Let's talk about how the roads around here are PISS POOR, and an embarassment.

[sirrealone]

The roads aren't that bad and half of them are already under construction. They need to manage the money they have.

Many roads may be under construction, but it's the type of construction that's a problem. Instead of rebuilding roads that are at the end of past their useful time, we're throwing a layer of asphalt on them that's going to crumble in three years.

If we double the money, we shouldn't expect to see double the number of projects, but the work done on those projects will be more in line with what's expected in the normal life cycle of a road and in the end, will make the roads last longer.

[RO_Resident]

Most of the roads I travel in Detroit are actually in much better shape than the suburban counterparts. The Lodge is pretty smooth. 94 through downtown is pretty smooth from Macomb all the way to Dearborn. 75 is pretty good from downtown up to 8 mile with the exception of the 1/2 mile stretch by 94.

The roads that are terrible that never seem to get fixed are 75 between 696 and Big Beaver. For Oakland County standards - that's been terrible for years. Even the exit ramps getting off 75 at 11 mile for Royal Oak are terrible. 11 Mile by the synagogue/Telegraph is terrible.

Detroit's repaving Woodward, they did Mack this year - most of them aren't as bad as our outer burbs. At least in my opinion.

Some jurisdictional issues come in to play.
Lodge = MDOT
I-94 = MDOT
I-75 = MDOT, the section by I-94 is the hybrid European test section. there have been problems with the top 3" layer delaminating. A project is in the works. The Portion between I-696 and M-59 is slated for a major project.
I-75 ramp to 11 Mile = MDOT, the service drive is Royal Oak or Madison Hts.
11 Mile by the synagogue = City of Southfield
Woodward north of Adams = MDOT
Woodward Adams to Jefferson = Detroit
Mack [[if it is the project I'm thinking of, east of Alter) = Wayne County
Mack west of Alter is Detroit.

But I think it is still a fair characterization to say that the urban areas tend to be in better condition than suburban roads, and much better than exurban areas. And MDOT tends to do a better job than other jurisdictions at maintaining their roads for many reasons.

A map:
http://www.mcgi.state.mi.us/MITRP/Data/paserMap.aspx

You can compare conditions here:
http://www.mcgi.state.mi.us/MITRP/Da...Dashboard.aspx

[RO_Resident]

I'm sick of all the pissing and moaning about "not enough money" to repair roads. There obviously is money since exactly 50% of my one way mileage is construction. There may be a few bad roads needing repair but politicians should not be whining and working all night trying to create an emergency. I put on about 75,000 miles annually on this state's roads and most of them don't even slosh my coffee cup. Hands off what's left of my income.

Unfortunately, 50% of the roads for someone's commute under construction isn't a representative sample of the area.

Anyway, 'sloshing your coffee' isn't necessarily a good characterization of the condition of a road. Poured concrete concrete that is textured or that has lifted joint filler can have a relatively bad ride quality, while an asphalt pavement at the end of its life can be quite smooth.

[ABetterDetroit]

I have to agree, Governor Snyder can't even lead his own party and fix the roads in Michigan like he said he would at his very first State of the State and then at every one thereafter.

http://www.freep.com/story/opinion/c...deal/74685008/

[Gpwrangler]

Unfortunately, 50% of the roads for someone's commute under construction isn't a representative sample of the area.

Anyway, 'sloshing your coffee' isn't necessarily a good characterization of the condition of a road. Poured concrete concrete that is textured or that has lifted joint filler can have a relatively bad ride quality, while an asphalt pavement at the end of its life can be quite smooth.

Just replaced a set of tires worn out from these shitty roads. Had 65,000 miles on them and legal tread depth remaining. Alignment didn't even need adjustment. Yeah, I know, that's not a representative sample of the area.

[royce]

Roads continue to deteriorate. Ten Mile between Evergreen and Greenfield is terrible. Seven Mile just east of I-275 to Beech Daley is really bad. Also, 8 Mile/Baseline Road west of Farmington Road in Farmington Hills [[there's a Kroger's near by) is in extremely bad shape. Lastly, Michigan and Trumbull remains a nightmare. I'm convinced that there's simply never going to be enough money to repair all the roads in Michigan. Some may have to be shutdown and traffic forced to reroute. It' bad, really bad.

[sirrealone]

The roads have been allowed to deteriorate for so many years that it's going to take at least a decadeto catch up with even the backlog of work that's needed right now, let alone anything new that comes up in the mean time.

[ABetterDetroit]

Have a coworker on a assignment to the area for a few months ask me today what the f with the roads around here? I wasn't sure how to answer when a year and a half ago we didn't have the money to fix them but now we have plenty of cash to cut the income tax rate starting next year.

What is the correct answer? They will be fixed soon or we don't want to fix them and would rather have a billion dollar tax cut?

[Atticus]

A few years ago there was a statewide vote to see if Michigan residents wanted to finally spend enough to fix the roads. Almost 90% said no. Just because 10% of us are willing to spend $$$ does not mean the majority of residents feel that way. That is your answer.

[ABetterDetroit]

A few years ago there was a statewide vote to see if Michigan residents wanted to finally spend enough to fix the roads. Almost 90% said no. Just because 10% of us are willing to spend $$$ does not mean the majority of residents feel that way. That is your answer.

Is that a fair answer?

No to the sales tax increase, I'm fine with. In fact I voted that way on that myself, but a billion dollar income tax cut 15 months later is not the same thing.

The republican legislature even raised taxes themselves to increase funding for road repair starting this year after the increase failed but before the election cycle so the question remains. Will the roads improve?

It would be a reasonable assumption that the republican reign in this state will end sooner than later if roads continue to get worse. Any political opponent will be able to capitalize out of their failure to provide one of the most basic requirements of government. Supply drivable roads. A majority does have that expectation.

[sirrealone]

They did approve money for additional road monies with increased gas taxes and registration fees, but the collection of those funds started less than two months ago.

A better answer to your friend would be that the road budget was underfunded for 20 years and that's what happens, and point out that even with increased revenue, we've got many years of catching up to do.

[Atticus]

They did approve money for additional road monies with increased gas taxes and registration fees, but the collection of those funds started less than two months ago.

A better answer to your friend would be that the road budget was underfunded for 20 years and that's what happens, and point out that even with increased revenue, we've got many years of catching up to do.

The road budget is still underfunded even with the increased gas tax and registration. more roads "turn bad" every year then there is money to fix them. With the new tax, we are still below the break even point, thus even though the gap is smaller now, there will still be more roads that will continue to "turn bad" then can be fixed in a year.

It's like Detroit's population in the last 10 years: the rate of decline is lower now, but it is still declining. So the roads will be worse in 2020 than today, just like Detroit's 2015 population is less than 2005, even though the rate of decline has slowed.

Unlike Detroit's population data though, the road situation shows no sign of getting better. The only way to do that is to spend enough $$$ that you fix more roads in a given year than turn bad so you are actually making headway. That figure in 2017 dollars is about $1.8 billion/year. The new tax raises between $600 to $900 million, so still not enough to put us over the hump.

[Atticus]

Is that a fair answer?

No to the sales tax increase, I'm fine with. In fact I voted that way on that myself, but a billion dollar income tax cut 15 months later is not the same thing.

The republican legislature even raised taxes themselves to increase funding for road repair starting this year after the increase failed but before the election cycle so the question remains. Will the roads improve?

It would be a reasonable assumption that the republican reign in this state will end sooner than later if roads continue to get worse. Any political opponent will be able to capitalize out of their failure to provide one of the most basic requirements of government. Supply drivable roads. A majority does have that expectation.

It is kid of fair. The sales tax method is not how I would have done it either, but the odds are slim to none that any proposal would come out exactly how I would want it. So I voted yes, because even though I don't think the sales tax is how the roads should have been funded, having enough funding to fix the roads was more important to me.

I will say this, that proposal actually would have raised enough $ to fix the roads. The new gas/registration tax that the state passed last year, and just started in January is well short of the amount needed. Thus the roads are not going to get better.

[brizee]

Remember when Michigan was a backwater shithole embarrassment that didn't see to the needs of it's infrastructure?

Glad those days are behind us!

[313WX]

Remember when Michigan was a backwater shithole embarrassment that didn't see to the needs of it's infrastructure?

Glad those days are behind us!

Did you drive over another massive pothole today?

[Dumpling]

Next Monday morning a rim, a lug nut, and a six point socket
are to be replaced. [[Correct, my mechanic skills are marginal.)
Have been so lucky enough up 'til now that the spare only had
five psi in it so it had to be filled with air at a nearby gas station.
Don't know which pothole ate this tire but there are certainly
enough of them out there this week.

[Honky Tonk]

Remember when Michigan was a backwater shithole embarrassment that didn't see to the needs of it's infrastructure?

Glad those days are behind us!

Last year the drivers of MI voted for a license, registration, and gas tax increase, so the State of MI would have money to "Fix our roads". The money was put into the General Fund, then removed and used for other non-road repair stuff. Within days of the increase, the State started crying there wasn't enough money to "fix our roads". Until the people of this State, and City, start demanding accountability for their government's actions, you'll keep spending your hard earned dollars on vehicle repair, and posting a bunch of shit on public forums.

[brizee]

Last year the drivers of MI voted for a license, registration, and gas tax increase, so the State of MI would have money to "Fix our roads". The money was put into the General Fund, then removed and used for other non-road repair stuff. Within days of the increase, the State started crying there wasn't enough money to "fix our roads". Until the people of this State, and City, start demanding accountability for their government's actions, you'll keep spending your hard earned dollars on vehicle repair, and posting a bunch of shit on public forums.

About posting a bunch of horseshit on public forums.

The only tax votes put to the public was the sales tax increase related to gas in 2015 and the vehicle registration related to transit in 2016. Both rejected.

If you insist on being a prick, at least know WTF you're talking about.

[Maof]

The amount of potholes I dodge on a daily basis is insane! I wonder if any of the "general fund" money was used on Snyder's legal fee for Flint's water crisis!

[Honky Tonk]

About posting a bunch of horseshit on public forums.

The only tax votes put to the public was the sales tax increase related to gas in 2015 and the vehicle registration related to transit in 2016. Both rejected.

If you insist on being a prick, at least know WTF you're talking about.

Since both my license fees and vehicle registration went up with no changes, I could ask you just WTF you're talking about? Rant own!

[Maof]

https://www.freep.com/story/news/pol...igan/95519264/

It sure did. I was able to pay mine 6 months in advance.

[Honky Tonk]

The amount of potholes I dodge on a daily basis is insane! I wonder if any of the "general fund" money was used on Snyder's legal fee for Flint's water crisis!

Snyder, Earley, they play, you pay, SSDD.

[Maof]

There are several more reports of concrete kicking up and damaging cars within the last week, specifically on 696. Yesterday a woman was driving on 696 in Madison Heights and a truck kicked up concrete and landed thru the windshield. So very lucky. MDOT held a meeting today to reach out to other states to see how they're handling the problem and plan to talk to concrete manufacturers to see what products are available to fix it! "Looking for temporary solutions." Now, I know 696 will be shutting down for a complete redo, but you mean to tell me that here in Michigan, we can't figure this out! Oakland county is offering a free app. to report any potholes. Whoppee!

[Uncledave54]

About posting a bunch of horseshit on public forums.

The only tax votes put to the public was the sales tax increase related to gas in 2015 and the vehicle registration related to transit in 2016. Both rejected.

If you insist on being a prick, at least know WTF you're talking about.

It may not have been by a vote, but there was an increase on taxes that was to be earmarked just for roads..... what happened to that money?

http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2017/01/...stration-fees/

[Maof]

It may not have been by a vote, but there was an increase on taxes that was to be earmarked just for roads..... what happened to that money?

http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2017/01/...stration-fees/

Snyder's legal bills for Flint?!