Trayvon Martin: Amazed no one has posted this....

**Meddle** · April-20-12, 06:11 PM

Originally Posted by Kevgoblue

That he left his vehicle against the direction of the PD and apparently iniated some type of confrontation.

Getting your ass whipped, in a fistfight that you started, still does not justify using lethal force.

None of the bolded is true. You know that, yet you refuse to see it.

**Kevgoblue** · April-20-12, 09:43 PM

The first statement is indisputable. The other 2 are my opinion.

GZ in his defense will have to rely on the "reasonable person" standard.
Even the act of getting out of his vehicle to persue TM will fall short here. A teen walking down the street, talking on a cell phone is certainly not sufficient to convince a reasonable person that some type of criminal occurance is eminant.

Sorry Meddle. Absolutely nothing in GZ's story passes the smell test.

**Johnnny5** · April-25-12, 08:33 PM

More background on George Zimmerman and the burglary issues in his Sanford, FL neighborhood prior to the death of Trayvon Martin.

http://news.yahoo.com/george-zimmerm...194235114.html

**Detroit Stylin** · April-26-12, 11:51 AM

Originally Posted by Johnnny5

More background on George Zimmerman and the burglary issues in his Sanford, FL neighborhood prior to the death of Trayvon Martin.

http://news.yahoo.com/george-zimmerm...194235114.html

So what does this have to do with him carrying a gun in his duties an NW, following Trayvon when he was told not to, and then confronting him when he was almost home?

**Det_ard** · April-26-12, 02:10 PM

Originally Posted by Detroit Stylin

So what does this have to do with him carrying a gun in his duties an NW, following Trayvon when he was told not to, and then confronting him when he was almost home?

Nothing. Don't worry, no matter what facts come to light you won't be required to consider them or open your mind to alternatives to your preconceived notions.

Most people made up their minds on this case early on, based on their own race or views on race in America, not on facts, which were and still are in short supply. The case in question is just a Rorschach test for our deeply held prejudices and beliefs.

**Crumbled_pavement** · April-26-12, 09:08 PM

I love how people have time for the facts to come out when someone like George Zimmerman is accused of something. They weren't so patient with Nidal Hasan. Hmmm, I wonder why that is?

Of course if Zimmerman would have just waited for the facts [[or the police) we wouldn't even have to bother with all this. Ahhh, but that's too sensible of answer. What was I thinking?

**Johnnny5** · April-26-12, 10:38 PM

Originally Posted by Crumbled_pavement

I love how people have time for the facts to come out when someone like George Zimmerman is accused of something. They weren't so patient with Nidal Hasan. Hmmm, I wonder why that is?

Of course if Zimmerman would have just waited for the facts [[or the police) we wouldn't even have to bother with all this. Ahhh, but that's too sensible of answer. What was I thinking?

Perhaps because there was never any reason to doubt that Nidal Hassan murdered innocent people? He massacred 13 soldiers and there were dozens of eye witnesses [[Many of them injured). You don't see how that's a little different than a possible self defense shooting where the only eye witness is the shooter himself?

**Crumbled_pavement** · April-27-12, 06:51 PM

Originally Posted by Johnnny5

Perhaps because there was never any reason to doubt that Nidal Hassan murdered innocent people? He massacred 13 soldiers and there were dozens of eye witnesses [[Many of them injured). You don't see how that's a little different than a possible self defense shooting where the only eye witness is the shooter himself?

I see a lot of differences. One of which you conveniently overlooked. However, Zimmerman's description of the events that took place doesn't make sense. I see a lot of sympathy for him nonetheless. Let's keep waiting for all the facts [[particularly ones that can at least be twisted or distorted to prove Zimmerman is innocent.. I mean we already know he is).

It was just a worthless teen that got killed anyhow. We got plenty of time. We can rush to judgment when important people get killed.

**Bobl** · April-28-12, 05:31 PM

Marissa Alexander, in Florida:
After getting a personal protection order from her estranged husband, he shows up, gets combative, refuses to leave. She gets her registered hand gun and fires a warning shot through the roof. The State Of Florida charges her with a crime that might get her a twenty year sentence. Meanwhile, Dudley DoRight kills a kid who was minding his own business, after the police told Dudley to back off. He gets nearly a quarter million dollars, and counting!

**Thames** · April-28-12, 09:09 PM

Originally Posted by Det_ard

Nothing. Don't worry, no matter what facts come to light you won't be required to consider them or open your mind to alternatives to your preconceived notions. The article that Johnny5 posted above, cements that.

Most people made up their minds on this case early on, based on their own race or views on race in America, not on facts, which were and still are in short supply. The case in question is just a Rorschach test for our deeply held prejudices and beliefs.

George Zimmerman is the one that had the preconceived notions. The article that Johnny5 posted above, cements that.

George Zimmerman admitted that TM was running away. Listen to the tape.

TM was running AWAY from GZ but somehow a bullet from GZ's gun ended up in TM chest.

We all have the fight or flee instinct in us, if we feel menaced or threatened.

TM ran first, clearly that didn't work, because GZ didn't let up.

If there was physical contact on TM's part, I would see that as the natural progression of a human instinct.

**Detroit Stylin** · May-03-12, 06:06 PM

Originally Posted by Thames

George Zimmerman is the one that had the preconceived notions. The article that Johnny5 posted above, cements that.

George Zimmerman admitted that TM was running away. Listen to the tape.

TM was running AWAY from GZ but somehow a bullet from GZ's gun ended up in TM chest.

We all have the fight or flee instinct in us, if we feel menaced or threatened.

TM ran first, clearly that didn't work, because GZ didn't let up.

If there was physical contact on TM's part, I would see that as the natural progression of a human instinct.

TM had as much a right to defend himself as did Zimmerman...

**vetalalumni** · May-04-12, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by firstandten

Zimmerman's only hope in this case is if his lawyers can muddy the waters with this self defense claim they are going to use. As much as I hate it, it could work due to the lack of witnesses that saw the actual incident.

Personally I don't believe the self defense story, but with many years of jail staring at him, I can't blame him for doing it.

The prosecution on the other hand will have the recreate the incident timelines and movements of TM and GZ to such an extent that reasonable doubt doesn't come into play.

I think its going to be a tough case for the prosecution to win a second degree murder verdict.

Some facts will surely be questionable. Unfortunately, actions of the Sanford police department, or lack thereof, will allow for substantial disputation of facts.

Hopefully, in the end, the truth [[fact and law) will prevail.

Regardless of the outcome in this particular case, it will remain important to all Americans that Stand Your Ground [[as written) is carefully evaluated.

**jerrytimes** · May-06-12, 12:46 AM

I hope that the law does prevail here, and I think a lot of people will be angry at the outcome. I do believe that Zimmerman is guilty of something, and the prosecuter is wrong with calling that something murder.

**jerrytimes** · May-06-12, 12:53 AM

I don't understand how a city like Detroit can have over 300 murders annually, and non of them ever get any national attention and no one outside of the area seem to care, yet this gets so much attention.

**Zacha341** · May-06-12, 08:54 AM

To some extent it is because black on black crime has less value [[relative to the participants and its frequency, etc.) and media traction for those who have an agenda.

Originally Posted by jerrytimes

I don't understand how a city like Detroit can have over 300 murders annually, and non of them ever get any national attention and no one outside of the area seem to care, yet this gets so much attention.

**Detroit Stylin** · May-06-12, 01:10 PM

Originally Posted by jerrytimes

I don't understand how a city like Detroit can have over 300 murders annually, and non of them ever get any national attention and no one outside of the area seem to care, yet this gets so much attention.

Maybe becuase people are still choosing to leave their blinders on in this case even in light of the pile of evidence that continues to get bigger against Zimmerman ands Sanford PD, os that this 'man' was allowed to walk away and remain free for almost two months after shooting an unarmed teenager. I dont give a damn how big he was he was still just seventeen and unarmed. SO THATS is why this gets more attention than a murder in Detroit does.

Oh and asides the fact that when the murder gets caught, he gets ARRESTED IMMEDIATELY, not set free while the 'investigation' goes on....

**Meddle** · May-06-12, 02:29 PM

^^ Speaking of having blinders on.

**Wheels** · May-06-12, 04:45 PM

Originally Posted by Detroit Stylin

Maybe becuase people are still choosing to leave their blinders on in this case even in light of the pile of evidence

In your case I have heard the pile described as coprophilia.

**Zacha341** · May-06-12, 05:31 PM

^^^^ Yikes! I looked that up! Not a good time IMO - Yeck! --

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**Meddle** · May-07-12, 01:00 AM

Originally Posted by jerrytimes

I don't understand how a city like Detroit can have over 300 murders annually, and non of them ever get any national attention and no one outside of the area seem to care, yet this gets so much attention.

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2...text|FRONTPAGE

**Peppermint Patty** · May-17-12, 03:14 PM

Originally Posted by Detroit Stylin

TM had as much a right to defend himself as did Zimmerman...

That is what is so puzzling about this case. I have read comments on several news sites, blogs, and mostly from people identifying themselves as White, they conclude that Trayvon should have just answered George Zimmerman's questions without apprehension. But this is a child regardless of his size and a human with the fight or flight instinct who was approach by a cocky stranger. Who in their right mind would not try to get away from that type of danger? Better yet, if that stranger seemed hell-bent on following you without answering your question [[Trayvon did ask him why is he following him) a normal human being would freak out. I know I would and I would definitely fight to save my life. Trayvon has that right. I think the biggest shock for me and a lot of Black Americans is the fact that many many many of us had no idea about SYG. All we saw was a child killed and no arrest and we just do not understand how this shoot-first-maybe-ask-questions-later mentality translated into becoming an actual law. It is as if White males received a memo that the rest of America did not receive and it has left us puzzled and we cannot make sense of this unjust law without it being played out for us in a court of law. That is why so many Americans and those in the international community are crying foul...because this law is foul and mostly favors White males. I just don't get how anyone cannot see the INJUSTICE in this case...forget race because this could be ANYBODY'S CHILD!

**Meddle** · May-17-12, 03:33 PM

Originally Posted by Peppermint Patty

That is what is so puzzling about this case. I have read comments on several news sites, blogs, and .....

But apparently, you haven't read any of the facts.

**Peppermint Patty** · May-17-12, 05:34 PM

The issue I was commenting on is the SYG law. It blindsided a lot of people who did not know such a lawless law actually existed.

**firstandten** · May-17-12, 09:51 PM

Originally Posted by Peppermint Patty

The issue I was commenting on is the SYG law. It blindsided a lot of people who did not know such a lawless law actually existed.

Thats why its important to stay informed on what policies these right-wing groups like the NRA are pushing in your state and in Washington. They count on flying under the radar when they push these laws in the various states

**Jimaz** · May-17-12, 10:42 PM

Originally Posted by firstandten

... They count on flying under the radar when they push these laws in the various states

Which raises the question of why they feel so comfortable using deceptive tactics against their own potential voters in the first place.

Dishonest politicians don't need any more support than they already have.

Don't support them.