George zimmerman.....not guilty!

[Papasito]

Busted!

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2013...left-activist/



The world has enough problems. We don't need to make up fake racism.

[rb336]

Busted!

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2013...left-activist/



The world has enough problems. We don't need to make up fake racism.

She wasn't "making up fake racism" she was making a sarcastic point.

[Papasito]

She wasn't "making up fake racism" she was making a sarcastic point.

Maybe so, but pictures of her have circulated the GLOBE. The rest of the world doesn't "get" her point, they just think Americans are a bunch of anti black racists because that's the image people like her give to them.

Meanwhile, they [[other countries) are dropping rocks on people's heads and brutalizing their people, while laughing at us pointing at ourselves.

And what a bunch of racists we are. According to the NAACP and the Administration, a mixed Hispanic is now known as "white" according to their standards. The Hispanic side doesn't count according to the Zimmerman standard!
So I told my half Mexican kids that according to the Government they are all white today. I'm sure mom will appreciate that.

In the meantime, TM's Mom is trying to make news:
http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/26/justic...-martin-mother

Florida law kept George Zimmerman from being held accountable in last year's shooting death of Florida teenager Trayvon Martin, the teen's mom said Friday.
"Wrap your mind around no prom for Trayvon, no high school graduation for Trayvon ... all because of a law -- a law that has prevented the person who shot and killed my son" from paying "for this awful crime," Sybrina Fulton said Friday afternoon at the National Urban League Conference in Philadelphia.

What is this? Where the hell was she when Treyvon was sucking down Lean and doing drugs? Bad parenting doesn't help when it's after the fact.

[Downtown Lady]

Good God Papasito -- the woman's son was murdered, and now you want to attack her. Please exhibit some decency and leave her the f*ck alone. Regardless of your views on this case, could you please have some compassion for a woman whose son was killed?

[Papasito]

As a parent of course I am compassionate, but if I put myself in her shoes I would feel guilt over the loss of my son.... And my son happens to be a 17 year old minority teen who has never been kicked out of school, never done drugs and never drank lean. If he did, I would have to take some of the blame for it. At 17 years old, he was a minor, and the responsibility of his parents, just as my son is.

And don't give me that crap about how he might be in a more depressed area or how my kid might have a better situation than his. It's B.S. There are tons of drugs and dropouts where my kids go to school. It's personal choice and parenting that make the difference.

Besides, she put herself back in the media...

If you can show me NO ONE gets shot in a State that doesn't have a stand your ground law, and every victim lives, then I will be a believer in repealing it. It's a SELF DEFENSE law. Repealing it would cause harm to VICTIMS in most situations. It's a tragic situation that happened but the race baiters are still trying to force division between the people.

And now we have jurors coming out and saying things to stir things up. If they felt the way they are talking, they should have gave a different verdict. Now they are just stirring up trouble.

I am also let down by our leadership straight from the top. For the first time in history we get an African American President who could have brought an era of post-racism, and everything out of his mouth about this situation has been inflammatory. Sad. He could have been a truly historic President.

[Downtown Lady]

OK, I understand Papasito...some people are just not capable of taking a kind-hearted approach to things. Got it.

[firstandten]

Its more than just a self defense law its a law that lets you stand your ground while giving lip service to self defense. Case in point two examples both in Florida 1. On a basketball court two guys are arguing violently both are in each others face. It looks like a fight will break out so one guy does a preemptive strike and hits the victim. Unfortunately he kills him with one punch. He tells the police he was fearful because he thought the victim was going to attack him. He gets off SYG. Example 2 another basketball court again, argument breaks out victim runs to car to get gun, perp goes and gets his and they start shooting at each other from a distance of at least 30 feet from each other. Perp kills victim. Wasn't even arrested SYG. Florida is just littered with these types of cases that stretches the concept of self-defense to its absolute limit

[Papasito]

This attitude taken away from the Zimmerman trial [[according to the media and the NAACP and Eric Holder) saying [[assuming) it's ok to now kill a black teenager because of the stand your ground law is rediculous.

Did you think that because of the Casey Anthony trial it's ok to kill your kids?
Or because of the OJ trial it's ok to kill your x wife?

We all know that Zimmerman and Treyvon were both at fault for the confrontation and the ultimate result, but why continue and press on with a modern day lynching of a man who was judged not guilty in a court of law?

Stand your ground wasn't even the defense in this case. Self defense was. Eric Holder was saying that he wants to see a clause put in self defense laws stating you MUST make a "reasonable effort to flee" prior to the use of any deadly force. So what? So you can get shot or stabbed in the back in your own home or neighborhood while trying to run from it?
They Treyvon case isn't the best example of Stand your Ground and self-defense laws in action.

And what's going to happen if they ban Stand your Ground in the 15 States that it is the law? Are deaths going to end?
Drive by shootings are illegal, yet little kids and elderly are caught in the crossfire every day. Gang violence is illegal, yet people die from it every day.

I don't see any mass demonstrations and relentless media coverage every time a five year old minority is shot dead in their own front yard from a drive by.

Try to channel your anger and envy into something productive. Such traits are self-destructive. You’re ranting all over creation – everything from gated communities to social services and wage levels.I can almost feel your self-inflicted pain, but that’s precisely what it is – self-inflicted. Instead of ranting, do something about what makes you so angry and envious. If you don’t know how to go about that, seek out those who can put you on the path to correcting at least one of the many things that you find wrong and unfair about life not only in Florida but in general.

[coracle]

When you are trapped against the ground by a bigger person sitting on top beating the crap out of you, what is a "reasonable effort to flee"?

[Zacha341]

Stand Your Ground in the context of the Zimmerman/ Martin case will be debated for years.

The reality and context of 'reasonable' flight where possible will vary, so I stand for retaining Stand Your Ground here in Michigan, specifically Detroit.

In this landscape where crime is high you may fine yourself needing to respond in varied ways to survive an altercation upon your person outside of your home.

[firstandten]

First of all I'm not going to say TM was wrong. If GZ doesn't initiate the confrontation then the chain of events afterward doesn't happen. Of course if the fight that happens after the confrontation is true, GZ has every right to defend himself. Personally, I don't have a problem with SYG and the way its applied in Michigan but the way its applied in Florida is extreme. It allows people who may be fearful of minorities anyway to double down on that fear and use lethal force in situations where the actual threat may be questionable. People like GZ will get the benefit of doubt under the Florida law.

[Downriviera]

If GZ doesn't initiate the confrontation then the chain of events afterward doesn't happen.

I've heard this a lot with this case. Imo the chain of events starts with crime in the neignborhood. No crime = no GZ. Another part of the chain of events is TM. 17 year old on suspension from school. He should have been grounded and not allowed out at all, let alone outside after dark in a high crime area. He should not have been there.

[firstandten]

If GZ doesn't initiate the confrontation then the chain of events afterward doesn't happen.

I've heard this a lot with this case. Imo the chain of events starts with crime in the neignborhood. No crime = no GZ. Another part of the chain of events is TM. 17 year old on suspension from school. He should have been grounded and not allowed out at all, let alone outside after dark in a high crime area. He should not have been there.

That is utter BS, you are trying to make a false comparison fallacy argument. So in other words TM was at fault for just going about his day living his life. Did you think that maybe they did not consider there gated community a high crime area. Did you think that maybe TM was grounded to the extent that he was with his father probably because he was suspended. So you fault a person for living his life and walking to the store. That is the worst blame the victim argument I have ever heard.

[Zacha341]

That could conveniently be read multiple ways for various levels of axe grinding applied to many axes...

She wasn't "making up fake racism" she was making a sarcastic point.

[Zacha341]

Compelling points. Setting aside the drama, media mess and distortions on both sides [[and agendas therein) of this case I remain surprised that Zimmerman was not charged for manslaughter.

That is utter BS, you are trying to make a false comparison fallacy argument. So in other words TM was at fault for just going about his day living his life. Did you think that maybe they did not consider there gated community a high crime area. Did you think that maybe TM was grounded to the extent that he was with his father probably because he was suspended. So you fault a person for living his life and walking to the store. That is the worst blame the victim argument I have ever heard.

[oladub]

So you fault a person for living his life and walking to the store. That is the worst blame the victim argument I have ever heard.

Someone's thought I read was that Trayvon had not considered the mores, customs or realities of the hood he was walking through. Stepping back, I know that as a white, there are neighborhoods in Detroit I would not consider walking through for fear of being mugged. It shouldn't be that way but it is so I avoid those neighborhoods when I visit Detroit.

The article suggested that Trayvon was not similarly considering the neighborhood he was walking through on his way to visit his dad's girlfriend; that, perhaps, he was behaving as if he was still in his own neighborhood. While racially diverse, the neighborhood had been plagued with burglaries and had established its own neighborhood watch. Presumably, the 20+% of blacks living in this neighborhood did not object to or supported the neighborhood watch. When Trayvon became irritated because "a creepy-ass c-----r" started following him, he responded like he was in his own neighborhood which wasn't any smarter than a white person deciding to walk through some neighborhoods off of Gratiot at night. I agree with Trayvon that being followed was creepy. I even think that all the spying Snowden revealed our government is doing is creepy but Trayvon acting out against Zimmerman makes no more sense than any of us acting out violently against our increasingly creepy-ass government. We are all Trayvon in our national neighborhood but we sure don't have to choose violence.

Trayvon shouldn't have had to consider the neighborhood he walked through anymore than I should have to consider walking through one neighborhood or another; no dispute there but responding to reality versus how things should be sometimes prevents pain and suffering.

Good map of the neighborhood where the Trayvon/Zimmerman conflict occurred showing racial demographics.
http://censuschannel.net/cc/news/nei...-shooting-1579

[firstandten]

Only difference TM is a 17 year old, people of that age don't always have the maturity to act accordingly when seeing a perceived threat. We don't know how GZ approached TM, how he spoke to him, all we know is that he initiated the contact. As an adult I would know better how to handle that kind of situation. Creepy-ass situations to a teen would be nothing more than a misunderstanding to be cleared up to a mature adult.

[Zacha341]

Yes, having worked with teens and looking thru the lens of how they perceive and judge things [[per their level of maturity and short-rooted experiences) I'd concur.

Only difference TM is a 17 year old, people of that age don't always have the maturity to act accordingly when seeing a perceived threat. We don't know how GZ approached TM, how he spoke to him, all we know is that he initiated the contact. As an adult I would know better how to handle that kind of situation. Creepy-ass situations to a teen would be nothing more than a misunderstanding to be cleared up to a mature adult.

[rb336]

Only difference TM is a 17 year old, people of that age don't always have the maturity to act accordingly when seeing a perceived threat. We don't know how GZ approached TM, how he spoke to him, all we know is that he initiated the contact. As an adult I would know better how to handle that kind of situation. Creepy-ass situations to a teen would be nothing more than a misunderstanding to be cleared up to a mature adult.

I don't know - having someone stalking me would be as much a creepy-ass situation now as it would have been when I was 17. The difference, however, is that I would not try to confront him

[Downriviera]

Someone's thought I read was that Trayvon had not considered the mores, customs or realities of the hood he was walking through.

Good point. He could have been attacked by the local gang that is responsible for some of the B&Es.

.Only difference TM is a 17 year old, people of that age don't always have the maturity to act accordingly when seeing a perceived threat.

Very true. All the more reason he should have had better parental supervision. Suspended from school he should not have been out in a strange neighborhood after dark.

[Downriviera]

Yes, having worked with teens and looking thru the lens of how they perceive and judge things [[per their level of maturity and short-rooted experiences) I'd concur.

George Zimmerman worked with kids as well. Along with his wife, he mentored two black youths. ABC News interviewed their mother, who spoke very highly of GZ. She said he is not a racist.

[Zacha341]

I did not say he was and yes, I'd read early on that he worked with teens.

George Zimmerman worked with kids as well. Along with his wife, he mentored two black youths. ABC News interviewed their mother, who spoke very highly of GZ. She said he is not a racist.

[firstandten]

Someone's thought I read was that Trayvon had not considered the mores, customs or realities of the hood he was walking through.

Good point. He could have been attacked by the local gang that is responsible for some of the B&Es.

.Only difference TM is a 17 year old, people of that age don't always have the maturity to act accordingly when seeing a perceived threat.

Very true. All the more reason he should have had better parental supervision. Suspended from school he should not have been out in a strange neighborhood after dark.

More blame the victim claptrap

[rb336]

I don't give a rat's ass if Zimmerman mentored 100 kids and read for the blind. I don't care if he helped someone get out of a flipped over car. He is responsible for the death of a kid who was doing NOTHING but trying to walk home.

"Suspended from school he should not have been out in a strange neighborhood after dark."

Yes, blame the victim for walking up to the local store for a snack - in HIS neighborhood

[Papasito]

I don't give a rat's ass if Zimmerman mentored 100 kids and read for the blind. I don't care if he helped someone get out of a flipped over car. He is responsible for the death of a kid who was doing NOTHING but trying to walk home.

I wasn't there, so I can't comment. All I can do is present a possibility.
If he's lying, who knows. Evidently the jury believed it.

"The Orlando Sentinel reported that George Zimmermantold police he lost 17-year-old Trayvon Martin in the neighborhood he regularly patrolled and was walking back to his vehicle last month when the youth approached him from behind."
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/...black-teenager



The whole "stand your ground" and "self defense" side of this is a bad place to go. Sure, in this instance, people can rant and rage about it, because the person who died in this circumstance wasn't the person of preference.

Gun laws and self defense laws are not skin color dependent. That means people of all skin color can own a firearm, people of all skin color can get a concealed weapon permit. Self defense laws and stand your ground doesn't state that you can't use lethal force to defend yourself if you are black.

If evil whitey mounts an unprovoked attack on an innocent African American, and said African American uses his concealed permitted firearm to use justified lethal force to protect himself, it is LEGAL.

If evil whitey breaks into the home of an African American and said African American fears for his life and for the lives of his/her family and uses justified lethal force to protect his/her family and home, it is LEGAL.

Sure, hating guns and wanting all law abiding citizens to be unarmed and unable to defend themselves is a political point of view. But taking away self defense rights is a way of empowering ALL attackers and putting the burden of the situation on the VICTIM.

Like I said, the TM situation isn't the best situation to make the case, but in many, many cases of self defense, the law does not discriminate on the skin color of the person who defends themselves. If TM had wrestled the weapon away from Zimmerman and shot him [[Zimmerman) in justifiable self defense, he was in his rights to do so.