The Jewish Wedge and Black Migration Through The City

[ruth]

CAREY recommends Sugrue's "Origin of the Urban Crisis." THat's a great place to start. If you're interested I recommend:

June Manning Thomas "Redevelopment and Race"
David Katzman "Before the Ghetto: Balck Detroit in the Nineteenth Century"

Two more great reads on how segregation got such a strong foothold in a working class town.

[iheartthed]

Yep, I agree with this. Baby Boomer metro Detroit Jews are in West Bloomfield/Farmington Hills, with some of their parents' generation and some Orthodox Jewish communities still in Oak Park/Southfield [[I see them walking on Fridays/Saturdays when I go visit my family), but their Gen-X and Millennial highly educated children are moving out of state. This is a huge loss. Jews have historically been, and many still are, at the vanguard of the creative and entrepreneurial classes. Yet the loss of a generation and a half of talent has largely been ignored [[or distorted and mocked, like the reaction to Granholm's "Cool Cities" initiative). I have seen people here and heard people offline assume that these folks will come back "once they have kids" or "once they need to take care of Mom and Dad." I don't get why we have our heads in the sand. They are putting down roots in other cities, and when the time comes, they will go and get Mom and Dad, or Mom and Dad are already looking to move to the Sun Belt or a more viable retirement location.

And although people don't like to admit this or observe this, I will repeat what I've said here for nearly 8 years: you are finding the same pattern among highly educated Gen-X and Millennial African-Americans from metro Detroit with options. This entire group would MUCH rather be in Chicago, San Francisco, NYC, or a Sun Belt metro than in Detroit... my most ambitious and upwardly mobile black friends have an "anywhere but Michigan" attitude. Those of us who are still here tend to be educators, municipal types, and a few are still attached to the auto companies [[although many of the engineers my age were caught up in the last recession and have also migrated away).

This is creating a leadership crisis for the city, the region and the state. Some time ago, I started a thread asking "Where is our Cory Booker?" Well, he's now living in San Francisco, working for a dotcom or in NYC working for a hedge fund, and shrugging whenever his friends marvel that he came out of the "armpit of America" [[as one of my uncle's Stanford buddies nicknamed Detroit).

I was born, raised and educated in Michigan, but very little of my network is still there. I probably know more young professionals from the Detroit area in my age range [[25 - 30 years old) who live here in NYC than live in Metro Detroit; I most certainly know more who live in other areas of the country than in the metro area. And of the people I know who do still live there a significant number of them are planning to leave soon.

Michigan is setting up for an ugly demographic shift and I don't see it ending well. I'm afraid that it might end up something like what happened in Pittsburgh, where a massive loss of young adults after the collapse of the domestic steel industry set off a population contraction that lasts for decades. The population losses there were originally because of residents fleeing for economic reasons, but now is because of "attrition" since the remaining population was top heavy and those people are dying out.

[Gistok]

Maybe it's an assimilation thing in their respective former countries?

I have family links to the metro German community, and most Germans who came post WWII are actually from Eastern Europe [[yes former parts of East Prussia, but also places like Hungary and Romania, which had Carpathian Germans and the like).

So these folks spoke German and identified as German, but they came from Eastern European countries, and sometimes had non-German last names. There are plenty of these folks on the East Side, and there's even a sizable Carpathian Club somewhere in Sterling Heights, I think.

I think you pretty much covered it. I am a member of Carpathia Club. Germans had been migrating to Eastern Europe since the 1180s when the Transylvanian Saxons [[who were such a pain in the side of Vlad Dracul [[the real person whom Dracula was patterened after) from their fortified towns in the Carpathian mountains) migrated there from the German Empire.

There were the Volga Germans, the Danube Swabian Germans, the Bessarabia Germans, the East Prussians, the Silesian Germans, the Sudeten Germans, the Bukovina Germans, and many others living in their own small towns and villages of eastern Europe, and maintaining their German language and heritage [[although the longer you were away from Germany, the more difficult the dialects became to understand by other Germans).

When the Turks were driven out of much of the Balkans, Austrian Empress Maria Theresia offered Germans and Austrians free land in the lower Danube regions, especially where Hungary, Serbia and Romania's borders come together. Before the end of WWII... there was a mass migration of 13 million ethnic Germans that moved back to Germany proper, before the onslaught [[and slaughter) of the Russians moving westward towards Berlin [[and the rest of eastern Europe).

In many ways, the Jews followed a similar pattern of moving eastward towards Russia in earlier centuries. Since Christianity had the Usury laws [[forbidden to charge interest on moneylending), many rulers in western Europe borrowed money from Jewish moneylenders. Eventually they owed so much money, that rather than paying it back... they banished and persecuted the Jews who settled farther eastward. Eventually many ended up in Russia and Poland, although they retained their Germanic names and the Yiddish language [[a variation of German). These were known as the Ashkenazi Jews [[as opposed to the Sephardic Jews of Spain and other areas).

[ghettopalmetto]

In many ways, the Jews followed a similar pattern of moving eastward towards Russia in earlier centuries. Since Christianity had the Usury laws [[forbidden to charge interest on moneylending), many rulers in western Europe borrowed money from Jewish moneylenders. Eventually they owed so much money, that rather than paying it back... they banished and persecuted the Jews who settled farther eastward. Eventually many ended up in Russia and Poland, although they retained their Germanic names and the Yiddish language [[a variation of German). These were known as the Ashkenazi Jews [[as opposed to the Sephardic Jews of Spain and other areas).

Interesting! Thanks for sharing. It also helps explain why there aren't many Jews named "Kowalski". :-)

[socks_mahoney]

Interesting responses. Thanks everyone. I did a little research after reading this and discovered that aside from the young people moving out of state, a lot of the young Jewish people who remain in SE Michigan are moving back to Detroit. Some of them actually voted themselves onto the board of the Downtown Synagouge and now a "Moishe House" [[not quite sure what that entails) has opened in the E Ferry/Art Center neighborhood with the intention of recreating a young Jewish neighborhood. sounds like quite the task. worthwhile though.

[IrishSpartan]

Actually, you may still find a few older Jewish people in Mount Clemens. The mineral baths drew a number of Jewish people into town, and many of them remained into the 1970's-1980's. The last mineral bath hotel in Mount Clemens closed around 1974. Also, Mount Clemens had 2 Jewish mayors in the last 50 years:
Abraham Levine 1961-1973
Ada Eisenfeld 1981-1985

Interesting assessment by Bham.

I think in the future this can be a major area of academic interest. For right now, I think there are a couple factors to consider, besides what Bham said:

Both Jewish people and African Americans are EXTREMELY cohesive social, economic, religious, and ethnic networks. Italians and Poles become assimilated into mainstream America after a couple generations - blacks and Jews are always blacks and Jews to mainstream America. They continue to maintain almost exclusive, closed networks with other blacks and Jews. This, in part, could explain "patterns" of migration. One close-knit group leaves a void where another moves in. You can find pockets of other ethnic groups in Metro Detroit almost everywhere[[or where they becomes nothing but vast stretches of middling Americans), but good fucking luck finding a Jewish person in Macomb County. As such, both groups were/are severely marginalized by said mainstream society.

I would, however, resist reading into it too far. Jewish people have congregated together since time immemorial. Part of this is totally pragmatic, in that they need to worship together, and that in proportion to the total population, there are so few of them. However African Americans can be found in significant numbers in almost all of the suburbs nowadays, aside from the exburbs. So it stands to reason that as the Jewish people continue to sprawl out [[and their children move back to the city or away entirely, but that is another topic) that African-Americans move in.

[56packman]

I knew and elderly gentelman, now deceased, who was born in 1916. We talked about this issue one day and his answer was rooted in the time he came up in, and what was probably a prevailing attitude, simply that white, Christian [[Catholic/Protestant) people would not buy a home that had been owned by Jews because "the house would be filthy"--indicating that the prevailing attitude was that Jews were somehow not as cleanly as Christians, a statement I knew to be false and based in prejudice.
These tracts of available homes, with no other buyers became available to the black population as they earned their way up the ladder.

[Wingnatic]

taken from the link I posted #18
'' As each generation of Jews became more educated, more successful, more American, and more assimilated, the wish to demonstrate all those features strengthened and took the form of new and bigger or better homes in new neighborhoods. Yet more than a quest for symbols of educational and economic achievement accounts for the regular relocation of whole communities. Federation surveys implied that, for all their tolerance, many Jews retained stereotypic views of African Americans and feared living in the same neighborhoods, although they often supported civil rights and defended blacks in that arena. In the Hastings Street neighborhood, long after Jews had moved their residences from there, they retained businesses. In the 1920s, 1930s, and 1940s often only Jewish merchants would allow blacks to shop in their stores. And only Jews would sell their businesses to blacks as white, non-Jewish racists grew more hostile to black neighbors – and to Jewish neighbors or businessmen. As black workers moved into Detroit, they occupied the areas in which Jews lived, and fears or prejudices on both sides fostered the Jewish moves.''

[szla]

Actually many Jews did not follow the classic Hastings, Woodward, NW movement. I worked at a place [[Hunters Ridge Farmington Hills) where many older Jews lived and had many conversations with them about a lot of things. Many Jews came over with their respective ethnic group [[Poles, Russians, Romanians) and set up shop along many of the arteries [[Michigan, Chene, Jefferson) and lived above the store for years going to school at the Chadseys, NE and other places. It wasn't till the 30s and 40s that many of these people joined the movement NW. And there were still Jews living in some of these situations till just recently. A woman who I befriended had a brother who just died and lived in an upstairs apartment off Chene. As to their ethnicity most who would be over 90 considered themselves Polish Jews. Not so much anymore but 20 years ago huge numbers spoke fluent Polish.

[English]

I was born, raised and educated in Michigan, but very little of my network is still there. I probably know more young professionals from the Detroit area in my age range [[25 - 30 years old) who live here in NYC than live in Metro Detroit; I most certainly know more who live in other areas of the country than in the metro area. And of the people I know who do still live there a significant number of them are planning to leave soon.

Michigan is setting up for an ugly demographic shift and I don't see it ending well. I'm afraid that it might end up something like what happened in Pittsburgh, where a massive loss of young adults after the collapse of the domestic steel industry set off a population contraction that lasts for decades. The population losses there were originally because of residents fleeing for economic reasons, but now is because of "attrition" since the remaining population was top heavy and those people are dying out.

I wish I could make Rick Snyder, Dave Bing, and every other elected official in this state read your post every morning with their coffee. This is the #1 long term challenge we face, in my opinion. We don't need to lose any people who might contribute to the health and turnaround of the region, yet the attitude for decades has been "don't let the door hit ya."

[dtowncitylover]

Actually, you may still find a few older Jewish people in Mount Clemens. The mineral baths drew a number of Jewish people into town, and many of them remained into the 1970's-1980's. The last mineral bath hotel in Mount Clemens closed around 1974. Also, Mount Clemens had 2 Jewish mayors in the last 50 years:
Abraham Levine 1961-1973
Ada Eisenfeld 1981-1985

And to add on, there is still a synagogue in Mt. Clemens. There is even a Reform congregation in Downriver, another unlikely place one would find a Jewish community. However, these congregations are most likely very small, not a Beth El or a Shaarey Zedek.

[cmubryan]

One city/neighborhood that no one has mentioned is Huntington Woods. This little city has a very solid Jewish population. I would bet that per capita, Huntington Woods is more jewish than any other city in Michigan. This former West Bloomfield Jew made the move here two years ago after living downtown for a few years. It is a great place to be, not because there are so many jews but because the vast majority of the residents truly care about their homes and the neighborhood. Sidewalks, streetlights, towering old trees amongst a very diverse group of homes. What more could anyone want in a neighborhood? One can walk to downtown Berkley or Royal Oak. A quick drive down Woodward is Ferndale and up Woodward to Birmingham. Midtown and Downtown Detroit is only 15 minutes away. Sure beats the heck out of my West Bloomfield neighborhood that I grew up in.

[Bham1982]

Sure beats the heck out of my West Bloomfield neighborhood that I grew up in.

Well, you have a point, but you're using different standards than most folks.

Huntington Woods has beautiful homes and a wonderful sense of community. WB does not. Except around Pontiac Trail, much of WB is pretty ugly, especially compared to neighboring Bloomfield Township, IMO.

But what you fail to mention is that Huntington Woods, comparatively, has sky-high taxes and worse schools. For standard-issue suburban families, schools and taxes are far more important than crown moldings and mature trees. This probably fueled WB growth.

But I love Huntington Woods. I'd even pay the taxes, because the services are great. I would, however, prefer a different school district.

[DetroitPole]

Interesting responses. Thanks everyone. I did a little research after reading this and discovered that aside from the young people moving out of state, a lot of the young Jewish people who remain in SE Michigan are moving back to Detroit. Some of them actually voted themselves onto the board of the Downtown Synagouge and now a "Moishe House" [[not quite sure what that entails) has opened in the E Ferry/Art Center neighborhood with the intention of recreating a young Jewish neighborhood. sounds like quite the task. worthwhile though.

Sadly, English has it spot on though. The number of Jewish young people moving to Detroit is interesting [[the local papers in particular seem to devote an absurd amount of coverage to it) but the migration pattern for these younger Jewish people is out of state. Once again we are faced with the fact that young, educated people don't want to live here. One of my best friends, who is Jewish, is leaving next month. Sadly I have more friends who have left than have stayed. I'm waiting for the number who have stayed decrease to zero.
Yet we still can't get transit together, and the governor's idea of "reform" in this state [[echoed by Nolan Finley this weekend) is lowering businesses taxes. Okay.

[luckycar]

Certainly many Jews, especially in the U.S., are of Polish heritage, but they tend to self-identify as Jewish, not Polish [[as do pretty much most Eastern European Jews), and their cultural links are with the Jewish community as a whole, rather than the Poles of the East Side and Downriver.

And the differences can be seen in the neighborhood migrations. The East Side still had a sizable Polish community well into the 80's. Heck, Warrendale still had many Poles as recently as 10 years ago, and Hamtramck still has Poles.

In contrast, Jews had pretty much vacated Detroit by the mid-70's, and the old Jewish neighborhoods, generally much more upscale that the Polish neighborhoods, were pretty much entirely black.

It's not that we are Polish,German or Russian.Eastern Europe went thru countless wars from 1600-1920.We just happened to live in the battle areas.The borders changed all the time.One day we're Lithuanian,the next day we're Polish.The next decade we have become Russians.Thru all this we stayed Jews and spoke Yiddish.

[cmubryan]

I know WB High is majority white, but I was referring to elementary schools in WB school district. I believe at least one is majority African American, which is a huge change from past years.

WB schools, as a whole are still definitely majority white, and will be for years to come.

One has to remember that the "white population" in West Bloomfield schools is also made up of Chaldean students. I graduated from WBHS in 2000 and my class racial/ethnic make-up was approximately 30% white/jewish, 30% white/non-jewish 20% chaldean, 10% black, 10% other [[Asian/Indian).

[cmubryan]

IMHO, Berkley Schools is more stable than WB schools. WB schools are changing at a faster pace from what I see. I would feel more comfortable enrolling my 5 year old in Berkely schools than in WB schools, just judging on what is going to happen to the districts over the next 12 years. If they would just cut out schools of choice in both areas, the "change" probably wouldn't happen as fast. Hopefully we won't experience the white flights that have plauged this area for so many years [[Detroit, Oak Park, Southfield,) just to name a few. I would hypothesize that North Oak Park, Berkley and Huntington Woods [[the three cities that make up the Berkley School District) will remain solid stable neighborhoods. Southern West Bloomfield is questionable and could just be another Southfield, however Orchard Lake, Keego and Northern West Bloomfield [[the section that borders White Lake/Waterford/Union Lake) seems pretty stable so West Bloomfield Schools might not change as fast as some of the former heavily Jewish districts.

[cmubryan]

Sadly, English has it spot on though. The number of Jewish young people moving to Detroit is interesting [[the local papers in particular seem to devote an absurd amount of coverage to it) but the migration pattern for these younger Jewish people is out of state. Once again we are faced with the fact that young, educated people don't want to live here. One of my best friends, who is Jewish, is leaving next month. Sadly I have more friends who have left than have stayed. I'm waiting for the number who have stayed decrease to zero.
Yet we still can't get transit together, and the governor's idea of "reform" in this state [[echoed by Nolan Finley this weekend) is lowering businesses taxes. Okay.

I second that. I am 29 and within the last 5 years the vast majority of my friends [[Jew and non-Jew) have skipped town. However, I am hopeful that the younger ones that are still here will remain here and be a lot more positive about the city than their parents.

[Bham1982]

IMHO, Berkley Schools is more stable than WB schools.

Keep in mind that much of WB actually attends Bloomfield and Birmingham schools [[Andover and Groves are heavily WB), and much of the Jewish population lives in these parts.

I attended Andover, and would not be surprised if it were more Jewish than WB High, though I have no idea how this could ever be verified.

[cmubryan]

Keep in mind that much of WB actually attends Bloomfield and Birmingham schools [[Andover and Groves are heavily WB), and much of the Jewish population lives in these parts.

I attended Andover, and would not be surprised if it were more Jewish than WB High, though I have no idea how this could ever be verified.

I believe that in 2011, you are correct. However, in the 1990s I bet it was close.

[Gistok]

It's not that we are Polish,German or Russian.Eastern Europe went thru countless wars from 1600-1920.We just happened to live in the battle areas.The borders changed all the time.One day we're Lithuanian,the next day we're Polish.The next decade we have become Russians.Thru all this we stayed Jews and spoke Yiddish.

You are spot on in your assessment luckycar. Towns and villages throughout eastern Europe were often were homogenous... be it a Jewish Stedtl, a German town, or a town of the local population.

The region my fathers family came from was part of Austria Hungary prior to WWI, and my grandmother had to learn Hungarian in addition to the German taught and spoken in her town. After the war the area was split between Rumania and Yugoslavia... so the same German towns existed, but your second language taught in school changed from Hungarian to either Rumanian or Serbian.

And most towns of eastern Europe had 2 names... often Germanic [[German or Yiddish), and local country name. For example the 3rd largest city in Rumania was known as Timisoara to the Rumanians, or Temeschvar to the Germans and Hungarians.

Even today the Polish city of Gdansk [[where Lech Walensa started the Polish labor uprising) is also known as Danzig, its' former German name.

And in some instances historical figures are obscured by these changing borders, and interwoven multi-cultural settlements. Nokolaus Copernicus the famous astronomer is claimed by both Polish and Germans as one of their own.... even though he lived in what is today Poland.

This can get very confusing....

[ghettopalmetto]

And most towns of eastern Europe had 2 names... often Germanic [[German or Yiddish), and local country name. For example the 3rd largest city in Rumania was known as Timisoara to the Rumanians, or Temeschvar to the Germans and Hungarians.

Even today the Polish city of Gdansk [[where Lech Walensa started the Polish labor uprising) is also known as Danzig, its' former German name.

And in some instances historical figures are obscured by these changing borders, and interwoven multi-cultural settlements. Nokolaus Copernicus the famous astronomer is claimed by both Polish and Germans as one of their own.... even though he lived in what is today Poland.

This can get very confusing....

But it sure makes genealogy a hoot!

Since WWII, though, many areas of Central Europe [[especially Poland) are more ethnically homogenous than they were before the War, both because of the Holocaust, and the shifting borders and forced relocations that occurred after the Nazis were defeated. For example, modern Poland is over 90% ethnically Polish, which wasn't nearly the case in 1939!

You will still hear some cities referred to by their former German names, especially in Pomerania and Silesia, although not among the locals [[see above). Not sure about other countries, but Poland uses only the Polish names for its cities and towns. The only exception I know is Auschwitz, and only then to refer to the muzeum.

These are the most famous, either due to size of the city, or historical importance:

Gdansk [[Danzig), Wroclaw [[Breslau), Lwow [[Lemberg), Torun [[Thorn), Oswiecim [[Auschwitz), Malbork [[Marienburg), Szczecin [[Stettin), Poznan [[Posen)

Here is a more complete list:

http://polandpoland.com/names_german_polish.html

[Hypestyles]

hopefully more folks of various ethnicities can find their way to urban detroit.. contributing their ideas, businesses and new developments..

[Gistok]

GP, speaking of Genealogy... I've been going thru some of my late parents documents this past week... and my mother and her family was from the Franconia region of Germany. But my father's side was Danube Swabian [[where Hungary, Rumania and Serbia borders come together). My father's ancestors came from the Rhine-Palatinate region of western Germany, although his maternal side came from Alsace [[German speaking France) and Westphalia [[north central Germany). I've got records going back to 1706. However, in Kaiserslauter Germany, they have a Germanic Genealogical Institute that has a list of German records going back even farther. As long as church records still exist [[many going back to the middle ages)... the genealogy of Germans can be traced back quite a ways. I found out that my father's family name was originally "Osten", and was Magyarized to it's current form between 1730-1800, although the bloodlines were still purely German.

One peculiarity I've found [[a likely result of the 1618-1648 30 Years War), is that German towns in eastern Europe tended to be either Catholic or Lutheran.

When many foreigners came to the USA, they often had name changes to "Americanize" their names. But this same scenario happend in eastern Europe as well in earlier centuries.

[Ocean2026]

Jews were among the freedom riders during the civil rights days. I was brought up Jewish and taught against any kind of racism unless you consider the rule about marrying outside your religion to be racist.
Jews have always been liberal in this respect, however many vote GOP based on either economics or perceptions about Israeli Policy.

I remember running for DA in an 88% Hispanic County in South Texas. I decided to walk the Washington Street which was the all Black street. True most of them didn't vote and they lived in horrid conditions. I was the subject of jokes and derision for walking that street but it wasn't from whites -it was the Hispanics. Its something people don't like to talk about and its improved somewhat but in deep South Texas Hispanics hated Blacks.

No one ever seemed to care that I was Jewish and in general in Texas people don't ask or care about ethnicity.