"How Detroit Went Broke"

[sirrealone]

I was surprised by the facts when I read the article and saw that he had the most balanced budget. But, the whole time I was reading about him and how he wasn't to blame, I couldn't help but think "Imagine if he had kept the books balanced, but worked a little harder at keeping people and businesses in the city."

CAY succeeded in that he was able to keep the books balanced during a time when people and businesses were marching out of the city at a rapid rate.

Where he failed is that he was the one holding open the door, so to speak.

His attitude was "Go ahead and leave. We'll make it without you." And under his regime, that held true. But, that wasn't sustainable. You can only go to the 'raise taxes' well and the 'cut services' well so many times. That the well didn't run dry 'under his watch' doesn't make it any less real that most of the water was drained from the well under his watch.

He kicked the can. He did a very good job at it. But, when it's all said and done, he did not leave the city with a foundation of success. So, there's blame there.

[Wesley Mouch]

...snip...
And speaking of corporate give-aways, how many people are opposing the give-away to Illitch for his new arena?

I'm opposed to corporate give-aways like this overall. I'm in favor of this give-away since I think the sports teams playing downtown is very valuable and these give-aways are universal. Its necessary bad public policy.

btw, I'm no expert, but I believe the monies are all loans, not gifts. Is this not essentially the case w/ our hockey arena and ballpark?

[maverick1]

I don't understand why they were showing the cities debt with inflation back in the 50's. they adjusted the debt in today's dollar, making it look larger than what it was back then. It was like they were trying to do it to make Coleman Young look better.

What were they supposed to do? $1.00 in the 1950s does not hold the same value as $1.00 in 2013. It has nothing to do with making Coleman Young look better. It was done to make an apples to apples comparison.

[jackie5275]

I was surprised by the facts when I read the article and saw that he had the most balanced budget. But, the whole time I was reading about him and how he wasn't to blame, I couldn't help but think "Imagine if he had kept the books balanced, but worked a little harder at keeping people and businesses in the city."

CAY succeeded in that he was able to keep the books balanced during a time when people and businesses were marching out of the city at a rapid rate.

Where he failed is that he was the one holding open the door, so to speak.

His attitude was "Go ahead and leave. We'll make it without you." And under his regime, that held true. But, that wasn't sustainable. You can only go to the 'raise taxes' well and the 'cut services' well so many times. That the well didn't run dry 'under his watch' doesn't make it any less real that most of the water was drained from the well under his watch.

He kicked the can. He did a very good job at it. But, when it's all said and done, he did not leave the city with a foundation of success. So, there's blame there.

Bingo!!!! That's the way I see it.

[48009]

His attitude was "Go ahead and leave. We'll make it without you." And under his regime, that held true. But, that wasn't sustainable.

Why wasn't it sustainable? Why exactly couldn't a city of 1.5 million people "make do"? DC is a city of town similar in size [[600k), with a black majority. You know what's been happening lately? Crime is dropping, property values increasing, the most educated workforce in the nation.

http://articles.washingtonpost.com/2...-and-education

There's your template Detroit: displace the culture problem and the city immediately improves.

[sirrealone]

Why wasn't it sustainable? Why exactly couldn't a city of 1.5 million people "make do"?

If the population showed signs of leveling off at 1.5 million, then it would have been sustainable. But, the population was on a steady decline, which leads back to my point that he should have put more effort into trying to level that off rather than hold the door open and essentially say 'Good riddance'.

[jerrytimes]

What were they supposed to do? $1.00 in the 1950s does not hold the same value as $1.00 in 2013. It has nothing to do with making Coleman Young look better. It was done to make an apples to apples comparison.

I know, it just makes it appear that the deficit was 3B in the 50's and it wasn't. I've just never seen an article before that adjusted the debt for inflation.

[313WX]

I've just never seen an article before that adjusted the debt for inflation.

You haven't been reading the right publications.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

I was surprised by the facts when I read the article and saw that he had the most balanced budget. But, the whole time I was reading about him and how he wasn't to blame, I couldn't help but think "Imagine if he had kept the books balanced, but worked a little harder at keeping people and businesses in the city."

CAY succeeded in that he was able to keep the books balanced during a time when people and businesses were marching out of the city at a rapid rate.

Where he failed is that he was the one holding open the door, so to speak.

His attitude was "Go ahead and leave. We'll make it without you." And under his regime, that held true. But, that wasn't sustainable. You can only go to the 'raise taxes' well and the 'cut services' well so many times. That the well didn't run dry 'under his watch' doesn't make it any less real that most of the water was drained from the well under his watch.

He kicked the can. He did a very good job at it. But, when it's all said and done, he did not leave the city with a foundation of success. So, there's blame there.

When you realize the turbulent times Young grew up in, I understand why he was on the defensive and did and said certain things. Being black in the 40's and 50's, and 60's and dealing with constant racism was no picnic, and especially so for a young black man vying for a career in politics. He was divisive, but no more than other politicians ex.. L Brooks Patterson who always maintained a arms length relationship with Detroit and throws it under the bus, every chance he gets..

[professorscott]

I don't understand blaming the late Mayor Young, who was a great man, for the population exodus which began 20 years before his first term and continues, unabated and accelerated, 20 years after his last. The biggest percentage decline in Detroit's population was in the 2000s, when the City lost 25% of its population in a single decade; and if I recall correctly, Mayor Young was dead the entire time and therefore can't be blamed for that.

It is also incorrect that he "held the door open" so people could leave. In fact he had excellent relationships with most of the region's important businesspeople. The only people he specifically told to leave the City were "thugs", famously telling them to "hit Eight Mile Road".

In the 1970s there was a combination of things that led to the loss of population in Detroit. Forced busing gave many white Detroiters a reason to leave. [[It might do to point out here that the Professor, so far as he knows, is entirely European American except for a little bit of Native Canadian.) The insidious real estate practice of blockbusting, coupled with the well known insurance practice of redlining, did much harm. The expressways, recently completed then, made it easy to live outside Detroit and work in the City, and the lack of really great urban transit took away the reason many people in other cities chose not to leave.

Taxes were higher in the City than in the surrounding communities, so many people chose to live outside Detroit simply to save money or to be able to afford a nicer house.

Coleman A. Young was not a saint, but he was an effective Mayor of Detroit. You might be able to give him a tiny part of the blame but in all my years in Detroit, of all the hundreds of people I met and personally spoke with who had once lived in Detroit but had left for the suburbs, not a single one ever indicated the reason they left was, or had anything to do with, Mayor Young. [[And as you know, people who left were usually pretty candid about why.)

[Wesley Mouch]

...It is also incorrect that he "held the door open" so people could leave. In fact he had excellent relationships with most of the region's important businesspeople. The only people he specifically told to leave the City were "thugs", famously telling them to "hit Eight Mile Road"....

Professor, it isn't correct. It isn't incorrect. Its not a matter of fact. Its a matter of opinion.

I liked CAY. I also think he did 'hold the door open'.

You're right that he had great relationships with many important businesspeople. He wouldn't give the time of day to others. Like Lyndon Johnson he was a great politician. And also a great son of a bitch. He knew who to keep happy. He spent less time taking care of small businesspeople. Especially those of the wrong color. He set the tone for much of what we've lived with in our city council.

I believe that if he'd healed Detroit's racial wounds instead of inflamed them, we'd be living in a different place.

May the great man rest in peace.

[sumas]

I agree CAY was an impressive person. The first time I could vote I voted for him. However he did seriously open the door for white flight. I honestly believe he was trying to equalize the playing field but???

A few examples, the Jefferson branch library, in a mostly white neighborhood got pretty much closed down. A study was done and paid for regarding library usage, Jefferson came out on the top and CAY said FY whities I'll close it to next to nothing in hours and services. Shut down pretty much all our rec services, Heilman and Balduck would be good examples in white neighborhoods etc. I can appreciate that he was trying to balance inequitable services between black and white community services but oh yeah he did contribute to white flight.

[Hermod]

Why wasn't it sustainable? Why exactly couldn't a city of 1.5 million people "make do"? DC is a city of town similar in size [[600k), with a black majority. You know what's been happening lately? Crime is dropping, property values increasing, the most educated workforce in the nation.

Every time DC gets in a whole, Uncle Sugar bails them out. I am not sure they could do it today because of charges of racism, but in the past when DC corruption got out of hand, Congress just eliminated home rule and put an appointed US gummint official in charge. After a couple of decades, they would get pushed to restore home rule.

[iheartthed]

I believe that if he'd healed Detroit's racial wounds instead of inflamed them, we'd be living in a different place.

How could he alone have healed Detroit's racial wounds? And how did he alone inflame them? You could argue that his words were constantly, and intentionally, misinterpreted in order to undermine him and to attract city dwelling white families out of the city. His "hit 8 Mile Road" comments was a blatant example. It was selectively parsed and constantly referenced in the local media without clarification until very recently.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

I agree CAY was an impressive person. The first time I could vote I voted for him. However he did seriously open the door for white flight. I honestly believe he was trying to equalize the playing field but???

A few examples, the Jefferson branch library, in a mostly white neighborhood got pretty much closed down. A study was done and paid for regarding library usage, Jefferson came out on the top and CAY said FY whities I'll close it to next to nothing in hours and services. Shut down pretty much all our rec services, Heilman and Balduck would be good examples in white neighborhoods etc. I can appreciate that he was trying to balance inequitable services between black and white community services but oh yeah he did contribute to white flight.

They were going to leave anyway. Detroit was getting "too black". And his reference for criminals to "Hit the Eight Mile Road" was for all criminals, black or white. As usual, the media had helped perpetuate that as him telling whites to leave the city.

[Wesley Mouch]

How could he alone have healed Detroit's racial wounds? And how did he alone inflame them? You could argue that his words were constantly, and intentionally, misinterpreted in order to undermine him and to attract city dwelling white families out of the city. His "hit 8 Mile Road" comments was a blatant example. It was selectively parsed and constantly referenced in the local media without clarification until very recently.

ihtd... I did not say that he alone could have healed Detroit's racial wounds. But he could have used his formidable influence better, IMO.

His goal was to help blacks in Detroit. I respect his motives. Yet I feel that his actions ultimately caused more harm than good.

A Coleman who truly changed the dialog between blacks and whites was possible. Instead he inflamed tensions.

His attitude and actions were understandable. He was a victim of racism. He saw racism everywhere. And he acted to correct the injustice. Combined with the new city charter that granted him great power, he turned a bureaucracy into a kingdom intent on racial justice. I believe his mistake was changing the focus of city hall from administration to social justice. SJ surely was needed. Letting the administration become his court where loyalty and race were more valuable than competence caused us much long-term harm. He killed the white political machine and replaced it with his own. And he killed city hall's competence in the process.

Many of our problems stem from this mistake.

The media surely has distorted him relentlessly. But I don't accept that he was friendly to whites but just misinterpreted. That's not what I experienced.

[sumas]

Interesting commentary.