Detroit gets too much attention from State of Michigan.

[Wesley Mouch]

I don't always agree with Wesley Mouch, but I do this time... and sometimes things need to get worse, in order to get better [[not the school system, but the city)... I think that all the state was doing was getting to the inevitable sooner rather than later...

And I'll take you point a little farther. The State really was doing things that 'hurt' Detroit. But that 'hurt' was 'tough love' -- as in "we're not going to fund you, because you're wasting your money". Get yourself to rehab.

And what happened with the EM and now bankruptcy would be called an 'intervention' by a social worker.

[Novine]

I'll be the last one to defend DPS but after the first state takeover, DPS was in worse condition than when it was taken over by the state. That's not "tough love" or an "intervention", that's malpractice by the state.

[Wesley Mouch]

This idea that the State hurt DPS is very present in the minds of some. I've only thought it a talking point. Something about debt at end of their term being greater.

Allow me two questions:

1) If the debt was greater, what State actions caused this?

2) What was worse about the 'education' being provided?

[Schoolcraft]

This idea that the State hurt DPS is very present in the minds of some. I've only thought it a talking point. Something about debt at end of their term being greater.

Allow me two questions:

1) If the debt was greater, what State actions caused this?

2) What was worse about the 'education' being provided?

Well first, the state took over DPS in 1999 at a time when the schools had grown to around 170,000 kids. Gov Engler, who established the Michigan charter school act of 1994 and who has a charter school organization named after him probably didn't like the fact that he and his buddies couldn't make money in Detroit because of the powerhouse that was DPS. He decided he would ruin DPS which at the time had a budget surplus by using the excuse that "test scores needed to improve." The folks in charge under the State proceeded to run DPS budgets into the ground 4 out of 5 years, before democracy was given back to Detroit this time with a deficit. The education results during that time were about the same, because the reality was that the education of the students had nothing to do with how schools were being run, but the environment some students were growing up in. You can read about it in these links: http://www.mackinac.org/7556 http://www.freep.com/article/2013102...lished-schools

[Wesley Mouch]

Well first, the state took over DPS in 1999 at a time when the schools had grown to around 170,000 kids. Gov Engler, who established the Michigan charter school act of 1994 and who has a charter school organization named after him probably didn't like the fact that he and his buddies couldn't make money in Detroit because of the powerhouse that was DPS. He decided he would ruin DPS which at the time had a budget surplus by using the excuse that "test scores needed to improve." The folks in charge under the State proceeded to run DPS budgets into the ground 4 out of 5 years, before democracy was given back to Detroit this time with a deficit. The education results during that time were about the same, because the reality was that the education of the students had nothing to do with how schools were being run, but the environment some students were growing up in. You can read about it in these links: http://www.mackinac.org/7556 http://www.freep.com/article/2013102...lished-schools

Thanks for the links. I'll read them right after I enjoy my current year lump of coal day after tomorrow.

As to your shrug-off of schools being able to make progress in poorer 'environments', I think you should consider that everything matters. Sometimes you have to do everything right. No just finance, but environment, schools...

[Schoolcraft]

Thanks for the links. I'll read them right after I enjoy my current year lump of coal day after tomorrow.

As to your shrug-off of schools being able to make progress in poorer 'environments', I think you should consider that everything matters. Sometimes you have to do everything right. No just finance, but environment, schools...

It wasn't a shrug-off. There are many things that need to go right for an entire school system to operate well, but if a kid comes to school after not eating the whole weekend, or doesn't get to school on time or doesn't do their homework because their parents don't care even the best/most creative school isn't going to do much to help them. There will be a few a diamonds in the rough that make it, but there's no school in the U.S. public, charter or private in the middle of the ghetto pumping out super scholars that I know of because the factors they're up against are tough to overcome. It's been a problem that really nobody has had the answer to. That's something the state has to learn instead of always showing up with their Superman capes on saying they can fix everything and then making things worse.

[Schoolcraft]

And the point in the first post that the actions undertaken by the State that have hurt Detroit are reversible is key. The State could rescind their ban on residency requirements for municipal workers tomorrow and immediately Detroit would increase in jobs, population, tax revenue, safety etc. So if this is really about "helping" Detroit what are they waiting for? The situation is dire enough to take away the voters right to an accountable leader but not to return to freakin residency requirements? The State could make it a priority to help collect taxes for their municipalities that collect income tax during tax season. This is something they said they would do in the consent agreement with Detroit... so what are they waiting for? As pointed out above they could pass anti-scrapping bills to stop Detroit's housing stock from being eaten alive, so what are they waiting for? So no, the State is not free of blame. Should Detroit get some of it? Of course, but the State wants people to believe "We didn't help make this mess," and that's a lie that should be pointed out to the people of the State who believe Detroit did this to themselves and media doesn't seem to want to do it.

[313WX]

And the point in the first post that the actions undertaken by the State that have hurt Detroit are reversible is key. The State could rescind their ban on residency requirements for municipal workers tomorrow and immediately Detroit would increase in jobs, population, tax revenue, safety etc. So if this is really about "helping" Detroit what are they waiting for? The situation is dire enough to take away the voters right to an accountable leader but not to return to freakin residency requirements? The State could make it a priority to help collect taxes for their municipalities that collect income tax during tax season. This is something they said they would do in the consent agreement with Detroit... so what are they waiting for? As pointed out above they could pass anti-scrapping bills to stop Detroit's housing stock from being eaten alive, so what are they waiting for? So no, the State is not free of blame. Should Detroit get some of it? Of course, but the State wants people to believe "We didn't help make this mess," and that's a lie that should be pointed out to the people of the State who believe Detroit did this to themselves and media doesn't seem to want to do it.

Anyone without an agenda in this ordeal know the only reason the state is doing what it's doing with Detroit now was to simply prevent the fallout Detroit's collapse would have had on the rest of the state.