Another Heidelberg house goes up in flames from arson

**subsidized** · November-24-13, 06:44 PM

Originally Posted by Django

I would rather have the work of Tyree in my neighborhood making something creative rather than just letting the abandoned's rot. There is no way in hell that block is not a positive compared to any other blocks north South East or West of Heidelberg. Your statement about 2nd grader finger paint gets no points. Where did you get your fine arts degree? The very fact we argue if its art makes it art. The art is not in what is painted, sculpted, or hung, its in the feeling it gives. Tyree has improved his block, taken something thought of as garbage and turned it around into something beautiful. It wouldn't work in Garden City no doubt, I cant think of one interesting thing in Garden City but it works here in Detroit so why knock it. Im proud to know the man and the pride he has given that area.

ok, put down the joint for a minute and read the words that I am typing, process them in your head and try to understand that I NEVER SAID THE PROJECT WASN'T ART. Art can be anything and I'm not the judge of what is or isn't art. Art creates conversation and with this being a mere sample of the debate about the project that has gone on since the 80's, I'd unfortunately say that Heidelberg is the most talked about art in the city of Detroit. I never said anything about Garden City or whether it is here or there, I simply implied that the Heidelberg Project looks like shit. Yes, some people might think it looks better than abandoned houses and overgrown lots and I can kind of agree with that. As for the 2nd grader comment I made, I have a daughter in kindergarten whose painting skill is almost at the level of Guyton's.

I still think that all the time, money, and energy spent by the volunteers on the HP could be better served tearing down abandonment in other surrounding neighborhoods [[fuck the red tape, if it's dangerous tear it down). Now they're trying to raise $50,000 to install cameras to watch piles of garbage. And before either of you chime in and talk more shit yes I have volunteered and worked with John and others at Motor City Blight Busters many times in the past and I do as much as I can to help the city I was born and raised in and ONLY 6 years ago moved away from in search of a better school system for my daughter.

Gannon, if you're referring to the work of Scott Hocking then I know exactly what you're talking about and I have no issues with his installments in the city. I think they are clever, and well executed and not forced down anyones throat with vivid colors and the word 'GOD' painted on everything.

Just stop talking because once again you're making yourselves look silly.

**canuck** · November-24-13, 06:51 PM

Originally Posted by Gannon

Not sure if anything Tyree does around the city can ever be truly valued by one whose training and/or definition of art includes how much an item can fetch at auction. Let alone understood.

You're talking a different language, Django. This guy wouldn't get the rock stacks, either. He cannot buy them, or profit off your making 'em.

Cheers

Yes, and I think that there are many levels and kinds of expressions in art, and snobbery is the biggest enemy to expression, period. How many people censor themselves because they feel inadequate when it comes to personal expression given that they have little or no exposure to techniques? I applaud people who can jump the snobbery fence and land onto a patch of happy sod for their own satisfaction. Heck, a lot of armchair auctioneer types are nowhere near attaining the pleasure of making something, anything. Pimp my garage, Degas!

**noise** · November-24-13, 07:10 PM

Originally Posted by p69rrh51

What makes me an expert is 35 plus years in and out of the art world working for several auction houses. What makes you able to form an intelligent opinion on the project?

I don't have an intelligent opinion on the project. I have an educated opinion on the concept of art being subjective and anyone claiming "that's not art!" to anything they dislike being uncultured neanderthals.

And a few years in an art museum.

**noise** · November-24-13, 07:18 PM

Originally Posted by subsidized

Just stop talking because once again you're making yourselves look silly.

Most Ironic Post of 2013.

**aj3647** · November-24-13, 07:24 PM

Originally Posted by subsidized

So he doesn't pay taxes then....

Also, I guess I should shutup and blindly believe that the project brings in people that spend millions in Detroit proper.... sure.... because that neighborhood is the one all the developers are fighting for. All that hotel and restaurant congestion is making the commute down Mt. Elliot such a headache.

The Heidelberg Project gets an estimated 35,000 "non-local" visitors annually.

http://web.williams.edu/Economics/Ar...SocNetwork.pdf

Now, how "non-local" is defined and how much money these people spend IN the city of Detroit is debatable. I find it hard to believe that most of those 35,000 travel to Detroit for the sole purpose of seeing the Heidelberg Project. Rather, it's likely that many are here for other reasons and take advantage of the opportunity to visit the Heidelberg Project while they are here.

I know a lot of people who have gone to see the HP and haven't spent a dime in the city as a result. They go, they look, and then they leave. MAYBE they go to Slow's after, and that would be about the extent of their in-city spending. In the absence of evidence to the contrary, I think that Lowell is exaggerating the local economic impact of the Heidelberg Project. That's not to say that it isn't worthwhile though.

**sumas** · November-25-13, 07:43 PM

Quit hissing sillies. This is Grandma speaking. No doubt all posters are high IQ, however it really is ok to disagree.

Gannon made a point about Django rock sculptures. I love them, some of the beauty is their impermanence. Django has taken shit cause some folks worry that kids might get hurt however my attitude is keep the brats under control. No doubt those parents wouldn't like my expressed opinion. I really am learning to shrug off opinions that don't coincide with mine.

So kiss and make up, life is short.

**sumas** · November-25-13, 07:52 PM

Canuck, we generally have a room available for friends and family. If you make it to Detroit we would be happy to host you as our guest. We live in a historic district not far from Heidelberg.

We have a better than fair knowledge of Detroit's history and indeed have a published hardbound book detailing specifically east area history and how it contributed to Detroit becoming the automotive center. I don't shill on this board. Happy to give you a grand tour of our city in its glory and ruins.

Sumas