St. Josaphat Steeple Damaged in Storm - Church Building in Jeopardy?

**Detroitnerd** · November-21-13, 12:24 PM

The last iconic building remaining from old Hastings Street. Shame to see it altered in any way. Almost nothing survived after the 1960s, thanks to them putting in the public housing and the freeway.

If I'm right, you can make out the church in the background of this album's cover, a view from Hastings Street in the 1950s.

This would be priceless history in New York, San Francisco, London, etc. But here? Eh, not profitable. We can't subsidize buildings the market doesn't want. [[Though we can spend lots of public money to clean it up once it's ruined.)

**jt1** · November-21-13, 12:44 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

The last iconic building remaining from old Hastings Street. Shame to see it altered in any way. Almost nothing survived after the 1960s, thanks to them putting in the public housing and the freeway.

If I'm right, you can make out the church in the background of this album's cover, a view from Hastings Street in the 1950s.

This would be priceless history in New York, San Francisco, London, etc. But here? Eh, not profitable. We can't subsidize buildings the market doesn't want. [[Though we can spend lots of public money to clean it up once it's ruined.)

But that is 'their' history so it isn't as important and during the 50s/60s was better just being removed.

**Bham1982** · November-21-13, 02:11 PM

Of all the dumbass urban planning moves in the region, removal of Hastings Street has to be one of the worst. They could have easily routed I-75 a few blocks east, though mostly industrial land.

I bet if Hastings were around today, even if only semi-intact, would be among the hottest streets in the region.

**CleveBill** · November-21-13, 02:39 PM

Originally Posted by MikeyinBrooklyn

Sad as I find it, there are too many Catholic Churches in Detroit [[even after other rounds of closings) relative to the number of parishoners. I worship weekly at Old St. Mary's, but occasionally visit a half dozen others around downtown and environs. I know quite a few people do that [[I see some faces at more than one church). Where possible it would be nice to see physically stable church buildings remain in service to the community in some way, whether as houses of worship, small schools, community centers, businesses. But old churches have expensive maintenance and operation costs. I have a feeling 20 years from now there will be far fewer church structures [[and not just Catholic churches) around town. I would love to be wrong on that.

Mikey, Detroit, like many other aging, heavily Catholic cities suffers from the "you can't closed the church my Grandmother was married in!" syndrome. Folks love to praise the glorious architecture and history of the old city churches -- which they may visit once a year at most -- whilst attending [[and paying thithes to) the sprawling, uninspired mega-churches of the suburbs the live in. A church is a parish, and a parish is a neighborhood. To them I answer: "If you love St. X---'s church so much, why did you abandon the neighborhood thirty years ago?"

**MikeyinBrooklyn** · November-21-13, 03:02 PM

Cleve, I completely agree. The unmanageable cost of keeping the old buildings standing will eventually cause many more to be torn down: the wayward steeple is not the only structural deficiency in a downtown church building. And I understand people's emotional attachment to their ancestral churches. My Mom has stated her desire to have her funeral mass [[note: she's fine and this is not anticipated anytime soon) at the upstate NY church she was baptized and married in, although she hasn't been a parishoner there in 40 years. And I do not begrudge people who stopped going to their old churches and switched to new ones in the suburbs. At the end of the day a church doesn't exist for the architecture. Praying in a cheap, new suburban church is just as holy as praying in a marble and stained glass temple downtown. But I have emotional feelings, colored with nostalgia and love of beautiful old buildings like churches. I hope as many as possible that don't remain active parishes can be repurposed.

**Detroitnerd** · November-21-13, 04:01 PM

Originally Posted by Bham1982

Of all the dumbass urban planning moves in the region, removal of Hastings Street has to be one of the worst. They could have easily routed I-75 a few blocks east, though mostly industrial land.

I bet if Hastings were around today, even if only semi-intact, would be among the hottest streets in the region.

I think it's safe to say that if you and I agree on something, it must be incontrovertible!

I could easily see Hastings Street as a Bourbon Street-style attraction, with entertainment venues, bars, shops and restaurants. Too bad our city fathers used urban freeway construction to advance their agendas.

**WaCoTS** · November-21-13, 04:32 PM

i heard Father Kohn[[?) talking on WDET today about it...theyre confirming its going to take some fundraising to do the needed repairs.

**CleveBill** · November-21-13, 05:43 PM

Originally Posted by MikeyinBrooklyn

, But I have emotional feelings, colored with nostalgia and love of beautiful old buildings like churches. I hope as many as possible that don't remain active parishes can be repurposed.

Mikey, I share your affection for older, urban church buildings. I've seen smaller ones repurposed into galleries, performance spaces, and even a one-room schoolhouse. But the larger ones are, well, too much like churches to be practical to be used as anything else. Of course, one only need look down Jefferson or Woodward to see churches which are still in use, just under a different denomination.

I can see the spire of St. Josephat from my living room window -- I will miss that sight if the steeple is removed.

**DetroitHabitater** · November-21-13, 11:20 PM

Originally Posted by WaCoTS

i heard Father Kohn[[?) talking on WDET today about it...theyre confirming its going to take some fundraising to do the needed repairs.

FYI, Joe Kohn works for the michigan catholic, but is not a priest.

**SaintMe** · November-22-13, 09:11 AM

Drone Cam Visits The Condemned St. Josaphat Steeple, A Familiar Detroit Landmark

From Deadline Detroit . . .

http://www.deadlinedetroit.com/artic...o1wqM.facebook

**SaintMe** · November-22-13, 09:12 AM

Originally Posted by DetroitHabitater

FYI, Joe Kohn works for the michigan catholic, but is not a priest.

Joe Kohn is the Director of Public Relations for the Archdiocese.

**WaCoTS** · November-22-13, 12:36 PM

yeah i wasnt sure if i had the right name

**poobert** · November-22-13, 02:30 PM

Am I overreacting or does this really fucking suck?

I'm not anywhere near Metro Detroit right now but it doesn't sound like there will be anything left when I get back. Between arson, demolition, and weather, all I'm envisioning are some grey strip malls in Warren and some "upscale" subdivisions in Birmfield or whatever place you guys were murdering each other over a week ago.

Do we really not give a shit about our built environment and history that much?

I mean, this thing is a landmark. It's not only iconic but it is part of our shared heritage. There are 1.5 million [[!) Catholics living in Metro Detroit - one out of every three people - and we can't find some way to save this steeple?

What's this shit about a flat roof? That steeple lets me know I'm home. Before people start going off about not saving the grandparents' churches and whatnot, I still live in the old neighborhood and go to the old parish. Both are hanging in there, thank you.

I don't know how to make a website - that's for those schmucaktelli nerds - but if I did I would make one to save, restore, or replicate that steeple. I'll be the first to write a check if I know they're going to fix that fucker.

**townonenorth** · November-23-13, 12:53 AM

Originally Posted by poobert

Am I overreacting or does this really fucking suck?

I'm not anywhere near Metro Detroit right now but it doesn't sound like there will be anything left when I get back. Between arson, demolition, and weather, all I'm envisioning are some grey strip malls in Warren and some "upscale" subdivisions in Birmfield or whatever place you guys were murdering each other over a week ago.

Do we really not give a shit about our built environment and history that much?

I mean, this thing is a landmark. It's not only iconic but it is part of our shared heritage. There are 1.5 million [[!) Catholics living in Metro Detroit - one out of every three people - and we can't find some way to save this steeple?

What's this shit about a flat roof? That steeple lets me know I'm home. Before people start going off about not saving the grandparents' churches and whatnot, I still live in the old neighborhood and go to the old parish. Both are hanging in there, thank you.

I don't know how to make a website - that's for those schmucaktelli nerds - but if I did I would make one to save, restore, or replicate that steeple. I'll be the first to write a check if I know they're going to fix that fucker.

There's no lack of companies that can do this work. It only takes money to do it, and the will to get it done.

I'd be willing to pony up a few bucks, but it's on the church itself for the collection of funds. I'm not just handing money off to someone that purports to represent the interest of St. Josephat. When the time comes, they'll tell us, I'm sure.

**Gistok** · November-23-13, 10:19 AM

Originally Posted by poobert

Am I overreacting or does this really fucking suck?

I'm not anywhere near Metro Detroit right now but it doesn't sound like there will be anything left when I get back. Between arson, demolition, and weather, all I'm envisioning are some grey strip malls in Warren and some "upscale" subdivisions in Birmfield or whatever place you guys were murdering each other over a week ago.

Do we really not give a shit about our built environment and history that much?

I mean, this thing is a landmark. It's not only iconic but it is part of our shared heritage. There are 1.5 million [[!) Catholics living in Metro Detroit - one out of every three people - and we can't find some way to save this steeple?

What's this shit about a flat roof? That steeple lets me know I'm home. Before people start going off about not saving the grandparents' churches and whatnot, I still live in the old neighborhood and go to the old parish. Both are hanging in there, thank you.

I don't know how to make a website - that's for those schmucaktelli nerds - but if I did I would make one to save, restore, or replicate that steeple. I'll be the first to write a check if I know they're going to fix that fucker.

Poobert... as you know, I'm not exactly your friend when it comes to your posting style... but here... I think you're spot on!

Since the steeple is mainly wood framing/timbering and shingles... I do hope we can all get this landmark "that aligns with the RenCen" replaced and fully restored... when we drive down the Chrysler Fwy. Detroit would indeed be a sadder place without this very dominating landmark....

**Scottathew** · November-23-13, 10:48 AM

I noticed a huge crane next to St Josaphat on my way home yesterday...

**jackie5275** · November-23-13, 04:51 PM

Originally Posted by poobert

I mean, this thing is a landmark. It's not only iconic but it is part of our shared heritage. There are 1.5 million [[!) Catholics living in Metro Detroit - one out of every three people - and we can't find some way to save this steeple?

Are you saying everyone in the AOD should kick in to save the steeple? Insurance should cover most of it. After that the parish itself should do the fundraising. There are plenty of churches in the AOD that need major capital improvements. The AOD has funds for this, plus any fundraising can be done by the parishioners. There was no AOD wide appeal to put a new roof on my parish church, St. Thomas Aquinas. We had to raise the funds ourselves.

**poobert** · November-23-13, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by jackie5275

Are you saying everyone in the AOD should kick in to save the steeple? Insurance should cover most of it. After that the parish itself should do the fundraising. There are plenty of churches in the AOD that need major capital improvements. The AOD has funds for this, plus any fundraising can be done by the parishioners. There was no AOD wide appeal to put a new roof on my parish church, St. Thomas Aquinas. We had to raise the funds ourselves.

I'm saying that if worse comes to worse, we the people of the Archdiocese should kick in and save it. I wouldn't trust the Archdiocese as far as I can throw them. They'll probably come in the dead of night, take the windows and statues from the church, and ship them to a megaplex parish in Washington Township.

I know we can't save every old church but given the age and cultural significance [[both Polish and Hastings Street) and status as essentially a minor landmark, this one is worth saving. Relatively speaking, it's pretty well attended, too.

**WaCoTS** · November-25-13, 10:20 AM

on saturday as i was driving 75 N., i noticed there was some sort of temporary patching done on the holes at the base of the steeple...like a couple wooden sections that had been patched over, and what looked like a couple pieces of sheet metal tacked on in another spot.

maybe to keep it from disintegrating as they lift the whole structure off? or maybe theyre going to keep the lowest portion of the steeple instead of just a completely flat cap.

**stromberg2** · November-25-13, 02:00 PM

I drove by today...didn't look bad. But I' m no engineer.

**Vic01** · November-30-13, 05:03 AM

more news soon...
http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2...text|FRONTPAGE

**Huggybear** · November-30-13, 09:05 AM

Originally Posted by poobert

I'm not anywhere near Metro Detroit right now but it doesn't sound like there will be anything left when I get back. Between arson, demolition, and weather, all I'm envisioning are some grey strip malls in Warren and some "upscale" subdivisions in Birmfield or whatever place you guys were murdering each other over a week ago.

Maybe you're out of town on business, but if you've moved out, it's pretty presumptuous to expect that the people left behind are going to preserve things for your return [[or would be able to). Of course, suburbanites have displayed that presumptuousness for decades.

HB

**southofbloor** · November-30-13, 12:20 PM

If the church doesn't want or can't manage the buildings then there are options. This would make great lofts... so would the abandoned schools for that matter. Easy conversion.

http://www.torontolife.com/informer/...enue-unit-309/

**sumas** · December-01-13, 10:03 PM

Originally Posted by southofbloor

If the church doesn't want or can't manage the buildings then there are options. This would make great lofts... so would the abandoned schools for that matter. Easy conversion.

http://www.torontolife.com/informer/...enue-unit-309/

That's gross. Sorry you have little feeling for religion or its icons. I am not Catholic but We will be donating albeit a little to restore a historic building, a beacon of hope to many, part of our skyline. a tradition, our history. Shame on you for wanting to commercial a historic religious structure. Sumas

**Vic01** · December-02-13, 12:19 AM

Originally Posted by sumas

...We will be donating albeit a little to restore a historic building, a beacon of hope to many, part of our skyline. a tradition, our history... Sumas

For any else that would like to help out -
The parish that operates St. Josaphat Roman Catholic Church is putting out an SOS — Save Our Steeple.

Despite projected costs that church officials acknowledge would put repair of the wind-damaged structure beyond their reach, the parish is launching a fund-raising campaign to do just that. An 8-foot by 20-foot sign promoting the Save Our Steeple campaign should be in place on the side of the church facing I-75 this week.
Kevin Piotrowski, parish council president, said the outpouring of concern from people across the region who want to save the iconic 112-year-old piece of Detroit’s skyline convinced church officials to try to raise money to save the structure.

http://www.freep.com/article/2013120...teeple-Detroit