Possible move to Detroit, please help/berate me.

[RickBeall]

If you move to Detroit, you will need a car. Otherwise, your experience here will be like you are camping. The public transporation is not very good. Slow and does not go many places off Woodward.

I bicycle is a wonderful thing and Detroit is great for riding your bike. The sidwalks are wide and generally not crowded. But due to the dispersed nature of all your shopping etc., it would be like camping out to not have a car.

Also, if you buy an old victorian mansion, etc. expect to do some repair, so you will need your car to ferry supplies to the house. If you have other people do everything, that can be expensive.

[michimoby]

ONCE AGAIN... Detroit & Chicago are like apples and oranges! How did Chicago even get into this conversation? WHY does Chicago ALWAYS end up in a conversation?

The lady made it very clear that she wants to either be in Detroit or Pittsburgh. Neither of these cities are like Chicago so why bring up Chicago?

Woah there, partner. Why wasn't there this visceral reaction when someone else brought up places like Tulsa?

I'd be willing to even suggest that Pittsburgh and Detroit are like apples and oranges, at least in current form. Sure, if you look at both cities' stories in aggregate form, then yes - they are fair comparisons. But from the 'current state' lens...yeah, Pitt's not like Detroit at all.

[TexasT]

Woah there, partner. Why wasn't there this visceral reaction when someone else brought up places like Tulsa?

I'd be willing to even suggest that Pittsburgh and Detroit are like apples and oranges, at least in current form. Sure, if you look at both cities' stories in aggregate form, then yes - they are fair comparisons. But from the 'current state' lens...yeah, Pitt's not like Detroit at all.

Detroit's got a chip on its shoulder about Chicago, like Chicago has a chip on its shoulder about NYC [[to a much lesser extent, though). My hometown Houston has a chip its shoulder about, well, every other city, lol. In my experience, nobody is ever completely satisfied, except for New York and Austin, both of which have superiority complexes.

[gnome]

Omni-

i would like to apologize for all the flying fur. Passions seem to be running hot lately.

i spent some time in Pittsburgh and some time in Detroit as well. And despite what you see on this thread, the people in Detroit are much friendlier. Hands down.

Our brethren in Pittsburgh share our industrial past, but it all other ways they have a sharpness usually experienced in NYC, Philly and Boston.

Detroit is a mid-western town and as such the people are more open and inviting. To those who think otherwise, I am sure you are reflecting your own hostility onto others.

As far as a place to rent before you decide. Lafayette Park is quite nice if you are a Modernist. If you would like a fabulous older place, the Palms, Passadena or the Parkstone. The Parkstone is a bit outside downtown as it sits on the edge of Indian Village, but it is quite nice and you would find descerning neighbors with a professional background.

[canuck]

Detroit's got a chip on its shoulder about Chicago, like Chicago has a chip on its shoulder about NYC [[to a much lesser extent, though). My hometown Houston has a chip its shoulder about, well, every other city, lol. In my experience, nobody is ever completely satisfied, except for New York and Austin, both of which have superiority complexes.

Very funny TexasT, I like the takedown of the armies of Wall Street types, and the fact that the city goes to sleep at night. Sweet!

[illwill]

Woah there, partner. Why wasn't there this visceral reaction when someone else brought up places like Tulsa?

I'd be willing to even suggest that Pittsburgh and Detroit are like apples and oranges, at least in current form. Sure, if you look at both cities' stories in aggregate form, then yes - they are fair comparisons. But from the 'current state' lens...yeah, Pitt's not like Detroit at all.

lol... i have to admit, I did have a good laugh after reading my post. i didn't have my coffee at that time.

that was funny!

[aj3647]

I would say go to Pittsburgh. Metro Detroit is too full of angry, vindictive know-it-alls in the suburbs who are living the mythological lives of the past. Fearful of change, cities, transit, taxes and black people, they have left this region stuck so far in the past that it is really just about doomed as a real city goes.

You are easily the biggest racist in this forum and you perfectly exemplify everything that is wrong with Metro Detroit. You are the very epitome of the phenomenon you are complaining about. This region sucks because of people like YOU who can't get past their divisiveness and hate.

[michimoby]

You are easily the biggest racist in this forum and you perfectly exemplify everything that is wrong with Metro Detroit. You are the very epitome of the phenomenon you are complaining about. This region sucks because of people like YOU who can't get past their divisiveness and hate.

this all spiraled out of control very, very quickly.

If Detroit only could resolve its fiscal problems as quickly as this conversation degenerated, we'd be Rollin' in tax revenues!

[Detroitnerd]

You are easily the biggest racist in this forum and you perfectly exemplify everything that is wrong with Metro Detroit. You are the very epitome of the phenomenon you are complaining about. This region sucks because of people like YOU who can't get past their divisiveness and hate.

Hahaha! Yeah, right. I'm a big old racist for pointing out that the region has a lot of racism. I'm a big old hater for pointing out the region is choked with hatred. I'm a big old divider for pointing out that this is one of the most divided regions in the country. Attack the messenger, why doncha?

Oh, and thank you for your brotherly, loving and completely UN-divisive message.

[TexasT]

This region sucks

the region has a lot of racism. ...the region is choked with hatred.

Get as far away from the State of Michigan as humanly possible

Jeez, you Michiganders need a big injection of regional pride. Texas affirmatively sucks in so many ways [[weather, scenery, culture, government, schools, obesity, racism, segregation) but we're still full of obnoxious state pride, even before the population boom started [[which is more the result of Central American immigration and births from our poor as we continue to slash funds for women's health than it is Californians and NYers flooding our state, as we like to pretend). I mean, I love home, but in many ways, we are Alabama with oil money.

Michigan has its problems but it's a quite nice state. Chin up, Michigan!

[canuck]

Jeez, you Michiganders need a big injection of regional pride. Texas affirmatively sucks in so many ways [[weather, scenery, culture, government, schools, obesity, racism, segregation) but we're still full of obnoxious state pride, even before the population boom started [[which is more the result of Central American immigration and births from our poor as we continue to slash funds for women's health than it is Californians and NYers flooding our state, as we like to pretend). I mean, I love home, but in many ways, we are Alabama with oil money.

Michigan has its problems but it's a quite nice state. Chin up, Michigan!

Yes, we all have our [[native region) faults but there is a negative streak on these threads that is over the top at times. A lot needs to be done, and in spite of a slow decline in industrial based economics, Michigan is a beautiful state, big on appreciating its wilderness, counterbalanced by great human potential. Apart from a century of innovation in automotive technology, it is also home to many other successful industries, artistic excellence and meccas of higher education.

Chin up Mich as you say.

[Detroitnerd]

In order to fix things, you must first determine the problem.

In order to do justice, you must first find the truth.

Unfortunately, we're not going to be able to do that here until another generation dies off, because too many in the region cling to ideological ideas about what the problem has been, and a mythological view of history. If this weren't enough to stop progress, there is also a very quiet, unspoken problem that can never be addressed, because if you even mention its name, about half the population here will go bat-shit insane.

[TexasT]

In order to fix things, you must first determine the problem.

In order to do justice, you must first find the truth.

Unfortunately, we're not going to be able to do that here until another generation dies off, because too many in the region cling to ideological ideas about what the problem has been, and a mythological view of history. If this weren't enough to stop progress, there is also a very quiet, unspoken problem that can never be addressed, because if you even mention its name, about half the population here will go bat-shit insane.

People on this board go way past identifying the problem. I can tell you the problems here without tearing down the city, suburbs, and state quite easily. Metro Detroiters as a whole have a severe case of regional low self esteem. I've never seen anything like it. This actually comes up quite a bit in conversation with other non-natives; I was just talking about it with a girl from Austin that I met at Nain Rouge yesterday.

[Detroitnerd]

People on this board go way past identifying the problem. I can tell you the problems here without tearing down the city, suburbs, and state quite easily. Metro Detroiters as a whole have a severe case of regional low self esteem. I've never seen anything like it. This actually comes up quite a bit in conversation with other non-natives; I was just talking about it with a girl from Austin that I met at Nain Rouge yesterday.

Well, I do love it here. Being from here makes it easier to love, and moving away for 11 years helped me see its faults but also appreciate its charm. It's kind of like an old shoe that's worn to your contours, always easy to step back into, even if you wouldn't want to wear it to the ball.

[p69rrh51]

Well, I do love it here. Being from here makes it easier to love, and moving away for 11 years helped me see its faults but also appreciate its charm. It's kind of like an old shoe that's worn to your contours, always easy to step back into, even if you wouldn't want to wear it to the ball.

Very well stated D-nerd! By far the best post on the CoD you have posted on here! Now we all need to expand on that very sentiment.

[canuck]

darned I feel light heartedd againd...

[Bham1982]

I thought we had this discussion already?

According to the FBI Uniform Crime Reporting tool, murder rates in Detroit are down.

You picked the absolute worst year for murders [[1987), and even then, the current murder rate is about the same.

In 1987, you had 756 homicides for 1.2 million people. In 2012, you had 411 homicides for 700k people.

So in '87, one out of every 1600 Detroiters were murdered, and in '12, one out of every 1700 Detroiters were murdered. Not a big difference, and probably explained by their "reclassified" deaths.

[Bham1982]

Detroit's got a chip on its shoulder about Chicago, like Chicago has a chip on its shoulder about NYC .

I think Chicago is a hell of a lot closer to Detroit than to NYC in most aspects, but, yeah, I mostly agree. In any case, the three cities are different enough from one another that comparisons are basically useless.

[iheartthed]

You picked the absolute worst year for murders [[1987), and even then, the current murder rate is about the same.

In 1987, you had 756 homicides for 1.2 million people. In 2012, you had 411 homicides for 700k people.

So in '87, one out of every 1600 Detroiters were murdered, and in '12, one out of every 1700 Detroiters were murdered. Not a big difference, and probably explained by their "reclassified" deaths.

Without getting too deep into a statistics lesson, murder rate is not the same as saying one out of every x citizen was murdered. Murder rate is the number of people who were murdered [[or found murdered) in a jurisdiction relative to the size of the population. Every person who was murdered in Detroit was not a resident of Detroit. Yes, this is a tangent but it's very irritating to hear people mangle interpretations of statistics. And understanding that point is necessary for us to have any type of meaningful conversation about what the numbers actually mean regarding Detroit's murder rate.

I chose 1987 because the numbers from the Uniform Crime Reporting tool only went back through 1985, and 1987 appears to be the high water mark. True, in 2012 there was a significant jump and the murder rate went up to 58 murders per 100,000 residents. However, the murder rates for 2011 and 2012 are clearly a stark reversal of the trend over the previous 25 years, which anyone will clearly see if they plot the data points out on a timeline.

[Guideboat]

Omni,

Full disclosure, I was born in the suburbs and live in the suburbs, but I love Detroit. Yes, Detroit certainly has its issues. It cannot be denied. But I find it telling that despite the messed-up city politics and economic hard times parts of the city have seen growth. You will find plenty of posts on here proclaiming this growth and decrying it as a bunch of hipster Johnny-Come-Latelys. The fact remains is that there is a part of Detroit that won't die and wants to live and thrive. I grew up with the city and all it has to offer being part of my life. We regularly visit the museums, riverfront, restaurants, and Belle Isle.

Detroit has much to offer despite its warts. I sincerely hope you do move to Detroit or a suburb. The Detroit area needs people with passion and a desire to be here. Best of luck!

[313WX]

easiest question ever : Pittsburgh.

Get as far away from the State of Michigan as humanly possible so you dont get sucked down in the undertow.

Defintely Agreed.

[syrett4]

I moved into Lafayette Park last week. I did my homework and love my decision. Now to find a job down here and put my car away. Detroit needs people like you to believe in it and contribute to it, no matter where you come from.

[Hermod]

Jeez, you Michiganders need a big injection of regional pride. Texas affirmatively sucks in so many ways [[weather, scenery, culture, government, schools, obesity, racism, segregation) but we're still full of obnoxious state pride, even before the population boom started [[which is more the result of Central American immigration and births from our poor as we continue to slash funds for women's health than it is Californians and NYers flooding our state, as we like to pretend). I mean, I love home, but in many ways, we are Alabama with oil money.

Michigan has its problems but it's a quite nice state. Chin up, Michigan!

Directions to Texas: Go west till you smell something then south till you step in it.

[Hermod]

Without getting too deep into a statistics lesson, murder rate is not the same as saying one out of every x citizen was murdered. Murder rate is the number of people who were murdered [[or found murdered) in a jurisdiction relative to the size of the population. Every person who was murdered in Detroit was not a resident of Detroit. Yes, this is a tangent but it's very irritating to hear people mangle interpretations of statistics. And understanding that point is necessary for us to have any type of meaningful conversation about what the numbers actually mean regarding Detroit's murder rate.

I chose 1987 because the numbers from the Uniform Crime Reporting tool only went back through 1985, and 1987 appears to be the high water mark. True, in 2012 there was a significant jump and the murder rate went up to 58 murders per 100,000 residents. However, the murder rates for 2011 and 2012 are clearly a stark reversal of the trend over the previous 25 years, which anyone will clearly see if they plot the data points out on a timeline.

Whoa, whoa, whoa. I thought the DetroitYes "party line' was that you are perfectly safe visiting Detroit as long as you weren't buying drugs and that Detroiters just kill each other.

[mwilbert]

Whoa, whoa, whoa. I thought the DetroitYes "party line' was that you are perfectly safe visiting Detroit as long as you weren't buying drugs and that Detroiters just kill each other.

The notion of a DetroitYes party line seems rather farfetched.