Wayne State University is one of the most embarrassing aspects of Detroit.

**noise** · September-25-13, 03:02 PM

Originally Posted by C_S_14

"Root issues" are an unethical and greedy university letting in easy marks, i.e., students from low income and low education backgrounds, knowing damn well they aren't ready for and can't compete in a university setting.

The quality of DPS has nothing to do with Wayne State University. Doesn't matter where a student is from, if they're not ready for a university you don't let thousands in and take out loans that are 3x and 4x as much as community college. Raising tuition 8.9% further illustrates that they have no issue taking advantage of their desperate surroundings.

Repeating false beliefs while ignoring facts isn't helping your trolling. You'll need a new username if you keep this up.

C_S_14 · September-25-13, 03:45 PM

Originally Posted by noise

Actually, that's not at all what I asked for. I don't think admissions numbers is the same thing as admissions policy, which is what you stated. I was hoping for a comparison of WSU's admissions policies vs. peer institution's policies. Otherwise, we're just posting numbers with no analysis. And as mentioned, that seems to be your MO.

I believe their low graduation rate is due to a large number of things. Primarily, their location and mission. Poor public schools with inflated numbers. A number of students never interested in a degree. Additionally, the same exact things every other school doesn't reach 100%, perhaps magnified. I have a difficult time faulting the University for these things.

I'm still confused by your hostility when repeatedly asking for root causes, but maybe that's because I'm erroneously giving you the benefit of doubt when it comes to potential trolling.

Wayne's mission is magnifying the amount they'll screw out of students who are becoming indebted for college classes that provide zero economic return. Their graduation gap is magnified. Their tuition increases are magnified. Those are the differences. Wayne is a brick and mortar version of U of Phoenix.

**noise** · September-25-13, 03:58 PM

Originally Posted by C_S_14

Wayne's mission is magnifying the amount they'll screw out of students who are becoming indebted for college classes that provide zero economic return. Their graduation gap is magnified. Their tuition increases are magnified. Those are the differences. Wayne is a brick and mortar version of U of Phoenix.

"...in Fantasy Land."

**Spartan** · September-25-13, 04:18 PM

Originally Posted by C_S_14

Wayne's mission is magnifying the amount they'll screw out of students who are becoming indebted for college classes that provide zero economic return. Their graduation gap is magnified. Their tuition increases are magnified. Those are the differences. Wayne is a brick and mortar version of U of Phoenix.

The University of Phoenix [[UOPX) is an Americanfor-profitinstitution of higher learning

**sumas** · September-25-13, 04:40 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

48009... that is you, isn't it dearie??

Any first time poster with half a brain wouldn't leave such a spiteful first post, so it is her...

1) It has all the condescending hallmarks of her...
2) It mentions Chicago as first alternate...
3) It also mentions the same erroneous $400 credit hour figure for WSU.
4) Does the same spiel about thousands of students [[especially fellow black students) who shouldn't be in college in the first place.
5) Detestfully ridicules Detroit.

Alright 48009... we're much smarter here that you give us credit for... and it shows just how not so smart you are.

So do us all a favor 48009... F#%$ Off and leave us alone!

When I saw the title, I avoided opening it. My husband, did and told me about your post. I suspected same without even reading her latest vitriol. I won't be reading this thread at all. My time is too precious to waste on trolls. Actually I pity her.

**noise** · September-25-13, 05:23 PM

Originally Posted by sumas

When I saw the title, I avoided opening it. My husband, did and told me about your post. I suspected same without even reading her latest vitriol. I won't be reading this thread at all. My time is too precious to waste on trolls. Actually I pity her.

For what it's worth, 48009's "her" is most likely a white middle-age suburban male with deep-seated racial prejudice. The type that typically makes identical posts on newspaper websites.

C_S_14 · September-26-13, 07:26 AM

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2...xt%7CFRONTPAGE

Scam.

**gnome** · September-26-13, 07:28 AM

Alright, you win. Wsu sucks.

now, will you go away?

**noise** · September-26-13, 07:45 AM

"Because I said so!"

**KOMPOST** · September-26-13, 07:50 AM

Ending a thread title with a period is one of the most embarrassing aspects of DetroitYes.
Period.

**rex** · September-26-13, 08:35 AM

IDK if it was because construction or work was being done but my first memory of WSU was from maybe 97 and there was a fence seperating the university the neighborhood at Warren rd. The apartment buildings on the south side of Warren across from WSU were all bombed out. I a car stolen right up the street from WSU. Attended for a semester, didn't like it much

**motz** · September-26-13, 08:42 AM

I like how every time certain subjects come up and I ask a very valid question, such as "Why haven't you addressed the root cause, WSU's biggest feeder DPS?", the person who started the thread and their supporters absolutely refuse to answer it.

WSU is offering a chance to students who wouldn't be accepted by any university other than a local community college. This is part of their purpose, to give these students a chance at a REAL education that might help them lift themselves above what they were raised in. Unfortunately, lots of them are ill equipped and don't know where to turn to help them continue to progress towards their degree. I will say that from what I've seen, WSU could use some employees who help these potential dropouts continue their education, but what needs to change is the K-12 schools that are supposed to prepare these kids for higher education. Without that, its fighting a losing battle.

C_S_14 · September-26-13, 09:00 AM

Originally Posted by motz

I like how every time certain subjects come up and I ask a very valid question, such as "Why haven't you addressed the root cause, WSU's biggest feeder DPS?", the person who started the thread and their supporters absolutely refuse to answer it.

WSU is offering a chance to students who wouldn't be accepted by any university other than a local community college. This is part of their purpose, to give these students a chance at a REAL education that might help them lift themselves above what they were raised in. Unfortunately, lots of them are ill equipped and don't know where to turn to help them continue to progress towards their degree. I will say that from what I've seen, WSU could use some employees who help these potential dropouts continue their education, but what needs to change is the K-12 schools that are supposed to prepare these kids for higher education. Without that, its fighting a losing battle.

"Offering them a chance"? There is nothing noble about ROBBING students that shouldn't be in a university, that they KNOW will never graduate with a degree.

It's right in the article I posted; they're ROBBING illiterate Detroiters to fund research and other overhead. You guys are fools for cheer leading this scam. Remedial classwork at $400 a credit hour is a SCAM. They know these illiterate students don't belong in a university, yet they let them in by the thousands so they can STEAL millions of dollars.

C_S_14 · September-26-13, 09:08 AM

Originally Posted by motz

I like how every time certain subjects come up and I ask a very valid question, such as "Why haven't you addressed the root cause, WSU's biggest feeder DPS?"

This thread is about Wayne, not DPS. If students are unprepared coming out of DPS they should go to Wayne CC where classes are a 1/3 or 1/2 of what Wayne State charges. Letting unprepared students enroll in high-priced university courses and rack up monstrous student loan debt, and then kicking them to the curb because their loans are tapped out further destroys the community. Student loan debt is with these poor souls FOREVER. 12 in 13 blacks that go to Wayne receive no economic return on that monstrous debt. How can you pay back $40,000 in student loans when you don't have a college degree? They leave WSU with ruined credit and are [[still) only qualified for a minimum wage job. And you guys are O.K. with that? Wow.

**noise** · September-26-13, 09:45 AM

Originally Posted by motz

I like how every time certain subjects come up and I ask a very valid question, such as "Why haven't you addressed the root cause, WSU's biggest feeder DPS?", the person who started the thread and their supporters absolutely refuse to answer it.

WSU is offering a chance to students who wouldn't be accepted by any university other than a local community college. This is part of their purpose, to give these students a chance at a REAL education that might help them lift themselves above what they were raised in. Unfortunately, lots of them are ill equipped and don't know where to turn to help them continue to progress towards their degree. I will say that from what I've seen, WSU could use some employees who help these potential dropouts continue their education, but what needs to change is the K-12 schools that are supposed to prepare these kids for higher education. Without that, its fighting a losing battle.

Primarily because asking about root causes destroys the potential trolling. You have to remember, there are always going to be posters here that are not interested in an honest, logical discussion. They either have deep-seated and downright ignorant biases that they're not interested in correcting or they're simply getting their kicks out of being inflammatory. It's a tired shtick, but apparently a way to kill some time.

**noise** · September-26-13, 09:52 AM

Also, how many black female grad students do you know named "Robert"?

**NoHeartAnthony** · September-26-13, 10:47 AM

There are many factors at play.

Wayne State's admission standards are a little too lax.
- but the DPS students, given their background, isn't it on the city's public colleges/universities to provide a place?

Financial Aid driving up the college cost
- offer less financial aid, put the free market at play, and lower tuition rates
- but then many students, the core that WSU pulls from, can't afford tuition
- which then lowers enrollment

Incomplete information from the Enrollment office
- when admitted to the university, are there people saying "you know, this might not be a good decision for you at this point?"
- I understand the optimism that allows prospective students to dream of getting a degree, but a little bit of honesty, mixed with giving students better options

C_S_14 · September-26-13, 11:32 AM

Originally Posted by NoHeartAnthony

"you know, this might not be a good decision for you at this point?"

Ha! They'd be fired immediately.

**rb336** · September-26-13, 11:43 AM

Originally Posted by C_S_14

This thread is about Wayne, not DPS. If students are unprepared coming out of DPS they should go to Wayne CC where classes are a 1/3 or 1/2 of what Wayne State charges. Letting unprepared students enroll in high-priced university courses and rack up monstrous student loan debt, and then kicking them to the curb because their loans are tapped out further destroys the community. Student loan debt is with these poor souls FOREVER. 12 in 13 blacks that go to Wayne receive no economic return on that monstrous debt. How can you pay back $40,000 in student loans when you don't have a college degree? They leave WSU with ruined credit and are [[still) only qualified for a minimum wage job. And you guys are O.K. with that? Wow.

Yes, students requiring remedial reading and math education SHOULD go to WC3, and WSU should stop letting them in. However, if you get $40k in debt at WSU without getting a diploma, the problem isn't WSU, it's that you are an idiot

**motz** · September-26-13, 12:00 PM

Originally Posted by C_S_14

This thread is about Wayne, not DPS. If students are unprepared coming out of DPS they should go to Wayne CC where classes are a 1/3 or 1/2 of what Wayne State charges. Letting unprepared students enroll in high-priced university courses and rack up monstrous student loan debt, and then kicking them to the curb because their loans are tapped out further destroys the community. Student loan debt is with these poor souls FOREVER. 12 in 13 blacks that go to Wayne receive no economic return on that monstrous debt. How can you pay back $40,000 in student loans when you don't have a college degree? They leave WSU with ruined credit and are [[still) only qualified for a minimum wage job. And you guys are O.K. with that? Wow.

This thread is throwing around accusations that a university is actively robbing their students, which I personally think is complete bullshit. Your arguments are saying that BLACK STUDENTS [[which you've thrown around a lot) are being robbed, 12 of 13 of them or whatever, because WSU just wants their money. Do you think these kids are going to WSU because they want to spend money? No, they want a degree. WSU offers them a chance at a degree. The problem is that DPS does not prepare them, nor do they advise them that the less debt-focused approach is complete 1-2 years at WC3 and then transfer to WSU once you're confident in your decision of a major. I come from a highly regarded suburban school district and many of us who were very undecided about what to do were advised to go to OCC for 1-2 years, research and try some new things and find what fits before moving on to a WSU/OU/Etc. DPS fails to offer these kids the same resources and the same advice offered to those enrolled in non-urban school districts. DPS is just as much to blame for making these kids think they are ready for the big leagues after only giving them Expedition League training.

C_S_14 · September-26-13, 12:20 PM

Originally Posted by motz

This thread is throwing around accusations that a university is actively robbing their students, which I personally think is complete bullshit. Your arguments are saying that BLACK STUDENTS [[which you've thrown around a lot) are being robbed, 12 of 13 of them or whatever, because WSU just wants their money. Do you think these kids are going to WSU because they want to spend money? No, they want a degree. WSU offers them a chance at a degree. The problem is that DPS does not prepare them, nor do they advise them that the less debt-focused approach is complete 1-2 years at WC3 and then transfer to WSU once you're confident in your decision of a major. I come from a highly regarded suburban school district and many of us who were very undecided about what to do were advised to go to OCC for 1-2 years, research and try some new things and find what fits before moving on to a WSU/OU/Etc. DPS fails to offer these kids the same resources and the same advice offered to those enrolled in non-urban school districts. DPS is just as much to blame for making these kids think they are ready for the big leagues after only giving them Expedition League training.

The 1 in 13 stat was referenced because it is the saddest, not because I was yearning to drop a black stat [[perhaps you're fixated on race, I am not). For all students, only 1 in 10 graduate over 4 years, 1 in 5 over 6 years. The school is run by unethical gangsters who are robbing thousands of helpless Detroiters.

C_S_14 · September-26-13, 12:22 PM

WSU offers them a chance at a degree.

No it doesn't. 12 in 13 aren't getting one in SIX years. The University KNOWS these students can't fulfill degree requirements AND LETS THEM IN ANYWAYS. Why? Because they don't have a problem ROBBING students of thousands of dollars.

**Det_ard** · September-26-13, 12:53 PM

You folks who are defending WSU on this have a point, but so does CS14 despite the "trollishness" you may perceive. I think you have to admit it.

Most universities are fighting for students these days. Some do let in unprepared students not just because of an "urban mission", but because they need the money to balance the budget. This is a high-stakes game for the U. I've read of admissions deans being let go because the college's yield estimate was too high this year. They thought say, 40% of the admitted students would enroll but only 35% did which results in a big budget problem.

Don't blindly dismiss this at WSU, it's a problem for all less selective colleges.

C_S_14 · September-26-13, 01:23 PM

Originally Posted by Det_ard

You folks who are defending WSU on this have a point, but so does CS14

No, they don't. They're either affiliated with the university in some way, the type to take offense to anyone saying anything bad about Detroit, or simply pull the faithful race card. It's criminal what this university is getting away with and you need your head examined if you think it's O.K.

**canuck** · September-26-13, 01:33 PM

Originally Posted by C_S_14

No, they don't. They're either affiliated with the university in some way, the type to take offense to anyone saying anything bad about Detroit, or simply pull the faithful race card. It's criminal what this university is getting away with and you need your head examined if you think it's O.K.

Since you feel so strongly about it, I suspect you may be affiliated with it in some way. Did you take it up with the U's faculty or administration?