ballparks, you are being sold until the moment you leave. I love baseball and watch most FSD telecast in the evening. I dread having to go the games live because of all the work it takes. So I guess I'm thankful that we live in a market that can sustain daily broadcasts.

**emu steve** · July-10-14, 09:20 AM

Originally Posted by paddlebobb

I read all these comments with great interest, and there's a bit of truth in all of them. Baseball, and all sports for that matter, have been evolving from simple games to spectacles, probably due to the ascent and growth of ESPN and their ilk. For me, they have taken away a lot of the freshness and intimacy of the games. To go to a Tiger game at the Corner some years back, all it would take is a quick decision to go, and about $10 in your pocket. That being said, one could park in the neighborhood, walk over the bridge, buy a bleacher ticket, hot dog and beer and really enjoy the game. It takes a lot more planning and cash today. Once you walk in modern ballparks, you are being sold until the moment you leave. I love baseball and watch most FSD telecast in the evening. I dread having to go the games live because of all the work it takes. So I guess I'm thankful that we live in a market that can sustain daily broadcasts.

Yes, I completely agree with you that the sports world, including MLB, has completely changed.

But with 24 hour television on cable including most Tiger games, the Internet, etc. etc. that should be expected. And, of course, marketing has become a big, big industry [[and yes, I spent half of the game Tuesday trying to TUNE OUT all marketing esp. the dumb stuff like the 'Call to the Bullpen' is brought to you by...'. Any break, any half inning, etc. is an opportunity to work in a commercial. The pre-games are nothing but commercial related messaging, 'Game Time weather is brought to you by...'. The Comerica Park announcer did that s*it all night.

I opted to drive back [[to D.C.) and listen to the Tiger's game on the radio. Dan and Jim are really, really good. [[Of course, so are Mario and Rod).

BTW, it is time to re-do or at least really, really clean the rest rooms. They are NOT well maintained compared to other stadiums I've visited this year, e.g., Nats park, Orioles Park, etc.

**401don** · July-10-14, 09:37 AM

I went to the games on the weekend also. I paid 26-28.00 for upper level infield rows 2-4 all 3 games on Stubhub. I forked over the 6.50 for a giant coke and made it last the whole game and a 4.00 popcorn 2 of the days. It amazes me how many people just mindlessly buy 10.00 pina coladas, 4.00 waters, etc. and then complain about prices. I also parked at Greektown casino free every game. Not sure why they stopped charging but thanks Dan!

**bailey** · July-10-14, 01:35 PM

Reading over this thread I'm struck by the fact that apparently the main bitch here is that Baseball tickets have increased in price over the last 30 years so much they've priced the average fan out of the market.

That 10 dollar bleacher seat at OTS in 1985 everyone seems to be pining for is $22.00 in today's dollars. [[median household income has also doubled in that time)

you can get bleacher seats today for 26...upper decks for 25ish, standing room or or the jungle for less than 20.

the horror.

The issue isn't the cost, it's the product on the field and the vast amount of choice and competition for the leisure/disposable dollar.

**RO_Resident** · July-10-14, 01:47 PM

Originally Posted by paddlebobb

I read all these comments with great interest, and there's a bit of truth in all of them. Baseball, and all sports for that matter, have been evolving from simple games to spectacles, probably due to the ascent and growth of ESPN and their ilk. For me, they have taken away a lot of the freshness and intimacy of the games. To go to a Tiger game at the Corner some years back, all it would take is a quick decision to go, and about $10 in your pocket. That being said, one could park in the neighborhood, walk over the bridge, buy a bleacher ticket, hot dog and beer and really enjoy the game. It takes a lot more planning and cash today. Once you walk in modern ballparks, you are being sold until the moment you leave. I love baseball and watch most FSD telecast in the evening. I dread having to go the games live because of all the work it takes. So I guess I'm thankful that we live in a market that can sustain daily broadcasts.

Part of the reason you could get last minute tickets was because attendance was pretty lousy at the old Tigers Stadium. It was pretty hard to fill the 52,000 seats.

In the 90's, they averaged just 19,140 per game.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/te...T/attend.shtml

**Oddz313** · July-10-14, 07:54 PM

Originally Posted by bailey

Reading over this thread I'm struck by the fact that apparently the main bitch here is that Baseball tickets have increased in price over the last 30 years so much they've priced the average fan out of the market.

That 10 dollar bleacher seat at OTS in 1985 everyone seems to be pining for is $22.00 in today's dollars. [[median household income has also doubled in that time)

you can get bleacher seats today for 26...upper decks for 25ish, standing room or or the jungle for less than 20.

the horror.

The issue isn't the cost, it's the product on the field and the vast amount of choice and competition for the leisure/disposable dollar.

I went yesterday, paid the scalper $20 for lower seats that were $27 tickets, usually I am able to do better but since the dodgers only come around once in a blue moon the cheapest were standing room at the box office for $18. The product was fine and they won, they are one of the best 5 teams in the MLB. It is not cheap all around to go to the ballgame but still not a bad value. Many people are just not going to as many games as before like me. At one time I would go to 4 or 5 games a year. Last year and this year it is going to be down to 2 or 3.