Socialistic health care goal of the traitors in power

[Bigb23]

Warning, I do not condone the following message.

Dear XXXXX,
It seems that the mainstream media has finally decided to dispense with the pointless denials of favorable coverage of the Obama Administration. Now one network, ABC News, has actually turned its entire programming over to President Obama and his big-government agenda.
On June 24th, ABC News and anchor Charles Gibson will broadcast "World News" from inside the White House, and make Barack Obama's case for nationalized health care for him, without any opportunity for opposing views to be aired.
The liberal special interests have clearly learned from their missteps the last time they tried to force Americans into a socialized health care system -- the abysmal failure of the Clinton Administration's "HillaryCare."
That's why their friends at ABC News will be promoting Obamacare at virtually every opportunity, from "Good Morning America" to "Nightline," and reach from ABC News' websites all the way to the White House's East Room.
XXXXX, the Republican National Committee's request for an opportunity to add our views along side those of the Obama Democrats' -- to ensure that all sides of the health care reform debate are heard -- was flatly rejected by ABC News.
What are the Democrats and their media allies afraid of? The truth?
That is outrageous! And we will not take it!
Please help us raise the nearly $100,000 we need to buy air time to get the truth about the disastrous consequences of the Obama Democrats' government-run health care plans out to the American people. Make a special donation of $25, $50, $100, $500 or $1,000 to the Republican National Committee today, and your gift will support our fight to counter the ABC/Obama "special programming" with our plan for meaningful, genuine health care reform.
Please stand with us. Help us get on the air and get our message to the American people! President Obama and the Democrats are blurring the lines between government and the private sector to pass their big government agenda. Help us keep things clear. Thank you.
Sincerely,

Michael Steele
Chairman, Republican National Committee
P.S. XXXXX, we must get the truth about the Obama Democrats' health care takeover to the American people. Help us counter the one-sided broadcast by the Democrats and their media allies. Please take this opportunity right now to support our cause by making a special, online contribution of $25, $50, $100, $500 or $1,000 to the RNC today. Thank you.

This crap keeps showing up in my Inbox, but I read them for my amusement. They don't seem to acknowledge the Fox network, the Rush Limbaugh/Hannity shows and all the other claptrap on the cable/airwaves.

What do you think ?

[rb336]

never mind the fact that the CBS, NBC and ABC sunday shows regularly have more right-wing guests than left-wing guests, and that the right wing guests are from the extreme right while the left is mostly represented by centrists [[no? when was the last time a real liberal like Dennis or Nader was given air time?)

Never mind the fact that all the news networks couch the debates in terms dictated by the republican talking points...

[WolverinesA2]

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/...W_VkQD98RT3V81
HHS Secretary Kathleen Sebelius said Insurance companies wont succeed.
I'm sure the commie in power will make sure of that.
Hey bitch ^, get of out of our lives and let us decide what we want and need.

Obama wants socialistic single payer [[government controlled) health insurance.
He want to dictate physicians pay, as like some companies he now runs.

The marxist lying hypocrite president who most of you elected here, will ruin the health care system in this country.

now have a good day


Think about how the US runs the VA. They lie about illnesses and deny or give poor care to the armed forces they are supposed to help.

Look at Canada and England, try getting an MRI or prostate check or surgery there if you are a citizen you need to wait months, or die.

[Linda from Detroit]

As far as government controlled health care, here's some news I just heard. One of the watchdog agencies has found that the VA facilities in 3 states [[GA and TN are two of them) have been found to not have even been properly trained in endoscopic procedures that they have been performing. Nice, huh? Isn't that the kind of care we all need? Heck, my husband has had bladder cancer for over a year...and is STILL waiting for surgery at the VA. He is a totally disabled Marine. I am eligible for VA care because of his status and it's horrible. I tried it once and they missed a compressed spinal cord. By the time I found a regular doctor who did the testing I had permanent nerve and muscle damage, can't walk properly or use my right arm or hand completely. Please, folks...a little care isn't always better than none. I agree we need reform, but consider what the government has already done to patients who have to rely on them...it isn't going to get better. Now they want "deep cuts" in Medicare. That is what the families of totally disabled vets already are tied in with and you're lucky to even have a PA look at you and pooh pooh whatever you tell them. Please don't encourage Congress to rush through a mess just to get Obama off their backs...haste makes waste and this is one time they need to read things or many lives could be lost thanks to idiocy.

[rb336]

just think a little true/false info is needed

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2008/februa...bout_canad.php

[WolverinesA2]

As far as government controlled health care, here's some news I just heard. One of the watchdog agencies has found that the VA facilities in 3 states [[GA and TN are two of them) have been found to not have even been properly trained in endoscopic procedures that they have been performing. Nice, huh? Isn't that the kind of care we all need? Heck, my husband has had bladder cancer for over a year...and is STILL waiting for surgery at the VA. He is a totally disabled Marine. I am eligible for VA care because of his status and it's horrible. I tried it once and they missed a compressed spinal cord. By the time I found a regular doctor who did the testing I had permanent nerve and muscle damage, can't walk properly or use my right arm or hand completely. Please, folks...a little care isn't always better than none. I agree we need reform, but consider what the government has already done to patients who have to rely on them...it isn't going to get better. Now they want "deep cuts" in Medicare. That is what the families of totally disabled vets already are tied in with and you're lucky to even have a PA look at you and pooh pooh whatever you tell them. Please don't encourage Congress to rush through a mess just to get Obama off their backs...haste makes waste and this is one time they need to read things or many lives could be lost thanks to idiocy.

I wouldn't paint all VAs with the same broad brush. The quality of any VA is going to depend on the quality of the medical and administrative staff who run the place, just like any other hospital. Have you ever been to the Ann Arbor VA? It's nice. Do you think you would receive substandard care there as opposed to any of the hospitals in Wayne County?

[firstandten]

just think a little true/false info is needed

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2008/februa...bout_canad.php

That was a good read. I hope folks don't let the facts get in the way of a RW talking point.

Obama has said OVER and OVER and OVER again

If you like your present health care plan you can keep it, health care reform won't affect you other than to make your premiums cheaper.

He wants a public option, he is not promoting single payer health care for all.

He is open as to what the public option entails, he expects that it will cover people who need it at an affordable rate. Other than that he is wide open as to what the public option will look like.

http://www.factcheck.org/politics/mo...are_scare.html

And for those that still want to equate Obama with Socialism, Marxism or any other ism that RW's want you to be scared about here is a short quote from his speech on June 17

"I've always been a strong believer in the power of the free market. It has been and will remain the engine of America's progress -- the source of prosperity that's unrivaled in history. I believe that jobs are best created not by government, but by businesses and entrepreneurs who are willing to take a risk on a good idea. I believe that our role is not to disparage wealth, but to expand its reach; not to stifle the market, but to strengthen its ability to unleash the creativity and innovation that still make this nation the envy of the world."

[rb336]

He wants a public option, he is not promoting single payer health care for all.

what the wingnuts are afraid of is that with a public option to keep them honest, they won't be able to pay the boss 1B/year anymore.

Why is it that the republicans couldn't include in their "option" [[sham, more accurately) a requirement that neither the insurance co. or the govt. can over ride a health care decision made by the doctor and patient?

oh -- i just got this: the same guys who are trying to force women to carry a fetus to term regardless of health issues, rape, incest, etc, are the same now pushing the "govt can't get between the patient and doctor" bit. priceless

[firstandten]

Why is it that the republicans couldn't include in their "option" [[sham, more accurately) a requirement that neither the insurance co. or the govt. can over ride a health care decision made by the doctor and patient?

The republicans are so politically bankrupt they jump up and down saying Obama's plan costs too much. We are going to present our own plan to counter the Democrats... They come up with a 3 page document with no figures [[ I guess they forgot that little detail)

Republicans = the party of no !

[gibran]

How many here have actually had problems with health care related issues from a first hand persepctive other than talking points and AMA, AHA or Insurance perspectives?

has anyone ever had to see admission personal telling many families seeking services for a person with TBI that their insurance wouldn't cover the real treatment that they needed to recovery... so I got sick of Insurance Doctor's playing bean counters and bean counters playing Doctors; when I knew there were effectively designed TBI programs that worked with people...

has anyone ever had to wait a year to get treatment because of a pre-existing condition? Or denied treatment payment for a precancerous growth because of an insurance loophole [[ guess they wanted it to become cancerous)....

has anyone had to take a person home from the hospital after a stroke in two weeks and then see their elderly partner ahve to take care of them?

NOW tell me we don't need reform.

[MCP-001]

I thought right wingers claim he was born in Indonesia. You guys need to stay consistent with your propaganda.

Actually, I'm an independent. Nice try.

Second. It's a well documented fact that as a child, Obama spent some time in Indonesia.

You ought to read his bio.

You'd be surprised at what does [[and doesn't) turn up.

[Sstashmoo]

The term "insurance" should never be uttered in the practice of medicine. When it comes to mine or a loved one's well being, the thought of some company official involved with their bottom line, their first priority, is unacceptable. We pay them a fee to wager our well being, that's fine, but stay the hell out of the examination room. That's one thing that needs to be changed.

[oladub]

Obama has said OVER and OVER and OVER again

If you like your present health care plan you can keep it, health care reform won't affect you other than to make your premiums cheaper.

He wants a public option, he is not promoting single payer health care for all. .

The Congressional Budget Office, not exactly a RW outfit, adds that Obama's government-run health care system would cause 23 million Americans to lose private coverage, cost $1 trillion dollars [[over 10 years) and still leave 30 million uninsured. This isn't exactly a single payer plans such as Ontario's.

http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArti...30132594100938

At least there is some good news for union workers.

There has been discussion about how to fund the new Obama health care plan. One taxation target is employees who already had health care programs. Employer contributions to their plans was to be taxed. Now a new proposal has been introduced to not tax the benefits of already insured union employees. That means other insured workers will pay a little more to make up the difference.

http://laborpains.org/index.php/2009...healthcare-tax/

"I've always been a strong believer in the power of the free market. It has been and will remain the engine of America's progress -- the source of prosperity that's unrivaled in history. I believe that jobs are best created not by government, but by businesses and entrepreneurs who are willing to take a risk on a good idea. I believe that our role is not to disparage wealth, but to expand its reach; not to stifle the market, but to strengthen its ability to unleash the creativity and innovation that still make this nation the envy of the world"

-President Obama who took over GM, voted to give failing and corrupt Wall Street firms billion$, and contradicted himself after saying this with a straight face.

[Linda from Detroit]

No, I know that the AA VA isn't bad. I have a brother in law that goes there. That doesn't mean that there aren't long lines and procedures that are denied/delayed. My husband used to go to the Allen Park one. He has also gone to 2 different ones in Ohio, one in WV and 2 in Kentucky. One in Ohio refused to give him cholesterol medicine because of the cost...he had lost weight, exercised and it wouldn't come down on it's own. The result? He had a major heart attack at 39. Then, at another facility, it was found he had a hydroseal and possible rupture. They went in for rupture surgery [[which he didn't need) and because he was opened up that way, drew the wrong testicle up through his abdomen and damaged it to the point it later had to be removed by an outside doctor...oh, yes, and they never fixed the hydroseal. The outside doc offered to support us in a law suit, but we decided not to proceed. Then, he had a problem with one of his eyes...went to the ER in Huntington, the doc gave him some eye medicine [[no big deal, right?) and sent him home with a follow up appointment with the VA specialist in 8 days. Sounded like they were on the ball. Well, after a couple of days, the eye started burning, having vision disturbances. He thought maybe it was the one medication and stopped using it. Thank God. When he saw the specialist, the guy had a total fit. That med was only supposed to be used for the first day. It had started to destroy his retina and he lost part of his sight. I know, it sounds like hubbys name should be Lucky, doesn't it? The thing is these things are happening all the time in the VA system. It is the rare facility that does a consistently good job. And yes, there are plenty more things I could tell you about the VA system. I've been a volunteer there for about 18 years simply because some of us care and try to do what we can to at least provide a pleasant atmosphere for those who deserve our help and care. In any event, maybe your experiences have been good or acceptable. If so, I'm very happy for you. Just understand it isn't all that common when the government is involved. Oh, by the way...did you also know that many VAs don't have a lot of meds available? Not horribly expensive ones either. If you want to know more, please let me know and I'll be glad to give you more information. Have a great day.

[gibran]

one thing is true..we all will be recipients of the current health care system at one point or another; in one way or another...the question is how will it treat you and do you think it needs improvement? From many different vantage points...

[rb336]

The Congressional Budget Office, not exactly a RW outfit, adds that Obama's government-run health care system would cause 23 million Americans to lose private coverage, cost $1 trillion dollars [[over 10 years) and still leave 30 million uninsured. This isn't exactly a single payer plans such as Ontario's.

http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArti...0132594100938.

I would never trust Investors Business Daily coverage of anything. If you can find the actual budget office report, i'd like to see it

[quote=oladub;34341]There has been discussion about how to fund the new Obama health care plan. One taxation target is employees who already had health care programs. [/quote]

that plan was from the republicans during the campaign

[oladub]

I would never trust Investors Business Daily coverage of anything. If you can find the actual budget office report, i'd like to see it.

Ok. Here is another messenger to shoot. Hope I don't have to eventually go to Mother Jones. Nothing is in stone yet, but-

"A health care reform bill proposed by Sen. Ted Kennedy’s committee would cost more than $1 trillion over 10 years while still leaving millions of people uninsured, according to a preliminary estimate released Monday by the Congressional Budget Office."
"The CBO concluded that by 2017, for example, the ranks of the uninsured would drop by about one third, or 16 million people, relative to projections under the current law.

In that year, about 39 million would be covered by policies purchased through a government-organized marketplace known as an exchange. At the same time, however, 15 million would lose their employer provided insurance and another 8 million would move away from coverage they receive through government programs, the analysis concluded."
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0609/23784.html

[Bigb23]

Linda from Detroit - We all have gone through this at one time or another, and not just through the VA. To maximize profit, or savings, both the VA and private hospitals will go with the least expensive method to maximize dollars to the administrators of the plan itself. Be it the government or stockholders. Now is the time we have to trim down the mess that has evolved over the past 40 years. Nobody seems to investigate the plus or minuses of social programs used in Europe. Hey we can all throw out talking points, but why don't we look at other methods ?

[Mikeg]

Man goes to Buffalo for life-saving treatment
By Sonja Puzic, The Windsor Star, June 17, 2009

....He sought treatment in Detroit and had a consultation with an oncologist there but didn’t get OHIP’s approval to proceed because of a simple mistake in the paperwork, Meghan said. Frustrated, the couple spent hours on the phone, calling doctors, the Ministry of Health and local politicians, hoping that someone could help them.
But while they were scrambling to secure Hunt’s treatment in Detroit, there was a change in OHIP rules.
OHIP will now only cover Hunt’s cancer treatment in Buffalo, NY, where the Roswell Park Cancer Institute is the ministry’s only “preferred provider� of IL-2 treatment for metastatic malignant melanoma.....

Say a prayer for Mark Hunt.

[Linda from Detroit]

I'm not against exploring alternatives, I just don't want things to get even worse. And, I do know some folks that haven't had these sorts of things happen. Thank God for that! When my dad was dying of lung cancer I had to get an ambulance and get him out in the middle of the night because of the way he was being treated at Oakwood. Hope it's gotten better since then.

[ccbatson]

I will be honest, neither road is a pleasant one...either way, the socialistic elements of our health care system are past the tipping point of viable recovery and a tiered system is on its' way. Expanding the scope of the entitlement and pumping more money into the sinking ship is just going to accelerate the process.

[Bigb23]

From the British National Health care System website -

Accessing healthcare in Denmark


General information

You will be treated on the same basis as a resident of Denmark. Remember, each country’s health system is different and might not include all the things you would expect to get free of charge from the NHS. This may mean that you have to make a patient contribution to the cost of your care. You may be able to seek reimbursement for this cost when you are back in the UK.
Treatment, coverage and costs

Doctors
Consultations with your doctor are covered. However, you should ask if the doctor is registered with the Danish public health service and show your EHIC as you may be charged for some medical care otherwise. You can claim back the full amount of the doctor’s consultation should you have been charged.

Dentists
Consultations with your dentist are covered. However, you should ask if the dentist is registered with the Danish public health service and show your EHIC as you may be charged for some medical care otherwise. If you have been charged the full price, you might be able to claim back part of certain dental costs. These charges are non-refundable in Denmark but you may be able to seek reimbursement when you are back in the UK.

Hospital treatment
Hospital medical treatment is free of charge. It will normally be arranged by a doctor. If you cannot see one, show your EHIC to the hospital authorities on admission and ask them to arrange free medical treatment for you.

Prescriptions
You will be charged for prescribed medicines. Refund rates for approved medicines may vary. There are no refunds of expenditure under DKK 445 for patients over 18. For children, however, you can apply for up to 50% expenditure refunds. This is non-refundable in Denmark but you may be able to seek reimbursement when you are back in the UK.

You will be given a special card to register your prescription purchases when you visit a pharmacy. If not, keep all your prescriptions and original receipts and apply for a refund at the local municipality [[Kommune).

Ambulance
The use of an ambulance or a 'Special Sick Vehicle', in emergencies, is free of charge.

Air ambulance
There are no special rules for transport by air ambulance.

What a god awful socialist system. They might have to pay out of pocket for medical care.

And did you see this word ? - [[Kommune). That reeks of Stalin to me.

http://www.nhs.uk/NHSEngland/healthc...redenmark.aspx

[turkeycall]

Many of the VA Hospitals are located in large urban areas, but not all veterans who are eligible for care live anywhere near a facility. In order to receive care or treatment, the veteran must travel many miles, often relying on the generosity of a friend or relative for transportation. It happens, quite often, that an appointment is made, personal transportation is lined up, the veteran arrives at the VA facility on time, but the appointment is cancelled with no prior warning.

How about this?:
1. Shut down all the VA Hospitals. A considerable savings will be realized. No electricity to pay for, no heating bills, no building maintenance. No operating expense for infrastructure. No salaries for medical, maintenance, and administration staff.

2. Issue to every eligible veteran an identification card which contains the codes for whatever benefits he or she is entitled to. The card can be used to receive care at any hospital.

3. The hospital invoices the VA. The VA pays the invoice.

This way, a veteran living in, let's say, Muskegon doesn't need to line up transportation to go to Battle Creek - or wherever the VA Hospital is - thereby killing a whole day on the road, in waiting rooms, and receiving what might be second or third-rate care. The veteran can go to Mercy General in Muskegon and receive first-rate care.

Seems doable to me.

Those opposed to a National Health Care System want to equate it with the VA system. A real National Health Care Sytem of the single payer type will allow the use of local doctors and hospital facilities. The quality of care will not be compromised. The wait times for diagnostic procedures such as MRIs, CTs, and the like won't be affected.

The difference will be that instead of the hospitals billing an insurance company, the bills go to the regional Universal Health Care administrative office for payment.

[rb336]

if you bothered to read the report, instead of relying on right-wing stooges for your news, you would have seen that the bulk of the $1 trillion would come as subsidies to insurance purchased through an "insurance exchange" -- in other words, paid to PRIVATE insurance companies. there is no mention of what the cost would be to create a medicare-type system that companies and individuals could buy into. THAT is why I am against what is currently being proposed.

[turkeycall]

rb,
In your last post, to whom are you replying?