DDOT Sickout: No Bus Routes Today

[animatedmartian]

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/dpp/news/local/video-shows-ddot-bus-brawl-that-led-to-the-halt-of-detroit-bus-service-20111104-mr

Witness says bus driver started fight. Wonder if that changes anything about the situation though...

[Detroitnerd]

Lots of heat on this thread. Not much light, though.

First, you should clear away misconceptions if you want to see things clearly. One misconception I see here over and over again is "they don't want to work." Really? Is that why they have a difficult, stressful job that they go to every day? Because they don't want to work? That just doesn't make any sense. This is just something to say so that you can blare:

FIRE THEM ALL!

I'm sure it feels good to say that, but even though the full-blown thermonuclear Reagan-on-PATCO option is a dearly held tenet of lots of blustering types, it only defers the real problems...

You see, in my experience, behind every compromised work force is poor management. You can tell right away when you enter a place that has good management: The workers are happy, helpful, get the job done and send you on your way. Similarly, the sullen, unhelpful work force at some establishments tells you the managers are stupid assholes.

Now, all this is unrelated to the issues of sick-outs and such. But if you guys really want to see the problem for what it is, let's have less of these emotional, knee-jerk reactions and look at the management's part of the problem too.

Hmmm, maybe that means that Bing and the Clownsil should be fired? Worth a thought...

[SWMAP]

I think that the working people of Detroit will sympathize with the drivers. Those of us who work for a living can certainly understand that no one should have to put up with violence on the job. Agree here with Ordinary - they did what they needed to do to get enough attention to their work dangers to get get action. It was bad for everybody, but action appears to have been taken pretty quick.

[Danny]

Let corporations take over Detroit. Let them run D-DOT, Let them run Detroit Public Schools, Police Fire Dept, its waterworks, its public lighting dept, its tax dept.

It may happen in 100 years just like the book Snow Crash.

[Danny]

Take a good look at the D-DOT service back the 1985!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NEvAm...eature=related

[Danny]

GOOD NEWS FOLKS!

D-DOT Busses will resume its routes!

http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/29686072/detail.html

But for how long?

[downtownguy]

No. DPD sued for the DDOT Transit Police contract back in [[I think) 2009, and won. In theory, DPD officers should be randomly patrolling the buses now, but it's pretty rare for them to actually do so. I don't actually remember the WCS officers patrolling the buses for extended periods of time [[when I used to see them they usually got on, rode a couple stops, recorded the bus number, and got off again), but they did respond very promptly when drivers called them for help.

Thanks for the answer antongast. The Detroit News had a little more on this in today's paper:

Friday's walkout is the second in recent years. In May 2007, DDOT drivers shut down the system for a day because of concerns about safety. Later that year, City Council approved a hotly contested plan to have undercover Wayne County Sheriffs' deputies ride the city's buses, using a three-year, $11.7 million federal grant. However, the Detroit Police Officers Association fought the plan, claiming its officers should patrol the city's buses. An arbitrator ruled for the DPOA in 2009, and Detroit officers took over the patrol duties, although the grant has since expired.

[jt1]

First, you should clear away misconceptions if you want to see things clearly. One misconception I see here over and over again is "they don't want to work." Really? Is that why they have a difficult, stressful job that they go to every day? Because they don't want to work? That just doesn't make any sense. This is just something to say so that you can blare:

FIRE THEM ALL!

It's not so much that they don't want to work it is that they have no desire and no concern for their customer base.

I'm sure it feels good to say that, but even though the full-blown thermonuclear Reagan-on-PATCO option is a dearly held tenet of lots of blustering types, it only defers the real problems...

You see, in my experience, behind every compromised work force is poor management. You can tell right away when you enter a place that has good management: The workers are happy, helpful, get the job done and send you on your way. Similarly, the sullen, unhelpful work force at some establishments tells you the managers are stupid assholes

.

Can we agree that the drivers, mechanics and management all likely need to be fired. There's no question leadership fo DDOT is completely incompetent but the workers [[drivers and mechanics) have shown they don't care about their customers. There are mechanics that are taking 2-3 times that of their peers to make basic repairs [[which is also an issue of mismanagement) and I don't think anyone would disagree that there is an intentional work slow down. We have drivers that will stage a sick out with complete disregard for the customers. If safety was such a problem they should have been making some noise prior to this extreme measure. Up til now the only thing that the union has been vocal about is that maintenance doesn't have the parts to perform repairs. The argument of driver safety hasn't gotten much attention and the union reps certainly haven't been making an issue of it.

Do I think driver safety is an issue? Yes. I just question why the tactic was to stay relatively quiet about it then take extreme action at the detrimental of your customers.

Now, all this is unrelated to the issues of sick-outs and such. But if you guys really want to see the problem for what it is, let's have less of these emotional, knee-jerk reactions and look at the management's part of the problem too.

Hmmm, maybe that means that Bing and the Clownsil should be fired? Worth a thought

Agree the city leadership and council are on the hook for this, just as the union leadership is as well. Can we agree to fire Bing, council, management and union leadership, implement reforms and metrics that will determine how work is being performed given the right tools then allow that the underperformers may quickly be fired?

[detroitsgwenivere]

No jt1, we will not all agree with that.

I was dependant on the bus system for more than 6 years, and during that time, i saw a lot.

What used to royally piss me off was watching dozens of school kids take over the bus every week day from 2-6. I'm not sure how many of you are aware of this, but several of the DPS and most of the charter schools in both Detroit and the burbs DO NOT provide busses to get these kids home after school, so the DDOT/Smart buses are expected to baby-sit all of these kids, some as young as 4 and 5. Imagine trying to get your bus down the road safely when you have a bus full of children throwing shit, spilling shit, fighting, yelling, talking on the phone, playing music, trying to climb out of and/or throw stuff out of the windows, and telling you to get f*cked when you tell them to sit down and be respectful of other passengers.

And let's not forget the parents who will get on the bus to cuss the driver out when the parent has to wait an extra fifteen minutes at the corner for their kid, if they even bother to meet them at all.

I had a Smart driver who once dumped an entire bus load of us in the dopehood off Gratiot south of 6mile at 10:30pm because he lost it after kids on his bus kept pulling the cord and cussin at him. One of them threw something at him and that was the last straw. Having lived in bad neighborhoods before, i wasn't that upset about being in a shit part of town, but most of the other people were freakin out. So I took the leader role, kept us all together, kept everyone talking to keep their minds off of the fear of not knowing where they were. After conversing for a few, it became apparent that most weren't pissed off at the driver, they were pissed off at the kids. They understood the dynamics of the situation because they see what i see: bus drivers hosting Romper Room everyday, which Im sure was not agreed upon in their contract.

Bus drivers expect hassels with kids and grown people, but lots of these kids act like it's a free-for-all on the bus. My support is with the drivers, and they have every right to demand safety for themselves and for their passengers. I EXPECT that from them as a passenger.

[R8RBOB]

Take a good look at the D-DOT service back the 1985!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NEvAm...eature=related

All I can say is WOW.

I would recommend going to YouTube to see these videos.

[jcole]

The "Fire them all" contingent don't seem to be taking into consideration that IF they fired all the bus drivers, that would have put the bus system out of commission a hell of a lot longer than about 12 hours. You would have to take applications and vet all of the applicants to make sure they have chauffeur's licenses or are eligible to get one and then fight with the union to get them driving those busses.

[R8RBOB]

No jt1, we will not all agree with that.

I was dependant on the bus system for more than 6 years, and during that time, i saw a lot.

What used to royally piss me off was watching dozens of school kids take over the bus every week day from 2-6. I'm not sure how many of you are aware of this, but several of the DPS and most of the charter schools in both Detroit and the burbs DO NOT provide busses to get these kids home after school, so the DDOT/Smart buses are expected to baby-sit all of these kids, some as young as 4 and 5. Imagine trying to get your bus down the road safely when you have a bus full of children throwing shit, spilling shit, fighting, yelling, talking on the phone, playing music, trying to climb out of and/or throw stuff out of the windows, and telling you to get f*cked when you tell them to sit down and be respectful of other passengers.

And let's not forget the parents who will get on the bus to cuss the driver out when the parent has to wait an extra fifteen minutes at the corner for their kid, if they even bother to meet them at all.

I had a Smart driver who once dumped an entire bus load of us in the dopehood off Gratiot south of 6mile at 10:30pm because he lost it after kids on his bus kept pulling the cord and cussin at him. One of them threw something at him and that was the last straw. Having lived in bad neighborhoods before, i wasn't that upset about being in a shit part of town, but most of the other people were freakin out. So I took the leader role, kept us all together, kept everyone talking to keep their minds off of the fear of not knowing where they were. After conversing for a few, it became apparent that most weren't pissed off at the driver, they were pissed off at the kids. They understood the dynamics of the situation because they see what i see: bus drivers hosting Romper Room everyday, which Im sure was not agreed upon in their contract.

Bus drivers expect hassels with kids and grown people, but lots of these kids act like it's a free-for-all on the bus. My support is with the drivers, and they have every right to demand safety for themselves and for their passengers. I EXPECT that from them as a passenger.

When I saw the "fire them all" comments, I ignored them because 1) this is a forum and the poster can post whatever they like and 2) they are posting purely out of fantasy so it can't be taken seriously.

When you commented on how students were riding the buses alongside regular passengers, I had to go back in time when Detroit had a dollar or two in its coffers and remembered how DOT had "Student" buses. I was going to Ford in the late 80's and they had the buses parked on Fargo for the students to jump on go home. Now they force the students to pack themselves with customer and its holy hell.

[compn]

i love the people saying fire them all.yeah guys, fire the bus drivers. who are you going to get to drive busses for those wages when passengers are THREATENING THEM WITH KNIVES? anyone jumping up to drive the busses? anyone with signs in front of city hall saying 'i'll drive the bus!' ? no?some people here are comparing it to 9/11, thats actually a good point. multiple people have said the two things that made us safer since then are stronger cockpit doors and having the pilots carry guns.so whos up for some protective glass around the drivers area [[like taxi drivers have) and give them weapons to fight back?

[carmellieB]

I agree. Lets just be fair and don't take sides.