Kevyn Orr at Wayne State Law School

[belleislerunner]

I think the entire concept of him having meetings [[which are required by law) is absurd. His job is to fix the cities finances - not to be my therapist. There's nothing of value anyone in attendance can add to the process. One meeting every six months is enough in my books.

[48205to24]

Residents have the right to hear information directly from him or his representative, without the usual spins from the news.
I hope they post videos of this community meeting and any others on the City of Detroit Website.

[antongast]

What in the everloving fuck is so hard about scheduling public meetings in adequately-sized venues? It's almost like they're doing it on purpose or something.

[Wesley Mouch]

What in the everloving fuck is so hard about scheduling public meetings in adequately-sized venues? It's almost like they're doing it on purpose or something.

They're doing it because its a reasonable size. Bigger, and it ceases to be productive. You don't think a room with a few hundred people can provide a reasonable cross-section of citizens and civic leaders to ask good questions? Or maybe we could try that Occupy megaphone idea?

[coracle]

Although it's still early days I think Kevyn Orr is doing a sterling job. In a short time he has established his authority over all the clamor; he has the ear of the City; he's sidelined the culprits [[where are the Council and Mayor?); he's put the Unions and their Pension takers on notice; he's left himself a completely free hand on assets and [[unfortunately) he's informed the Investors they are going to lose their money. [[because they won't come back)
But the future looks decidedly better provided his job is not "finished" after 18 months and the process is allowed to start again. At least it should go on until the next Democrat Governor is elected.

[Danny]

Too bad Detroiters! The Emergency Manager is trying its best to save this city from bankruptcy! There will be massive cuts and horrendous sacrifices. But by any means necessary Detroit's 15 billion dollar debt must to reduced. Don't blame Kevyn Orr for this mess. Blame recent Detroit mayors and city councils past and present for overspending, embezzling, wasteful spending our tax dollars. Other Michigan cities like Benton Harbor, Ecorse, Allen Park and Flint are under EM's but those folks are not crying about it, so should Detroiters. New York City government went bankrupt in 1970's. Trump and his corporate venture friends came to the rescue to revitalize all of its financial district and its rough up neighborhoods. Give it up Detroiters, the Coleman Young years are over. The Kilpatrick Manoogian parties are over. It's time to move forward further to the 21st Century and stop going back to old civil rights-black power movement of the 1960's. Our city will be in rough rocky road for a recovery. So cast yourselves into God's hands and start cleaning your hoods. Detroiters are the new city council not government.

WORD FROM THE STREET PROPHET!

For Neda, Guy Fawkes, George Stinney, the 99 Percenters Rodney King and Trayvon Martin.

[corktownyuppie]

Any civil discourse should reflect the real, unadulterated views of the stakeholders. But the need for individual expression should not trump the rights of other individuals to have their voices heard. Lastly, a speaker's need to be hostile should trump the sensitivities of its audience members, though politically and tactically speaking, it's generally not a productive use of our time.

Which brings me to the last point. Debate should be productive. Which means that dialogue should move in both directions. If people wish to protest with the volume of their voices, they deserve a venue to be able to do so. Perhaps that is the venue of the City Council meeting. But if that be so, then those of us are interested in listening, learning, contributing, thinking, and solving should have another venue for our preference toward productive dialogue.

[Wesley Mouch]

Any civil discourse should reflect the real, unadulterated views of the stakeholders. But the need for individual expression should not trump the rights of other individuals to have their voices heard. Lastly, a speaker's need to be hostile should trump the sensitivities of its audience members, though politically and tactically speaking, it's generally not a productive use of our time.

Which brings me to the last point. Debate should be productive. Which means that dialogue should move in both directions. If people wish to protest with the volume of their voices, they deserve a venue to be able to do so. Perhaps that is the venue of the City Council meeting. But if that be so, then those of us are interested in listening, learning, contributing, thinking, and solving should have another venue for our preference toward productive dialogue.

Corkman, I do of course understand that we want diverse viewpoints to have a forum. These non-stop public meetings seem to me to be mostly a sideshow -- even when they are well-run at a national level.

Those with edge opinions find them great forums to publicize their views -- see NRA, Occupy, Tea Party, or BAMN.

Are public forums the best way to get public opinion? I don't see that we get more 'democratic' results. Isn't that why we have a ballot box, freedom of speech, and the press?

[corktownyuppie]

Are public forums the best way to get public opinion? I don't see that we get more 'democratic' results. Isn't that why we have a ballot box, freedom of speech, and the press?

No, I would say that public forums are probably one of the worst ways to get public opinion. Irving Reid [[WSU) and someone from Wayne Law School were talking this morning on the Craig Fahle show about a program called FOCIS [[http://focis.wayne.edu/citizendetroit/index.php) -- Focus on Contemporary Issues in Society.

They run what seems to be a fascinating program to which anyone can register and participate. It starts with a large group dinner so that people can get to know each other. Then, people are divided into small groups of 6-8. A short, 10-minute lecture is given to educate people about all the different sides of issues facing Detroiters so that people are actually making informed opinions [[like understanding the difference btwn deficits vs. debt, or understanding that any profit from the DWSD can't go into the city general fund, etc.)

Then the small groups are given complex issues of the day and are asked to discuss, and propose solutions that have the consensus of the participants.

What they found is that once people were more informed about the complexities and different parts of Detroit's problems, they were more apt to make suggestions that were well-reasoned, creative, and perhaps effective. They also found out that opinions about proposals which might have been political non-starters in the past were revisited with a fresh eye, even if they were eventually rejected.

I think this it the model of public dialogue which is far more effective than 60 seconds in front of a microphone at City Council. However, City Council meetings are the only place where anyone can have a voice...even if they use that voice to say what is sometimes completely stupid. And I think that as things get even more and more painful, people need and deserve to have a place where their voice is heard.

[Toka313]

I was locked outside. The venue was intentional. It was originally scheduled at Greater Grace Temple. Then put in one of the smallest lecture halls at WSU. General Lectures holds double that.

He had a lame excuse about not having a powerpoint ready equipment I think I heard. General Lectures has that, and had enough people to hold everybody.

Orr is a crook running away from the public in small venues. Just like Snyder with the Lame Duck legislature this year.

RANT OVER>