Somerset Collection's reign in jeopardy?

[dtowncitylover]

ccal- what are you doing to stop them and deter the problem? If you deal with these people on a daily basis, why don't you speak up and turn them in?

[Downtown Lady]

ccal, it seems like you're missing the point. No one is disputing that there may be black people that steal from Somerset. No one is saying that notion is "impossible" or that we can't "suspend belief" and that you need to convince us. You are debating points that no one is debating back.

What people are saying is that unless you are all-seeing and all-knowing, you cannot know three things:

[[1) what percentage of people stealing from Somerset are black [[compared to other races/ethnic groups)

[[2) what percentage of black shoppers are thieves

[[3) what the unnoticed or unreported crime statistics are at Somerset [[because the crimes are unnoticed or unreported), and how those statistics compare to other malls [in other words, Joe White Guy and his band of thieves might be stealing every day from Twelve Oaks]

If you say that you know black people that steal from Somerset every day, I believe you. [[But I might also suggest that you need to find better friends.) I think what people find so objectionable [[and I don't claim to speak for everyone, I am just surmising) is this:

The original poster came out with a preposterous claim, that Somerset is near dead because "the clientele has taken a drastic shift the past 5 or so years". Everyone with half a brain can read his coded message, which in essence is: "Look at all the black shoppers. This place must then be crime-infested."

What is so unsettling is that you are just adding fuel to his fire, in essence saying, "He's right! Black people do steal!" Well yes, some do. Most don't. And some people of other races/ethnic groups steal too. But it just seems that you are trying to cry from the mountaintops about how much black people steal.

[ccal]

And how do you know there aren't white people from Clarkston or Asian people from Novi doing the same thing? Short of Godlike abilities, how are you able to ascertain the racial distribution of all crimes committed in a huge shopping center?

I don't know and I never said I did, I don't live amongst those people or those places, I live in Detroit amongst black people and thats what I'm speaking on. You keep offering your opinion but have you really went to find out or do you just like going around in circles about the same thing? You keep trying to ask the same question or make the same point in various ways but it comes out the same, bottom line is you don't think is happening which is cool, I'm not trippin because whats clear is that you simply don't know any better. We, you and I, obviously don't run in the same circles, don't know any of the same people and probably aren't ever going to cross each others path. The only thing we have in common is Detroityes.com. We have experienced and lived two different lives which in turn has molded our outlooks, opinions and views on certain things, which again, is cool, I understand that, but what I don't understand is how you, living out there amongst whoever and me actually living here in Detroit amongst black people, can sit up and claim with absolute certainty that what I'm saying is false.

[ccal]

ccal- what are you doing to stop them and deter the problem? If you deal with these people on a daily basis, why don't you speak up and turn them in?

It's not my job to deter anyone from committing crime out at Somerset,thats what security and Troy Police are paid to do.
I didn't say anything about dealing with them, I said I encounter them on a daily basis.

[ccal]

ccal, it seems like you're missing the point. No one is disputing that there may be black people that steal from Somerset. No one is saying that notion is "impossible" or that we can't "suspend belief" and that you need to convince us. You are debating points that no one is debating back.

What people are saying is that unless you are all-seeing and all-knowing, you cannot know three things:

[[1) what percentage of people stealing from Somerset are black [[compared to other races/ethnic groups)

[[2) what percentage of black shoppers are thieves

[[3) what the unnoticed or unreported crime statistics are at Somerset [[because the crimes are unnoticed or unreported), and how those statistics compare to other malls [in other words, Joe White Guy and his band of thieves might be stealing every day from Twelve Oaks]

If you say that you know black people that steal from Somerset every day, I believe you. [[But I might also suggest that you need to find better friends.) I think what people find so objectionable [[and I don't claim to speak for everyone, I am just surmising) is this:

The original poster came out with a preposterous claim, that Somerset is near dead because "the clientele has taken a drastic shift the past 5 or so years". Everyone with half a brain can read his coded message, which in essence is: "Look at all the black shoppers. This place must then be crime-infested."

What is so unsettling is that you are just adding fuel to his fire, in essence saying, "He's right! Black people do steal!" Well yes, some do. Most don't. And some people of other races/ethnic groups steal too. But it just seems that you are trying to cry from the mountaintops about how much black people steal.

It seems like people are getting offended because what I'm saying is an unpopular fact that either they don't know anything about it or again they simply don't want to believe it. You make alot of assumptions from a little bit information and that weakens your argument, show me where I said these people were my friends? I'm not making a statement about other malls or other ethnic groups, only one mall, one ethnic group, one city, period. Somerset is THE best mall in Michigan, hands down, they have everything people here in Detroit might want or covet so that's where thieves go to steal the stuff that everybody has or wants. I won't apologize for being blunt but there is no elegant way to say "Theft happens at Somerset on a daily basis and black people from Detroit are responsible for a majority of it". I can't give you hard numbers or percentages, go out to the mall and and talk to security or talk to Troy Police, until then you can't say without a doubt that I'm wrong.

[Downtown Lady]

there is no elegant way to say "Theft happens at Somerset on a daily basis and black people from Detroit are responsible for a majority of it". I can't give you hard numbers or percentages

I'll just let that statement speak for itself.

[ccal]

ccal, it seems like you're missing the point. No one is disputing that there may be black people that steal from Somerset. No one is saying that notion is "impossible" or that we can't "suspend belief" and that you need to convince us. You are debating points that no one is debating back.

What people are saying is that unless you are all-seeing and all-knowing, you cannot know three things:

[[1) what percentage of people stealing from Somerset are black [[compared to other races/ethnic groups)

[[2) what percentage of black shoppers are thieves

[[3) what the unnoticed or unreported crime statistics are at Somerset [[because the crimes are unnoticed or unreported), and how those statistics compare to other malls [in other words, Joe White Guy and his band of thieves might be stealing every day from Twelve Oaks]

If you say that you know black people that steal from Somerset every day, I believe you. [[But I might also suggest that you need to find better friends.) I think what people find so objectionable [[and I don't claim to speak for everyone, I am just surmising) is this:

The original poster came out with a preposterous claim, that Somerset is near dead because "the clientele has taken a drastic shift the past 5 or so years". Everyone with half a brain can read his coded message, which in essence is: "Look at all the black shoppers. This place must then be crime-infested."

What is so unsettling is that you are just adding fuel to his fire, in essence saying, "He's right! Black people do steal!" Well yes, some do. Most don't. And some people of other races/ethnic groups steal too. But it just seems that you are trying to cry from the mountaintops about how much black people steal.

The OP said that in his personal view and others that he associates with don't think Somerset is safe or desirable to shop at anymore because of crime and other things, then people on here poo pooed him and asked to cite what
crime he was talking about, OP posted what crime he was talking about. People shrugged those crimes off as if they never happen or made them out to be isolated incidents and said that Somerset is still a "safe place blah,blah,blah...." and so forth even though his people's perceptions may or may not be wrong, which they are entitled to. In this case,perception is reality and I chimed in to give my take of the crimes that are taking place at Somerset that isn't being reported on the news and now I'm being poo pooed, is that about the gist of this whole thing?

[ccal]

I'll just let that statement speak for itself.

And I'll let the fact that you haven't actually went out there to find out for yourself speak for itself.

[Downtown Lady]

And I'll let the fact that you haven't actually went out there to find out for yourself speak for itself.

You are so missing the point. You cannot assert something as fact without evidence to back it up. Evidence other than "I know some people that steal." If you want your assertion to be accepted as fact, the burden of proof is on you, not someone else. Produce the statistics instead of telling us to go chase down the statistics.

[p69rrh51]

You are so missing the point. You cannot assert something as fact without evidence to back it up. Evidence other than "I know some people that steal." If you want your assertion to be accepted as fact, the burden of proof is on you, not someone else. Produce the statistics instead of telling us to go chase down the statistics.

DL when my sister was here working at Somerset in Feb. I spent quite a bit of time there. I personally observed far fewer blacks in the mall in general than last year and the blacks I came into contact with were purchasing goods and services like most everyone else at the mall. One young black male spent almost 100k over a 2 week period and my sister was quite happy with her commissions. His people are probably bragging they steal things from Somerset but probably go to Oakland Mall!

[ccal]

You are so missing the point. You cannot assert something as fact without evidence to back it up. Evidence other than "I know some people that steal." If you want your assertion to be accepted as fact, the burden of proof opinion acceptedU], not someone else. Produce the statistics instead of telling us to go chase down the statistics.

Do this instead, don't tell a person whom you don't know or don't know what they do for a living ,what they dont know. You're making an informed opinion about something you don't have all the information about yet you're talking about evidence , how can you arrive at any conclusion at all? I don't believe in speaking or debating at length with people about things I don't know about, its foolish. Again, until you go out there and see for yourself rather than try and get me to do it for you, why speak on it?

[dtowncitylover]

It's not my job to deter anyone from committing crime out at Somerset,thats what security and Troy Police are paid to do.
I didn't say anything about dealing with them, I said I encounter them on a daily basis.

Then you really need to get out of your environment.

[dtowncitylover]

Do this instead, don't tell a person whom you don't know or don't know what they do for a living ,what they dont know.

You're right we don't know you. We don't know at whether you are black. This is the internet, we can say anything we want. You could very well be a white person promoting a very negative stereotype. From what we have all read on Freep's comment section, racist white people have too much time on their hands.

[Downtown Lady]

don't tell a person whom you don't know or don't know what they do for a living ,what they dont know.

I never said a thing about what you know or don't know. YOU SAID "I can't give you hard numbers or percentages" -- I am only repeating back to you WHAT YOU SAID, that you cannot provide data. As I said earlier, if you want to make an assertion, PROVIDE THE DATA. To tell US to go chase the data to help make YOUR POINT is ridiculous.

[iheartthed]

I'm black, born and raised in Detroit and these are the people I encounter on a daily basis.

All you're telling us is that you know a bunch of black Detroiters who steal. Show us how you know that the majority of people who shoplift at Somerset are black.

[Downtown Lady]

Again, until you go out there and see for yourself rather than try and get me to do it for you, why speak on it?

I'm not trying to get you to do SQUAT for me. I'm saying, if you want to prove YOUR POINT that "black people from Detroit are responsible for a majority of [the crime at Somerset], it is YOUR responsibility to prove that, NOT MINE.

[ccal]

You are so missing the point. You cannot assert something as fact without evidence to back it up. Evidence other than "I know some people that steal." If you want your assertion to be accepted as fact, the burden of proof is on you, not someone else. Produce the statistics instead of telling us to go chase down the statistics.

you don't know me and I don't know you so I would never take an opposite tack in a argument about something I have no knowledge of and or about. You ask for evidence of said crimes and or proof, let me ask you question, let's pretend in your world that this happens to be true, afterwards, what are you going to do about it? Are you going to try and stop it? Will you start patrolling Somerset? Do you plan on tackling folks who are stealing. Its obvious you care so much about it so I want to know, what are you planning?

[ccal]

I'm not trying to get you to do SQUAT for me. I'm saying, if you want to prove YOUR POINT that "black people from Detroit are responsible for a majority of [the crime at Somerset], it is YOUR responsibility to prove that, NOT MINE.

No you're wrong. Its not my responsibility, to say that sounds crazy. I don't have to prove anything, its happening.

[dtowncitylover]

No you're wrong. Its not my responsibility, to say that sounds crazy. I don't have to prove anything, its happening.

If you ever go for a PhD, you are going to have a really hard time. Or frankly, any thesis-based paper at uni.

[ccal]

If you ever go for a PhD, you are going to have a really hard time. Or frankly, any thesis-based paper at uni.

I'm done. Good day.

[dtowncitylover]

I'm done. Good day.

Bye, have a good night!

[Shollin]

This thread has inspired to go to Somerset this weekend to see all this crime.

[Downriviera]

Just read this entire thread nonstop. I need a drink now real bad.

[313WX]

Can someone put this thread out of its misery?

[Downtown Lady]

Can someone put this thread out of its misery?

SOMERSET! SOMERSET! Let's catch up to Garwood.