Orr is looking at out of state influence to change Detroit's city charter.

[brizee]

I still don't get it. Maybe I'm just dumb. Even if ALEC drafted the whole list of ideas, Detroiters would still have to debate and approve any changes. We take what we like, we reject what we don't like.

Plus, I think it's counterproductive to focus on WHOSE idea and WHOSE proposal it is. Why no focus on the idea itself on its own merits? Novine and I don't agree on most anything but when he/she explained the actuarial challenges of a closed pension system vs an open system, my reaction was "Hm. That's an interesting point...one that begs further discussion."

I don't care if the idea comes from Rick Snyder or Diane Bukowski. Lets understand them, deliberate them, and keep improving them.

The messenger absolutely does matter.

I give credit where it's due. Snyder delivered an RTA after two generations. Congrats.

But the man has shown himself to be untrustworthy. He intentionally works in ways so that his actions can't be FOIA'd or subpoenad in court. He's always trying something slick, seen

A. Here

B. Here

C. And here

Considering all angles is fine. Blindly accepting anything from someone who has shown themselves to more often than not, not work in good faith, is...cmon man.

To paraphrase Chris Rock[[someone I have my own problems with) ALEC/Snyder/GOP/the tea party might just be offering a full ride to a top notch college. They also molested you as a kid so you'll have to forgive the suspicion.

[motz]

What does this have to do with Orr undoing the city charter that was just adopted by city voters? If the city charter was 50 years old and never had been revised, that would be one thing. But voters went through the process of electing a charter commission, holding public hearings and adopting a new charter. Now Orr wants to trash it because he doesn't like certain portions of it. Again, if I was a city voter, I would ask "why bother?"

So Orr consulting firms outside of Detroit, trying to find where government can be better run and perform better for its clients, the citizens, and then having those citizens vote on any revisions is Terrible Hitler Fascist Communism? I'm really confused. It says right in the article that voters would have input and would vote on anything he proposes. It doesn't say he's going to "dismantle" the charter, it doesn't say he's going to do anything more than try and find the best ways for Detroit to be run going forward with citizen input, and then allow the citizens to vote on whether they think that is the best way to run their city.

[corktownyuppie]

Considering all angles is fine. Blindly accepting anything from someone who has shown themselves to more often than not, not work in good faith, is...cmon man.

To paraphrase Chris Rock[[someone I have my own problems with) ALEC/Snyder/GOP/the tea party might just be offering a full ride to a top notch college. They also molested you as a kid so you'll have to forgive the suspicion.

I can't speak for Orr or anyone else, but I agree with you that no one should be blindly accepting anything from anyone. And I can agree about the suspicion regarding the child molestor...but I would still take the money in the end.

[Wesley Mouch]

So Orr consulting firms outside of Detroit, trying to find where government can be better run and perform better for its clients, the citizens, and then having those citizens vote on any revisions is Terrible Hitler Fascist Communism? I'm really confused. It says right in the article that voters would have input and would vote on anything he proposes. It doesn't say he's going to "dismantle" the charter, it doesn't say he's going to do anything more than try and find the best ways for Detroit to be run going forward with citizen input, and then allow the citizens to vote on whether they think that is the best way to run their city.

motz: Some think anything done by anyone from the outside is 'Terrible Hitler Fascist Communism'. I do hope people can begin judging people by their current actions -- not their past actions or affiliations.

Orr is a Obama Democrat. I find it funny that he's immediately lumped in with Tea Party because he's successful and he's doing his best to protect pensioners and save our fine city.

[gnome]

Find the best people/firms who can help us get out of this mess.

[compn]

you expect the city of detroit, the city that elected kwame kilpatrick, dave bing, and reelected city council, to elect better leaders this time ?
what makes you think the voters of this city have changed their voting ways?

its funny people talk about orr, like its orr's idea of how to run the city.
snyder hired orr to do snyder's bidding. i guarentee you that kevin orr, if he is coming up with his own ideas, has to run them past snyder first. detroit does not have a black EFM. detroit has a white efm. kevin orr is just the public relations.

it aint orr undoing some charter.
its snyder.

snyder did the consent agreement with bing and the council.
the michigan constitution stopped the real negotiating and contract-breaking power.
he tried to do an end-run around that with public act 4
which was then voted on and repealed.
then did another end run around the voters of michigan with the new efm law.

after all that work, you think snyder is just going to hire someone to run the city?
hell no! detroit is snyder's city.

[Hypestyles]

we'll see what happens-- too bad that moves can't be made state-wide to allow for more city/county government consolidation-- Detroit needs pragmatic regionalism, asap--

[Wesley Mouch]

you expect the city of detroit, the city that elected kwame kilpatrick, dave bing, and reelected city council, to elect better leaders this time ?
what makes you think the voters of this city have changed their voting ways?

its funny people talk about orr, like its orr's idea of how to run the city.
snyder hired orr to do snyder's bidding. i guarentee you that kevin orr, if he is coming up with his own ideas, has to run them past snyder first. detroit does not have a black EFM. detroit has a white efm. kevin orr is just the public relations.

it aint orr undoing some charter.
its snyder.

snyder did the consent agreement with bing and the council.
the michigan constitution stopped the real negotiating and contract-breaking power.
he tried to do an end-run around that with public act 4
which was then voted on and repealed.
then did another end run around the voters of michigan with the new efm law.

after all that work, you think snyder is just going to hire someone to run the city?
hell no! detroit is snyder's city.

OK, I accept your basic premise.

But why? What possible reason does Snyder have for wanting to deal with the financial mess, stinking political disaster that is Detroit? Why would he spend his time on this?

That's where your theory falls apart. If its a conspiracy, what are they conspiring to do?

[compn]

i have no idea of his motives or the future of detroit.
i made that theory based on the facts and history.

Posted: 03/20/2012
[[WXYZ) - Michigan Governor Rick Snyder has launched a Detroit Can't Wait webpage as part of the state's official website.

http://www.wxyz.com/dpp/news/region/...t-wait-webpage
obviously this was in motion for a few years now.
http://www.michigan.gov/detroitcantwait

what was snyders motive for right to work? to break the unions?
what is snyders motive for breaking collective bargaining contracts in detroit? might it be ... more union busting?

http://www.annarbor.com/business-rev...k-snyder-says/

"All the proposals that have gone before are all flawed in some fundamental fashion," Snyder said. "Let’s get a solution that’s going to work for 10 or 20 years.

how long was new york city run by the state financial board? 25+ years?

you dont think 'governor who saved detroit' is a good enough motive?

[firstandten]

While I am not happy that Snyder signed RTW, and broke collective bargaining contracts I believed he did it in order to survive and get his agenda thru his own party. With the Repubs controlling both branches of state government, if he wanted to save his political hide he had to give his party some of what they wanted. I think Snyder as a Repub views himself more as a William Milliken, George Romney style Repub and less as a John Engler type. However that becomes hard when your party controls both levels of state government and within that party who have some serious right wing folks.