Detroit college student True Whitsey 18 - fatally shot in front of younger brother

[canuck]

I can't even begin to tell you how these two stories sicken me. Three young men, doing something positive with their lives, not only trying to make themselves better, but their communities, and their country, snuffed out by some POS. Where's the outrage?

Yeah, to think that this soldier who was serving in one of the poorest most retrograde countries on earth gets shot for a pair of shoes in front of his girlfriend, in his hometown, in the richest country on earth certainly kicks me in the butt.

[corktownyuppie]

Let us not forget the money due to the city through unpaid taxes by corporations and intrest groups or persons

That's fair. And we should collect every dime we're owed. But still, the important question, even if we had that money, would that money to go to funding more cops? And how long will it last?

We can't throw on any more band-aids. We need to reinvent the whole system.

[Danny]

I'm predicting that 450 homicides in 2013 would happen in the ghettohoods in Detroit. It's time to bring in the National Guard to patrol that streets.

[Meddle]

^^ Nawh, just get Thommy Hardon to patrol, he can fix it all with a video.

[Jaybiz]

Well more cops on the streets of Detroit would certainly help. More cops, more cars, more visibility and vigilance. The idea that a thousand more police would not help is ridiculous.

It might help short term but if you have violent sociopaths who put absolutely no value on human life and all the money in the world is not gonna help the problem.

[canuck]

It might help short term but if you have violent sociopaths who put absolutely no value on human life and all the money in the world is not gonna help the problem.

Yes but if New York is down to 400 murders a year, there must be something right in increased policing. Sociopaths are shy of daylight like vampires.

Like the vampires in the "Toilet" series of motion pitchers.

[Bham1982]

Yes but if New York is down to 400 murders a year, there must be something right in increased policing. Sociopaths are shy of daylight like vampires.

I agree that an increase in police would help Detroit.

But, in NYC, the police ranks are actually down considerably from previous years. The crime rate has fallen even as the police ranks has shrunken [[and this is in a city with fairly robust population growth).

I think the biggest factor in the NYC crime drops is demographic change within the city. NYC is much richer than in the past, and the "bad areas" are increasingly filled with hard-working immigrants and gentrifying hipsters, not American-born ne'er-do-wells.

But NYC did have a buildup of cops around 15-20 years ago, when the crime rate first began to fall.

[canuck]

No doubt bham1982 that the stronger police force in the Clinton years brought about a change. The new immigration form Asia was an important factor in how the city rebuilt its neighborhoods. You have in New York a series of cycles that typically last 20 years where whole ethnic tribes move from one area, one borough to another but small mom and pop stores are a staple wherever they move to.

[MommaDrizzly]

Agreed.

I imagine what Logan and Bing were trying to do instead was mimic the "Sorry, we're broke" rhetoric from Bing/Snyder.

But instead of their statement coming across like this...

"The catastrophic crime wave we're experiencing in this great city of Detroit is absolutely unacceptable and as leaders we do take full responsibility for not doing more to prevent the killings of 386 of our fellow citizens throughout the past year. However, given the city's precarious financial situation, we just don't have the resources alone to put anymore patrol officers in our street and we're begging on hands and knees for ANY help that can be offered by surrounding jurisdictions, in addition to ANY help from federal and state law enforcement agencies."

Instead, both Logan and Bing came across as bumbling idiots by not only blaming the folks in this city who keep food on their tables, but also ignorantly stating that we DON'T need more resources at all to address what has become a third-world crisis.

Yeah, their answers were basically, well, we tried nothing, and nothing worked, so let's keep doing nothing.

[stasu1213]

That's fair. And we should collect every dime we're owed. But still, the important question, even if we had that money, would that money to go to funding more cops? And how long will it last?

We can't throw on any more band-aids. We need to reinvent the whole system.

We can't go out and as Bing suggested "Hug a Thug" to solve the problem. Lower my tax dollars if I have to go out and apprehend the bad guy. It is hard for a potential rapist, mugger, or hoodlum to concentrate on doing their craft we they have to constantly look over their shoulder to see if a squad car is approaching. Especially if the area is prowling with squad cars up and down the streets. I believe in mentoring young people before they get into trouble but Pugh's using that statement as his answer instead of admitting that the deep cuts that he and other council members had made to public safety had resulted in less police patrol and high crime in the city

[davewindsor]

Well more cops on the streets of Detroit would certainly help. More cops, more cars, more visibility and vigilance. The idea that a thousand more police would not help is ridiculous.

I don't know how a thousand more cops would make a significant difference in the current system. What they need is a thousand more prisons and a three strikes you're out rule. And if they can't afford more prisons, then a three strikes and you get the death penalty rule.

[Meddle]

And if they can't afford more prisons, then a three strikes and you get the death penalty rule.

So, maybe Cuba or Rwanda or Nigeria style? You break law, you die, [[unless you are part of government).

[davewindsor]

So, maybe Cuba or Rwanda or Nigeria style? You break law, you die, [[unless you are part of government).

It would be its own category--Detroit style. I doubt any of those countries would give you a second or even third chance.

[Zacha341]

I went to the candle-light vigil at the crime scene for this young man last night. His mother asked people to come out. She war remarkably composed... there were many tears and prayers. One of his classmates remarked on camera his disillusionment that he and True had just gotten 'out' of the city to start their college studies [[their lives) and were not planning on returning. And then this.

It's very hard to encourage young people to do the right thing, study hard and achieve when this kind of senselessness happens.

[Zacha341]

Oh! They [[other places like China, Irac, Sudan etc.) probably laugh at our 'patty-cake-with-criminals' judicial system! These folks are tough [[sometimes for the just and the unjust) but you do repeat crimes or in some cases 'one' criminal offense and you simply disappear!

Case closed.

It would be its own category--Detroit style. I doubt any of those countries would give you a second or even third chance.

[Honky Tonk]

So, maybe Cuba or Rwanda or Nigeria style? You break law, you die, [[unless you are part of government).

Were LIVING in a Rwanda or Nigeria type environment. Criminals spend 90 days eating 3 squares a day, watching Judge Judy, get let out, and back to business as usual. How much tax money gets eaten up @ $65K a year per criminal? Enough with the criminal rights already. Let's look @ the victims for a change.

[canuck]

You want leniency, look no further than Canada. There is the case of this cardiac surgeon in a small suburb of Montreal who was upset at his recent separation from his wife also a physician. He got back at her by killing his two young children and tore their hearts out. He spent two years in a Mental institution for the criminally insane after he was deemed not responsible due to looniness. He is now out on condition he receives therapy. In court, he has repeatedly said he wanted to be reinstated as a surgeon, meet a new mate and have children. Pat on the back.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/13/world/...sed/index.html

[Zacha341]

^^^ Probably some crazy woman wanting to marry him too. I hear Manson gets a number of annual proposals..........

[canuck]

^^^ Probably some crazy woman wanting to marry him too. I hear Manson gets a number of annual proposals..........

Yeah, there are tons of tough cookies in prison that get this kind of attention from lady kooks on the outside.

To think this guy is scott free and wants to practice medicine again, wants to marry and have children. It is probably going to happen too. When he killed his kids he faked trying to kill himself with antifreeze and was admitted to the hospital where he was a doctor. He was treated by his peers and a friend of mine told me [[something that was not admitted in court as evidence) that a nurse told her he had torn the kids heart out not just stabbed them. Even if he was not criminally responsible because of mental illness, what makes it Ok for him to be out and about among free people? There are folks out there who have been abused by the courts for a lot less.

[davewindsor]

You want leniency, look no further than Canada. There is the case of this cardiac surgeon in a small suburb of Montreal who was upset at his recent separation from his wife also a physician. He got back at her by killing his two young children and tore their hearts out. He spent two years in a Mental institution for the criminally insane after he was deemed not responsible due to looniness. He is now out on condition he receives therapy. In court, he has repeatedly said he wanted to be reinstated as a surgeon, meet a new mate and have children. Pat on the back.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/13/world/...sed/index.html

These kind of cases where murderers avoid life sentences using insanity defences are really rare in Canada. For every one that happens in Canada, there's probably over 100 similar ones in the States.

The population of Montreal is 1.7m [[3.7m in metro). Do you know how many homicides happened in Montreal last year? 35. Same as in 2011 and similar in previous years. Of that 35, only 10 were domestic disputes. [[ http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montre...zed-crime.html ) How many homicides in Detroit with approx. 700K people? 375 in 2012 [[ http://www.detroitmi.gov/Departments...tatistics.aspx ). Big difference. Over 25x the rate of Montreal.

The article also stated that the Harper government is changing the law to make it tougher to let murderers that are deemed criminally insane to be released from custody by doctors.

[villagejack]

It's a tragedy that our leaders/ congress we have voted in has spent trillions [[that's millions of millions!) on the current two foreign wars...... some of our cities are flat BROKEN.... I've worked for the government and I've seen inefficiencies first hand so I'm not suggesting just throwing money at the problems.....what if 100,000 professionals were hired for years [[as in these two wars) to focus on problem urban areas: teaching, policing, organizing communities, helping citizens with education, health....what else? Am I ignorant, naive? What else would help? I hear my suggestions sounding cliche...but isn't it absurd that our own cities are left to die?

[villagejack]

The lack of toughness on the criminals has to change. Ideas? I'm not for brutality but the criminal justice system is not working.