Report: Pulte HQ Bailing out of Detroit

**rb336** · May-31-13, 06:15 PM

Originally Posted by Bham1982

I don't think you can blame/credit Pulte for sprawl. They're a company that took advantage of a market preference. If there were no Pulte, the same homes would have been built.

but maybe with better quality

**wolverine** · May-31-13, 07:04 PM

Not necessarily market preference but market ease. If I wanted to build a custom on a single lot, it's pretty hard to find. Most new construction is on developer controlled land. In the case of small towns and exurbs, it's an area of farmland bought up by a developer to put a subdivision on under some sort of design guidelines that technically don't give the consumer a whole lot of choice. But of course there's a camp of people who don't care.

So that leaves alot of older cities for new construction... particularly vacant land / infill. But that market is already very competitive and filled with spec home builders.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · May-31-13, 07:37 PM

Originally Posted by Novine

Right-to-work and slashing business taxes wasn't the panacea that Snyder and his cohorts in Lansing painted it to be? Let's see what Synder and the spin machine have to say about this news.

Totally agree, Snyder's underhandedness has come back to bite him in the _ss. No matter how you spin it, losing Pulte is a big loss, but he will poo-poo it as being not a big deal, as he usually does. Companies aren't "busting through doors" to move to Michigan, I hope this isn't the start of a trend.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · May-31-13, 07:43 PM

Originally Posted by 1953

Its a regional economy. Bloomfield Hills is part of the Detroit region.

P.S. I don't see how this thread turned into a Snyder-bashing thread. You are all being kind of ridiculous.

He needs to be bashed. Hope he's a "One Term Nerd".

**Cincinnati_Kid** · May-31-13, 07:56 PM

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Isn't Buckhead in Atlanta proper? If so, Atl proper isn't a very large city geographically, so how can it be so suburban inside the city?

Atlanta is the very definition of sprawl. Downtown has just about been abandoned and you have to drive damn near a hour in each direction to get to where everything is at. I have a friend who lives in Alpharetta, just north of Buckhead and you will be using the I-285 beltway a lot.

**wolverine** · May-31-13, 08:27 PM

The dispersion of corporations across the Atlanta area is the principal problem. At least with having the majority of your employment in a central city location you have people heading to and leaving one place. But instead there's all this cross-metro commuting which makes future transit planning a nightmare situation. If you have a job downtown, you can live close to downtown and still get a reasonably authentic urban experience in Atlanta.

I travel there about once a year, and they really are doing their best to densify areas in and around the heart of the city. Let's be careful with our words because in terms of urban density in central areas, it's got a lot more going for it right now than Detroit. Had it not been for the recession they'd be a lot further along swapping out parking lots for tall towers.

I guess what reinforces the suburban perspective of Atlanta is that it's super regional for business and wasn't all that big of a city historically. It's pre-war urban buildout was bigger than Grand Rapids but smaller than Cincinnati. With all the annexations and surrounding sprawl communities, the historical fabric was pretty much diluted by single family homes and apartment buildings with lots and lots of greenspace around them.

Structurally the city was never prepared for the type of growth it would see present day.

**313WX** · May-31-13, 08:31 PM

Even with Atlanta's sprawl, I would still say it's more centralized than Detroit.

**Patrick** · May-31-13, 09:15 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

Even with Atlanta's sprawl, I would still say it's more centralized than Detroit.

My office recently had 7 people transfer from Atlanta to DC and not one of those individuals miss Atlanta. They hated the traffic, close-mindedness, sprawl and lower pay. Is ATL all everyone seems to make it out to be?

**canuck** · May-31-13, 09:58 PM

Originally Posted by Patrick

My office recently had 7 people transfer from Atlanta to DC and not one of those individuals miss Atlanta. They hated the traffic, close-mindedness, sprawl and lower pay. Is ATL all everyone seems to make it out to be?

Well you can't blame Pulte's CEO for wanting to be closer to mamma.

**antongast** · June-01-13, 08:36 AM

I love all the local elites hand-wringing over this. How could Pulte be so arrogant? This is how capitalism works, dudes. These corporations you fall all over yourselves to brown-nose, they don't love you back. That's the difference between corporation-people and people-people.

**poobert** · June-01-13, 09:09 AM

Originally Posted by Cincinnati_Kid

Totally agree, Snyder's underhandedness has come back to bite him in the _ss. No matter how you spin it, losing Pulte is a big loss, but he will poo-poo it as being not a big deal, as he usually does. Companies aren't "busting through doors" to move to Michigan, I hope this isn't the start of a trend.

He issued a statement saying this clearly means we need to keep working to make Michigan more "business friendly." Whoever programs these cyborgs for the Republicans has to get some credit, they're pretty consistent, whereas any human would relent in the face of overwhelming evidence that what we're doing isn't working.

**Trumpeteer** · June-01-13, 09:17 AM

Originally Posted by Patrick

My office recently had 7 people transfer from Atlanta to DC and not one of those individuals miss Atlanta. They hated the traffic, close-mindedness, sprawl and lower pay. Is ATL all everyone seems to make it out to be?

Maybe ask all the experts who've posted on their knowledge of Atlanta based on a visit or two a year? BTW Alpharetta is not "just North of Buckhead" it's easily 20+ miles. Just sayin.

**Trumpeteer** · June-01-13, 09:20 AM

Originally Posted by Cincinnati_Kid

Atlanta is the very definition of sprawl. Downtown has just about been abandoned and you have to drive damn near a hour in each direction to get to where everything is at. I have a friend who lives in Alpharetta, just north of Buckhead and you will be using the I-285 beltway a lot.

Downtown just about abandoned?

**Danny** · June-01-13, 10:17 AM

Good riddance to them. Let them invest in the 'HOT lanta!' Another business loss Snyder, the Nerd. Thanks for nothing!

**rex** · June-01-13, 10:35 AM

whats P&L?

**313WX** · June-01-13, 11:00 AM

Originally Posted by Patrick

My office recently had 7 people transfer from Atlanta to DC and not one of those individuals miss Atlanta. They hated the traffic, close-mindedness, sprawl and lower pay. Is ATL all everyone seems to make it out to be?

HA!!! The fact that they transferred to a city similar to Atlanta [[DC is also sprawly, has horrible traffic, and the ridiculous COL diminishes the benefit of the higher pay) kind of discredits their points.

**Danny** · June-01-13, 11:15 AM

I hope they make homes for poor southern blacks who had been living in run down 1970s projects and old shacks after the great Atlanta Olympic Games job rush of the early 1990s suddenly went bust. There still a lot of Mexican-Hispanics living in that northeast Atlanta area after the 1990 job rush.

**Bham1982** · June-01-13, 11:55 AM

Originally Posted by rex

whats P&L?

Profit and Loss.

Gilbert is saying that Pulte lost a ton of money the last few years, which is kind of a stupid statement, because every single housing company got killed during the recession. You can't be a new home builder and do well during a housing collapse.

**Bham1982** · June-01-13, 11:58 AM

Originally Posted by 313WX

HA!!! The fact that they transferred to a city similar to Atlanta [[DC is also sprawly, has horrible traffic, and the ridiculous COL diminishes the benefit of the higher pay) kind of discredits their points.

I agree DC is sprawly [[but what U.S. city isn't), though it's far more centralized than Atlanta, and has an actual functioning city center and real transit, actually used by the non-poor.

Atlanta's downtown is even worse than that of Detroit, and there are no real urban neigborhoods [[unless you consider auto-oriented highrise condos along Peachtree to be urban). You can walk 10 minutes from downtown Atlanta and be in suburban-style areas without sidewalks.

**313WX** · June-01-13, 12:31 PM

Originally Posted by Bham1982

I agree DC is sprawly [[but what U.S. city isn't), though it's far more centralized than Atlanta, and has an actual functioning city center and real transit, actually used by the non-poor.

Atlanta's downtown is even worse than that of Detroit, and there are no real urban neigborhoods [[unless you consider auto-oriented highrise condos along Peachtree to be urban). You can walk 10 minutes from downtown Atlanta and be in suburban-style areas without sidewalks.

As I said before, in spite of Atlanta's sprawl, it's still more centralized than Detroit.

The latest numbers from the Census show that nearly 300K people commute to Atlanta every day from the suburbs, a higher number than Chicago and Boston in fact.

Majority of the economic activity in the metro area takes place in downtown Atlanta, unlike in Detroit where everything takes place in Southfield, Troy, Dearborn and Auburn Hills

**MikeyinBrooklyn** · June-01-13, 01:04 PM

This is not surprising news. Their customers are not, for the most part, in the Midwest, let alone Michigan. Southern states are growing and building lots of homes. We aren't. Yes, we're building some, but not on that scale. I wish they'd stay anyway, but I understand. I'm in the restaurant business. I wouldn't have my office far away from where my employees are working and customers are eating.

It's not unlike Comerica. Most of their business is now in the southwest. Why keep the HQ here?

**Bham1982** · June-01-13, 02:27 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

As I said before, in spite of Atlanta's sprawl, it's still more centralized than Detroit.

The latest numbers from the Census show that nearly 300K people commute to Atlanta every day from the suburbs, a higher number than Chicago and Boston in fact.

Majority of the economic activity in the metro area takes place in downtown Atlanta, unlike in Detroit where everything takes place in Southfield, Troy, Dearborn and Auburn Hills

I agree that Atlanta is far more centralized than Detroit, even though it's also far more sprawling.

But the reason Atlanta has such a higher proportion of workers in the city limits isn't necessarily because of downtown. Buckhead and Midtown are both huge business districts, both within city limits, and both not downtown. It would be like if Detroit included Dearborn and Southfield, so you could say that Metro Detroit employment was more centralized.

**compn** · June-01-13, 04:03 PM

i bet snyder digs out the ole playbook that granholm was using and does the same tricks as her. it didnt work for granholm, its not going to work now.
no one is going to move to michigan in this economy.

especially with detroits imminent bankruptcy.

whats devos up to in grand rapids?

Amway constructs $81M vitamin plant, 200 jobs in Ada

not bad mr amway.

wheres mitt romney to come save his home state?

Among the ideas on the table: a book, a summit in Utah and last but not least, stumping for congressional GOP candidates

he'll be too busy with that book to help poor michigan.

simple fact: No governor of Michigan has lost re-election since 1962, when George Romney [[father of Mitt) defeated incumbent John Swainson.

yikes.

**nain rouge** · June-01-13, 06:23 PM

Originally Posted by Bham1982

But the reason Atlanta has such a higher proportion of workers in the city limits isn't necessarily because of downtown. Buckhead and Midtown are both huge business districts, both within city limits, and both not downtown.

True, but Atlanta is actually physically smaller than Detroit, so the region deserves some credit for keeping business within the city limits. More accurately, if Detroit would be more like Atlanta if New Center had been developed further and the Southfield skyscrapers had been located a few miles south.

**D_Town** · June-01-13, 07:15 PM

Originally Posted by nain rouge

True, but Atlanta is actually physically smaller than Detroit, so the region deserves some credit for keeping business within the city limits. More accurately, if Detroit would be more like Atlanta if New Center had been developed further and the Southfield skyscrapers had been located a few miles south.

Basically, but the distance with the equivalence of Buckhead would be like downtown to Highland Park.