Shoddy construction in Royal Oak?

[ghettopalmetto]

Of course there exist engineering limits for construction, don't be such a blowhard. I said none were ever POSTED on this particular balcony. I've spent a great deal of time on it, believe me, nothing has ever been indicated by any signage.

Blowhard, nothing. I've never seen signs posted for load limits on a balcony. Do you have signs posted within your own residence? A design load of 100 psf is quite conservative...the idea is to have a conservative enough design that such silly signs are not necessary. It's not like the average person would know what 100 psf looks like, even if a sign were posted.

But, of course, everything has to be some sort of conspiracy with you.

[Zacha341]

Thanks for that link. What a bunch of match-sticks-and-elmers-glue basically! I bet the thing is really sound proof - like you can hear a mouse peeing on cotton... all for top prices. As someone commented to the article you need to check the construction of a building before you buy!

here's more detail:

http://royaloak.patch.com/articles/s...#photo-9956370

Structure Tec has some serious issues with the construction

[DetroitHabitater]

For those who are fascinated by structural failures check out this book! It's very thorough and should be required reading for every engineering ethics class.......unlike mine which you basically just had to show up to pass.

http://www.amazon.com/Why-Buildings-...ings+fall+down

[Gannon]

But, of course, everything has to be some sort of conspiracy with you.

Of anything on this side of the boad, at least that which doesn't include a Kwhyme or McNamara or Ficano, this is the closest to a conspiracy that I can remember!

The evidence is the shoddy construction...the rush to build...the boasting of the builder to be anti-union...fact the corner unit sold with ugly HVAC engineering...with loose quality everywhere, including the construction of this very public eyesore of a balcony.

The balcony IS the tip of the iceberg here...and evidence of some collusion between the builder and at least a few employees of the city.

In our litigious society, I am quite surprised that newly-constructed residential balconies in the metro area do not have load limits posted...you are right that many have no idea what 100 pounds per square foot might be like. We don't have enough warning signs around...heh.

After the disasters they had in Chicagoland, it is a VERY expensive prospect to build balconies and rear stairways there...they inserted a firm requirement that all plans have to be drawn up by architects and engineers. Good on them...sorry people had to die for logic to enter the equation.

But here, it is clear that even WITH city oversight...this shod can be laid and declared worthy for sale at extraordinarily high prices. That building was not inexpensive for being so cheaply made.

So yeah, after reading the Patch comments section, I am sensing a conspiracy here...

[bailey]

But here, it is clear that even WITH city oversight...this shod can be laid and declared worthy for sale at extraordinarily high prices. That building was not inexpensive for being so cheaply made.

I "looked" [[using the term lightly...mostly just kicking tires and looking to gauge prices at the time) at a place in that building once just before I moved back here. It was a short look. IIRC the second building wasn't done yet. The prices were stratospheric. IIRC they were asking $625-630,000 for the 2 story, corner unit...and oh yeah, another 35k[[?) if you wanted an extra parking spot.

Nothing about that place made sense. It felt and looked cheap. The fixtures in the model were junk, the cabinets/countertops were terrible, the sliding doors didn't work. a lot of the units looked right at the Memphis smoke's roof top deck [[bet that's fun about 1 am any nice night in the summer) and the post office parking lot as well as other parking lots. At one point i just couldn't NOT laugh at the developer's realtor trying to sell it. I apologized for wasting their time and went on my way.

IIRC at one point not too soon after they started bombarding my email with offers of 2 year Land Rover leases to entice people to buy.

I don't know what they actually sold them for...hopefully for those who bought them, no where near what they were orginally trying to get people to pay.

[Gannon]

You were wise to avoid this place.

Before furnishing, that big corner unit was much less than $600k. He had at least two parking spots. I programmed the opener code into my old Audi wagon's visor buttons, and used one whenever I went to downtown Royal Oak.

But you're right...a bunch of stuff he simply replaced. I have the roller track from the original sliding door to that ill-conceived utility/laundry room, it became part of my basement party room. It was, if I remember correctly, the very first thing he changed.

But if you were there, you can imagine...the cold-air intake shot straight through the wall into the hallway. Because of the track for that sliding door, they didn't bother to finish the baffling of the intake, causing an unbelievable roar throughout the unit when the heat turned on. I can still remember the look in his face when it fired up...I could almost see him calculating what it would take to get out of this 'deal'.

His deck did look right across at Memphis Smoke's rooftop, and if you wanted to be part of that party it wasn't tough. More than a few of the upper-yuppies caught my secondhand smoke. It was more fun to look down on the outside tables of the old Lebanese restaurant...with all the hookah-toking hipsters.

Cheers!

[DetroitHabitater]

Building and safety departments exist for a reason, but in my experience they are normally packed to the gills with failed builders who had a family member in government with a FEW exceptions that I've met.

I've got a good story about BSE hijinx.

I was down at Detroit BSE in probably 2007 getting permits for something. In the lobby there were tens of thousands of rolls of blueprints and engineering drawings in the waiting area. I asked my friend who works there [[one of the few competent people) what they were. He said they were the drawings for the MGM casino.

Apparently the Casino wanted to pay a bulk fee for their plan review and did so. Meanwhile the plan reviewers wanted to be paid per page like they normally do. As a result the reviewers would not review them and would not file them in the plan room and they ended up collecting dust in the lobby.

Meanwhile a few short blocks away...the MGM was well under construction with unreviewed plans.

Another victory for local government.

[Gannon]

An enterprising team of thieves could use those for some gainful employment.

Ocean's Fourteen-Detroit.

[rb336]

An enterprising team of thieves could use those for some gainful employment.

Ocean's Fourteen-Detroit.

back years ago when I delivered pizza, I walked in with ten pizzas for a company and was escorted into a room and told that the money would be there in a minute. out on the tables were the wiring diagrams for the cruise missiles

[Bham1982]

The prices were stratospheric. IIRC they were asking $625-630,000 for the 2 story, corner unit...and oh yeah, another 35k[[?) if you wanted an extra parking spot.

Wow, you're a much better person than I; I would have burst out laughing at that price.

So 660k for a crappily built apartment in a noisy, congested location, along with high taxes, average schools and a region where multifamily is always a tough resale. No thanks!

[bailey]

Wow, you're a much better person than I; I would have burst out laughing at that price.

So 660k for a crappily built apartment in a noisy, congested location, along with high taxes, average schools and a region where multifamily is always a tough resale. No thanks!

I think you missed it in my post. I did start laughing. I couldn't help it. When I was questioning the rather astronomical price for a) royal oak, and b) the overall chintzyness of the place , she started blathering on with "Oh, but in New York or Chicago, you'd pay 1 million at least for this type of loft...its just a STEAL at this price" I lost it. I was actually kind of a dick to the poor chick who was just doing her job [[which seemed to consist of having big boobs and ability to memorize a script). But whatever. I got over it. lol. Clearly they found other suckers to fleece.

[wolverine]

Of anything on this side of the boad, at least that which doesn't include a Kwhyme or McNamara or Ficano, this is the closest to a conspiracy that I can remember!

The evidence is the shoddy construction...the rush to build...the boasting of the builder to be anti-union...fact the corner unit sold with ugly HVAC engineering...with loose quality everywhere, including the construction of this very public eyesore of a balcony.

The balcony IS the tip of the iceberg here...and evidence of some collusion between the builder and at least a few employees of the city.

In our litigious society, I am quite surprised that newly-constructed residential balconies in the metro area do not have load limits posted...you are right that many have no idea what 100 pounds per square foot might be like. We don't have enough warning signs around...heh.

After the disasters they had in Chicagoland, it is a VERY expensive prospect to build balconies and rear stairways there...they inserted a firm requirement that all plans have to be drawn up by architects and engineers. Good on them...sorry people had to die for logic to enter the equation.

But here, it is clear that even WITH city oversight...this shod can be laid and declared worthy for sale at extraordinarily high prices. That building was not inexpensive for being so cheaply made.

So yeah, after reading the Patch comments section, I am sensing a conspiracy here...

Design load Ive seen in communities I've worked in is 50-100 psf or building owners will post signs. "No more than 30 occupants on this balcony". Which is pretty crowded. The worst balcony accident in US history collapsed under the load of 100 people on a wood joist / post supported balcony. It initially appeared 100 people was "overloaded," but it was later determined to be a design failure and had it been designed to code it should have been capable of supporting all those people. Landlord and contractor at fault.

[poobert]

If anybody is seriously considering buying a home in Royal Oak, older is better. Forget the overpriced newer condos and lofts and invest in a nice old house with good, strong bones.

I find this to be true anywhere. As for me, I wouldn't buy anything built after the Second World War...started...in Europe.

[DetroitHabitater]

I can't believe all the finger pointing has allowed this to be a safety hazard to everyone for this long

http://www.wxyz.com/dpp/news/sagging...-getting-fixed

[Malcove Magnesia]

I rented in this building for a little while so I know a little bit more than what the news articles are talking about. The "structural issue" for this building is that the south side foundation is sinking, and all the owners in this building are on the hook for tens of thousands of dollars for the repairs.

I've actually been considering this kind of real estate [[modern space versus a house that has tons of potential fixer-upper issues) and so this makes me worried that other buildings in the downtown Royal Oak area have the same construction issues. Of course no seller [[or agent) is likely to fess up about these kinds of problems. Aside from the inspection, is there any other way to protect oneself?

[Scottathew]

I'd love to live in Downtown Royal Oak, however the prices were always too outrageous for me. I got a much larger house in Rochester Hills with a yard for a fraction of the price.

[Danny]

For over 5 years. The 111 Main St. and 11 Mile Rd lofts were poorly built. The Wood beams were in danger of collapse and the slum owner of the complex has giving people the run-around. Plus it ruined a little bit of the property values in the section on Royal Oak. Folks and businesses in Downtown Royal Oak don't want to see premature blight or an instant 'ghetto' in their area. Royal Oak city council will make sure those owners of any property in the business district will follow required building codes of face heavy fines. Royal Oak remains a friendly bedroom suburb, but with all the building development it won't be happy family home for long but a city filled the hipsters, homosexuals and whatever people.