The 25 most dangerous neighborhoods in America

[drpoundsign]

Yes, we have all heard many bad things about Brightmoor. I was supposedly NEVER good; even before racial transition. It was built by Ford for the workers from Kentucky, with small houses and lots. I believe it changed in the late seventies/early eighties, after most of the other Hoods. Conant Gardens and Royal Oak Charter Township, were like Medieval Slums..located on the outskirts of the cities away from all the "good stuff." I remember being accosted by panhandling drunks from the Cass Corridor in broad daylight on the WSU campus. Crazy people too. One schizophrenic said "I'm in Trouble Landlord threw me OUT!" [[imagine) Showed me his ID card with a West Vernor address. I threw an F Bomb on me when I dared only give him a dollar "someday YOU'll need help!" There were a LOT of hookers in the Corridor back then. West of Third and South of Myrtle lots of burnt out apartment buildings and the Jeffries Low rises. The Northeast part of the City near 7 Mile and Hoover was not that bad until the residency requirement for public employees was lifted..then the Cops left Copper Canyons.

[iheartthed]

I said BOTH should be considered. I never said crime per area was better. How is knowing how concentrated crime is silly? It just gives a different context to the crime you see. Thats why people look at crime maps. Knowing spatial distribution of crimes mean something. Also, crimes don't just happen in areas with residents.

I would add that murder rates aren't really a foolproof measure of "danger", since murder is a very "social" crime. A person is far more likely to be murdered by someone s/he knows than by a complete stranger. It probably gets a little too much emphasis placed on it by the media because it's an easy way to frame a story about a very complex topic.

This isn't to say that Detroit is the safest place on Earth, or to excuse Detroit's extremely high crime rate, but I'd be interested in seeing more stats about random crime since that is what is most likely to affect me whether I'm in Detroit or New York.

For instance, New York has a huge problem right now with people being robbed for their smartphones. That's a very random crime and something that is a lot more likely to affect me than a gang member being murdered by someone from a rival gang. Does Detroit also have a smartphone robbery epidemic? How does that compare to New York?

[Cincinnati_Kid]

I would add that murder rates aren't really a foolproof measure of "danger", since murder is a very "social" crime. A person is far more likely to be murdered by someone s/he knows than by a complete stranger. It probably gets a little too much emphasis placed on it by the media because it's an easy way to frame a story about a very complex topic.

This isn't to say that Detroit is the safest place on Earth, or to excuse Detroit's extremely high crime rate, but I'd be interested in seeing more stats about random crime since that is what is most likely to affect me whether I'm in Detroit or New York.

For instance, New York has a huge problem right now with people being robbed for their smartphones. That's a very random crime and something that is a lot more likely to affect me than a gang member being murdered by someone from a rival gang. Does Detroit also have a smartphone robbery epidemic? How does that compare to New York?

Not according to Mayor Bloomberg. He wasted no time in throwing Detroit under the bus with his comments about Detroit's crime rates compared to New York's.

[iheartthed]

Not according to Mayor Bloomberg. He wasted no time in throwing Detroit under the bus with his comments about Detroit's crime rates compared to New York's.

Well, he's an asshole but his comments were also taken a bit out of context by the Detroit media. He didn't single Detroit out. He read off a list of major American cities including Chicago, Washington D.C., Baltimore, etc., and contrasted their murder rates with New York's. Detroit media just parsed that part about Detroit out to make it seem like he only singled out Detroit.

[Honky Tonk]

Well, he's an asshole but his comments were also taken a bit out of context by the Detroit media. He didn't single Detroit out. He read off a list of major American cities including Chicago, Washington D.C., Baltimore, etc.

Well, then who's the asshole?

[michimoby]

For instance, New York has a huge problem right now with people being robbed for their smartphones. That's a very random crime and something that is a lot more likely to affect me than a gang member being murdered by someone from a rival gang. Does Detroit also have a smartphone robbery epidemic? How does that compare to New York?

You raise some good thoughts; however, a few points:

1. Random smartphone robberies does not motivate a sector of the population from no longer taking the subway, or going into a specific neighborhood, or having an overall fear of living in NYC. Detroit literally has sections of the city declared as no man's land for outsiders because the propensity for violent crime is so high, it isn't worth the effort to even go there.

2. I'd also suggest that, while the propensity for petty theft is higher in NYC than Detroit, the NYPD is in a much better position to resolve those crimes than DPD. My friend, for example, had her wallet stolen on the L line last week, and she's been getting a daily update call from an NYPD detective to let her know of any leads. That's exceptional, and while I don't mean to discount the extremely challenging task of being a DPD officer, they're focusing on preventing certain neighborhoods from becoming a veritable tire fire of violence rather than helping you get your phone back.

[leapfrog]

Or read the 'comments' to see what is said between the lines in some cases...

To what end though? When I do read them, all they do is disgust me - and as I'm sure you noticed, some of them don't even bother to speak "between the lines" - they are open and outright about it.

I avoid them now since all they do is act as "mental pollution" to me. =)

[antongast]

Detroit literally has sections of the city declared as no man's land for outsiders because the propensity for violent crime is so high, it isn't worth the effort to even go there.

It does? Which "sections of the city" have been "declared" as such, and who is doing the declaring?

[Honky Tonk]

To what end though? When I do read them, all they do is disgust me - and as I'm sure you noticed, some of them don't even bother to speak "between the lines" - they are open and outright about it.

I avoid them now since all they do is act as "mental pollution" to me. =)

As do the Pollyanna posts.

[michimoby]

It does? Which "sections of the city" have been "declared" as such, and who is doing the declaring?

Dollars and feet on the ground, sir -- that's who does the declaring.

[antongast]

Dollars and feet on the ground, sir -- that's who does the declaring.

Help me out here, apparently I'm a little slow. What on God's green earth are you talking about? All I know about dollars on the ground is that they can't exist.

[michimoby]

Help me out here, apparently I'm a little slow. What on God's green earth are you talking about? All I know about dollars on the ground is that they can't exist.

I mean, you can have pants on the ground...why not dollars?

Dollars = healthy, thriving businesses along neighborhood arteries.

[wolverine]

I would add that murder rates aren't really a foolproof measure of "danger", since murder is a very "social" crime. A person is far more likely to be murdered by someone s/he knows than by a complete stranger. It probably gets a little too much emphasis placed on it by the media because it's an easy way to frame a story about a very complex topic.

This isn't to say that Detroit is the safest place on Earth, or to excuse Detroit's extremely high crime rate, but I'd be interested in seeing more stats about random crime since that is what is most likely to affect me whether I'm in Detroit or New York.

For instance, New York has a huge problem right now with people being robbed for their smartphones. That's a very random crime and something that is a lot more likely to affect me than a gang member being murdered by someone from a rival gang. Does Detroit also have a smartphone robbery epidemic? How does that compare to New York?

What's new york's smartphone recovery rate. I know someone that got one stolen on the train in Chicago but the police helped get it back. These kids swiping phones are idiots for not knowing smartphones can be tracked and there is cameras on trains.

There's a great video online of people chaining a phone thief to a fence in a cta station until police arrive.

[antongast]

I mean, you can have pants on the ground...why not dollars?

Dollars = healthy, thriving businesses along neighborhood arteries.

Okay, but I'm still not getting how that relates to this:

Detroit literally has sections of the city declared as no man's land for outsiders because the propensity for violent crime is so high, it isn't worth the effort to even go there.

Neighborhood retail declines for all sorts of reasons other than violent crime, and lots of relatively decent city neighborhoods have terribly run-down retail strips. I'm also still not sure which parts of the city are supposed to be "no man's land for outsiders." The retail strips in my neighborhood are full of dilapidated vacant storefronts, and the remaining businesses are mostly low-end party stores, but I see outsiders here all the time.

[michimoby]

What's new york's smartphone recovery rate. I know someone that got one stolen on the train in Chicago but the police helped get it back. These kids swiping phones are idiots for not knowing smartphones can be tracked and there is cameras on trains.

There's a great video online of people chaining a phone thief to a fence in a cta station until police arrive.

I'm not quite sure what the recovery rate is, but...you're absolutely right. There's so many triangulation points now if you're in a public place and get your stuff lifted.

[michimoby]

Okay, but I'm still not getting how that relates to this:

Neighborhood retail declines for all sorts of reasons other than violent crime, and lots of relatively decent city neighborhoods have terribly run-down retail strips. I'm also still not sure which parts of the city are supposed to be "no man's land for outsiders." The retail strips in my neighborhood are full of dilapidated vacant storefronts, and the remaining businesses are mostly low-end party stores, but I see outsiders here all the time.

I'm sure there's occasional flow, but the question is around whether or not that flow is decelerating. Statistically, violent crime has a marked effect on property values, which tends to detract businesses [[and potential residents) from entering such areas, and it effectively becomes a dead zone for commerce over time.

A good example of this would be Census Tract 5139 [[the area bordered by Mack, McLellan, and Kercheval on the east side). While people technically still live there, it lost 46 percent of its residents between 2000 and 2010. That's a dead zone with, I'd hypothesize, no way to stem the outflow.

[iheartthed]

What's new york's smartphone recovery rate. I know someone that got one stolen on the train in Chicago but the police helped get it back. These kids swiping phones are idiots for not knowing smartphones can be tracked and there is cameras on trains.

There's a great video online of people chaining a phone thief to a fence in a cta station until police arrive.

I have no idea, but I doubt it's that high. If the thief is able to shut the phone off before you track it then there's basically zero chance that you'll get it back. Any phones that do get recovered are usually the result of good timing. If you can find a cop on the street quickly who has a smart phone that they can use to activate the tracking software on the stolen phone then they might get to the thief before they shut the phone off. Otherwise, it's a lost cause.

[antongast]

I'm sure there's occasional flow, but the question is around whether or not that flow is decelerating. Statistically, violent crime has a marked effect on property values, which tends to detract businesses [[and potential residents) from entering such areas, and it effectively becomes a dead zone for commerce over time. A good example of this would be Census Tract 5139 [[the area bordered by Mack, McLellan, and Kercheval on the east side). While people technically still live there, it lost 46 percent of its residents between 2000 and 2010. That's a dead zone with, I'd hypothesize, no way to stem the outflow.

If your point is "Detroit is losing businesses and population, and one of the causes of that trend is violent crime," then that's absolutely true. I interpreted your original post to mean that there are parts of the city where non-residents refuse even to set foot because of violent crime, which I think is a somewhat more dubious claim that's difficult to prove one way or the other and depends a lot on how you define your terms.

[michimoby]

If your point is "Detroit is losing businesses and population, and one of the causes of that trend is violent crime," then that's absolutely true. I interpreted your original post to mean that there are parts of the city where non-residents refuse even to set foot because of violent crime, which I think is a somewhat more dubious claim that's difficult to prove one way or the other and depends a lot on how you define your terms.

I was alluding to both, although not to classify the latter as absolutely, under no circumstances, etc. Conscientious residents will know what neighborhoods are safer, for sure.

In a lot of ways, though, I think non-residents have no damn clue what neighborhoods in Detroit are safe/unsafe. There's a naïveté I've not seen in other cities, for sure. In Chicago and NYC, for example, people generally know where particular neighborhoods are located AND whether or not they're high crime. Detroit is often classified as 'Detroit'; I notice this in particular when the media reports on violent crimes.

[Nalimezzz]

That's why I said it was hypothetical......

Plus, I acknowledge that Detroit has crime, and said it would be near the top no matter what. My post really had nothing to do with saying Detroit is like NYC...I could have made up 2 locations. I'm just making the point that crime per square mile tells a person how much crime is going on around them. I'll go away from hypotheticals and give a real example...

New Orleans had 193 murders in 2012, New York had 414. Given than New York has over 8 million people, and New Orleans has only about 370,000, the crime rate [[per capita) is much much higher in New Orleans. However, if you look at NYC's land area [[302.6 sq mi) and New Orleans [[180.6) and calculate murders per square mile, NYC has 1.37 murders per sq mi and New Orleans has 1.07. So, if you are a New Yorker, you are just as likely [[and slightly more likely) to be in an area with a murder as someone that lives in New Orleans. If a murder happens on your street, I don't think people will feel better about it if there's more people around them.

In our country [[Russia) is much worse. 222 murders
committed in Moscow in just the first six months.
I have to go live in Detroit))

[ejames01]

In our country [[Russia) is much worse. 222 murders
committed in Moscow in just the first six months.
I have to go live in Detroit))

Moscow has 12 million residents though.

[Nalimezzz]

Moscow has 12 million residents though.

Indeed it is true. I had not thought of.

[detroitsgwenivere]

Im sorta surprised which areas made the list. Not because I didn't know they had crime, but because i know about other areas that seem so much worse.

Like my boyfriends hood. Open air drug market all summer long, dope houses running all shifts in the winter, pirate hookers and captain hooks enmass, dead users laying around, constant shootings, fights, arsons, stripping, dumping, armed robberies, dumped stolen vehicles, raid vans, feds, jumpout boys, bounty hunters... And I know that the Van Dyke corridor and the Houston-Whittier corridor aren't much better.

Seriously, I think the crime stats are botched, and crimes majorly under reported.

[Zacha341]

I hear you. But once in a while a commenter will point out something interesting beyond but related to the point or narrative of the store - but a great deal of it can be rubbish. Especially on some sites where the folks [[usually regular trolls) just go back and forth in a pissing contest.

To what end though? When I do read them, all they do is disgust me - and as I'm sure you noticed, some of them don't even bother to speak "between the lines" - they are open and outright about it.

I avoid them now since all they do is act as "mental pollution" to me. =)

[Zacha341]

I agree. But BTW, what's a 'jumpout boy'? The other terms you mentioned I knew... but that one?

Captain hooks! Yeah seen that... I think. Hah!

Like my boyfriends hood. Open air drug market all summer long, dope houses running all shifts in the winter, pirate hookers and captain hooks enmass, dead users laying around, constant shootings, fights, arsons, stripping, dumping, armed robberies, dumped stolen vehicles, raid vans, feds, jumpout boys, bounty hunters...